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Incorrect grammar?

32 replies

ThisHereMamaBear · 03/05/2020 19:23

Ds2 loves Monkey Puzzle by Julia Donaldson. Every night the same sentence makes me wince a bit. "I couldn't you see, none of my babies looks like me." Shouldn't it be 'look?'

OP posts:
MrsSchadenfreude · 03/05/2020 19:24

No. It’s saying “not one”.

Frozenfan2019 · 03/05/2020 19:24

Oooh I never though of this.i think it should maybe we are both wrong though as it seems so obvious that surely Julia Donaldson or her editors or someone would have picked up on it

Frozenfan2019 · 03/05/2020 19:27

@MrsSchadenfreude explains it so concisely and well. Would you say either would be correct or would "look" be wrong?

Etinox · 03/05/2020 19:28

None is 3rd person singular and should indeed be followed by the single 'looks'
They look like me, but he looks like me (or doesn't in this case)
I agree though OP it sounds clumsy and like the split infinitive is fading from use.

MrsSchadenfreude · 03/05/2020 19:28

Thank you Frozenfan. Smile

“Look” sounds completely wrong to me.

lazylinguist · 03/05/2020 19:29

Yep, 'looks' is correct even though colloquially most people would say 'look'.

ThisHereMamaBear · 03/05/2020 19:29

But if you replace 'none of my babies' with 'none of my children' you'd put 'none of my children LOOK like me', right?

OP posts:
Aunty5ocial · 03/05/2020 19:32

Nope, still 'looks'.

Clockways · 03/05/2020 19:32

'None of' can be treated like a singular (he, she it), as well as a plural, so 'looks' can be correct conjugation of the verb. If 'not one' is the meaning, as opposed to 'not any', then this is fine.

Amanduh · 03/05/2020 19:32

No.

CuckooCuckooClock · 03/05/2020 19:33

I’d still say looks

ThisHereMamaBear · 03/05/2020 19:33

Sorry, I just read your response, thanks!

Query number 2, if you don't mind! In another book, "the fire is out" the people cheer. Are the people cheering 'the fire is out, the fire is out' etc or are they saying 'the fire is out' and then cheering?

OP posts:
TheThingWithFeathers · 03/05/2020 19:35

No, because it's "none" that determines the verb ending. So it would still be "None of my children looks like me". As a previous poster said, none = not one.

lazylinguist · 03/05/2020 19:35

Nope still looks. Why would changing babies (a plural noun) with children (another plural noun) make any difference? It's the word 'none' (meaning 'not one') which requires the singular verb. Not one of my babies/ not one of my children. Same thing.

PaperDreamsHoney · 03/05/2020 19:36

None means 'not one', so it behaves the same. One looks like me, none looks like me. The "of my children" bit doesn't make a difference because the verb (looks) is agreeing with the none - you can take out the "of my children" bit and it won't change.

MrsSchadenfreude · 03/05/2020 19:36

If “The fire is out!” is in speech marks, then this is what they are saying/cheering. Otherwise it would be, The fire is out, the people cheer. So the fire has gone out and they are all saying hoorah or whatever.

PaperDreamsHoney · 03/05/2020 19:37

Query 2: I'd say it's down to punctuation! Is there a comma or a full stop?

lazylinguist · 03/05/2020 19:37

"The fire is out" is what they are cheering. As in... they are shouting it as a cheer. If it were two statements 1. The fire is out 2. The people cheer, then the first bit wouldn't be in speech marks.

Dahlietta · 03/05/2020 19:38

Ms Donaldson is correct. None is the subject and it's singular. 'Of my babies' is genitive and has no bearing on the verb. I speak like this and have had this argument with school children several times Grin

Wheresthebiffer2 · 03/05/2020 19:38

@ThisHereMamaBear
But if you replace 'none of my babies' with 'none of my children' you'd put 'none of my children LOOK like me', right?

I think you are correct, but it is because "children" is a plural noun. ??? Whereas babies is baby+ s ????

Nope, I'm still confused.

Clockways · 03/05/2020 19:38

If, "The people cheer." has a capital letter and a full stop, then it's a sentence in its own right.

If the punctuation is actually inside the speech marks, then those spoken words are being described as being 'cheered'.

It's highly unlikely to have been printed exactly as you wrote the example.

lazylinguist · 03/05/2020 19:40

Wheresthebiffer2 - babies and children are both plural nouns. Babies is the plural of baby and children is the plural of child.

Clockways · 03/05/2020 19:41

@PaperDreamsHoney
you can take out the "of my children" bit and it won't change.

You are right with the whole answer, but actually 'none of' is the determiner (not just 'none') and this is how we know he rules.

Wheresthebiffer2 · 03/05/2020 19:41

Btw I love that lockdown has made you questioning the grammar in these well-thumbed storybooks :-p

Clockways · 03/05/2020 19:43

@MrsSchadenfreude

Otherwise it would be, The fire is out, the people cheer.

No. This would be a comma splice. If you have two separate sentences, there will be a full stop. If you think they are closely related enough, you could use a semi-colon. A comma is never used to connect two separate simple sentences.

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