To ask for anyone with legal knowledge & insurance

[Kmxxx14]

In February I took our wedding insurance for my wedding in June.

It was before the coronavirus was an issue in the UK and no one was worried, but I was because I’d spent a good amount of money on my wedding.

I asked the agent on the call “if the coronavirus Becomes an issue in the UK and my wedding is cancelled, will I be covered?”

The agent was very relaxed (as most were back then) almost laughing and said yeah, yeah it’s fine.

Later in the call she said is there any reason why you’d think your wedding might be cancelled and I said just the corona virus and she said no that’s fine.

I paid the £120 fee.

4 weeks later my wedding insurer stopped all new claims but said all existing claims still remained.

I claimed the insurance for certain things that suppliers were not refunding and were unable to rearrange.

The insurer has refused to pay out as I knew about the coronavirus even though I asked several time’s on the original call.

I asked them to listen to my call and they are investigating. Do you think there is any chance they may backtrack?

I think if they do, you'd have a good chance of getting a positive result from the financial ombudsman. If you haven't already, make sure you make this as a formal complaint. The insurer has to reply to you within a certain timescale ( sorry I can't remember exactly what this is, 8 weeks is springing to my mind though). If they reject your complaint you can then appeal with the ombudsman who will review it from an independent perspective. Under TCF, all communication has to be clear and concise. Sounds like your exchange with the original customer services was clear and so no reason why you wouldn't expect this to be the case.

Yep. What the first reply says. Unless your contract wording precludes it in some way but you’d still be able to say you were misled on the call which TCF ( treating customers fairly) complaint mentioned above would still be worthwhile.

See here

www.fca.org.uk/firms/fair-treatment-customers

They clearly gave you shit advice and also the product didnt perform how you were led to expect

Definitely pursue it to the financial ombudsman if a formal complaint doesn't result in a favourable outcome for you. The FOS is generally very consumer friendly. Also your insurance company will be mindful of that, the case management fee which they have to pay as well as potential 'compensation' (not in the strict sense of the word) bring awarded.

They probably won't pay out as its not an insurance matter.

There is a doctrine in English Law called Frustration of Contract which means that if the contract cannot be fulfilled, through no fault of either party, then it is treated if the contract never existed and all money must be returned to the original owner.

It doesn't matter what the individual supplier's T&Cs say, as they are only ever allowed to add to your legal (Statutory) rights, never to take them away from you.

It is not the same as a 'cancellation', your contract is not cancelled, it has been 'frustrated through supervening illegality'

That is to say that a law has been passed since you entered into the contract, that neither of you could have foreseen, that makes its fulfilment illegal.

You need to go back to the supplier and push for a refund, it is your legal right whatever they might say to the contrary.

...to clarify, I am talking about the contract that exists between you and the supplier of the wedding-related goods/services you booked.

Thanks.

I will see what their response is before looking at the financial ombudsman route.

The suppliers are point blank refusing to refund. They will not budge no matter what I threaten.

I once had an issue when cancelling a car lease where the company categorically told me three times during a call that I didn't have to pay an excess mileage fee.

When I got the invoice it included an excess mileage fee and they argued for 10 weeks that I had to pay it.

They even ignored my formal complaint.

I escalated the complaint to the ombudsman who requested transcripts of the phone calls.

Despite it being in the t&cs that there should have been an excess mileage charge, the fact that the call handler clearly told me three times during the call there was no charge meant they didn't have a leg to stand on. The ombudsman found in my favour.

Insurance companies are regulated and have to follow a formal complaints process - make a complaint and request transcripts from the call then if necessary, escalate to their regulator.

i think this May fall under Errors & omissions. Ask foe a formal complaint to be raised.

The suppliers are point blank refusing to refund. They will not budge no matter what I threaten

In that case, you need to make a Money Claim Online

They will have to budge when a County Court orders them too.

You will have no joy with your insurers as they will (rightly) expect you to claim the money from the person who has the legal obligation to give it to you (the supplier).

The insurance industry is under a huge amount of pressure at the moment keeping up with actual claims, it's pretty unreasonable of you to push an inappropriate claim just because you see the insurer as an easier touch than the supplier.

I have a lot of experience with this kind of thing, feel free to PM me if you'd like some further help.

I once had an issue when cancelling a car lease where the company categorically told me three times during a call that I didn't have to pay an excess mileage fee

This is a completely different set of circumstances though, and in no way relevant to OP's situation.

This is a completely different set of circumstances though, and in no way relevant to OP's situation.

Erm, the bit about an organisation that is regulated by the financial ombudsman telling me something on the phone and then denying it and my case being escalated to the ombudsman is entirely relevant. Apart from one organisation being an insurer and another a lease company it's the same scenario.

Maybe read my whole post yeah?

Some people just have to take everything literally don't they?

A lot of people really seem to misunderstand what insurance is there for.

In OP's situation the contract between her and her supplier has been discharged by way of frustration due to supervening illegality. It hasn't been 'cancelled' and isn't something that can be claimed on insurance.

The supplier has a legal obligation (derived from statute and a pile of case law) to return the monies to her so of course the insurer isn't going to get involved.

Insurers are there as an absolute last port of call if, for example the wedding supplier went bust, or one of the wedding party fell ill with Covid-19 not just because its more convenient/easier for OP.

In the event that OP's wedding had been cancelled because either she, her DP or immediate family members had become unwell with Covid-19 then her insurance would totally have paid out (If it hadn't, then on the strength of the phone call, I would agree with you that she should making a claim to the Ombudsman)

They're not trying to claim that she is not insured for pandemic-related losses, just that she needs to claim the monies back from the supplier where appropriate, as it is here.

Just as an example, I was unable to go on a long booked holiday due to the pandemic. Despite having very comprehensive travel insurance which absolutely covered me for travel disruption for any reason, I am still expected to claim the cost of my flight from BA, and the cost of my accommodation directly from the hotel I had booked. (still waiting for both, but that's another story)

People really need to understand better what insurance is there to do, and its limitations.

Apart from one organisation being an insurer and another a lease company it's the same scenario

No, this is absolutely the reason why they are completely different scenarios.

@NikeDeLaSwoosh the FOS is free and has a wider discretion then the courts (where there would be an issue fee). OP should make formal complaint, if unhappy take to FOS and the still has the option if unhappy after that to go to small claims court.

the FOS is free

No, its not, the insurer will have to pay a fee if the claim is referred to the FOS irrespective of who wins.

Given that this isn't an insurance matter, do you think that's a fair and reasonable thing for OP to do in the current circumstances?

Insurers are under an enormous amount of pressure at the moment - probably worth bearing in mind that the government has invested a large chunk of our pensions in the insurance sector, so we all have an incentive not to take the piss out of them.

The fee for a MCOL is payable by the loser, which in this case is very unlikely to be OP.

They're not trying to claim that she is not insured for pandemic-related losses, just that she needs to claim the monies back from the supplier where appropriate, as it is here.

This isn’t actually what they said. In the OP I stated they said it was because I knew about the virus.

It isn’t just the suppliers deposits I claimed for. It’s things like dresses I paid for my flower girls which won’t fit them on the new date due to them growing. Personalised items etc.

@Kmxxx14 official complaint and if not happy FOS. It’s a free service for the consumer. You can still make a claim to the small claims court against each individual company (if you don’t succeed) after that, but there is a fee for each company. As you say a lot of your losses aren’t recoverable from any company in any event (hence why you took our insurance...)

Even if you hadn't known about the virus, none of these things would be covered anyway.

The suppliers deposits are unlikely to be insured for the reasons I have given.

As you already have the dresses and personalised items (I assume?) the contracts with these suppliers are also likely to fall under frustration of contract, but would come under frustration of purpose, as opposed to supervening illegality which is a harder one to argue.

Its a rubbish situation, and you have my sympathy, but the insurance route isn't going to be your friend here I'm afraid.

As I said, I'm happy to help you draft a letter to your suppliers if that would help at all?

As you say a lot of your losses aren’t recoverable from any company in any event

All losses are (technically) recoverable if a court says they are.

Please listen to what @NikeDeLaSwoosh has said. You claim back from the supplier, they claim from their insurance if they have the correct cover. You could go to the FOS but it is likely you weren't really misadvised as your cover would be for if you cancelled the wedding, for example if you became ill.