To think this school's plan won't work

[Poppi89]

I work in a secondary school ( not as a teacher) and we have been kept up to date by email and zoom staff meetings.

There has been a lot of talk of when we will re-open and what will happen as like most schools it was very stressful closing the school and not being prepared so they are trying to put plans in place and keep one step ahead.

Due to a lot of parents in the area wanting the school to re-open and for life to go back to 'normal' they think the government might re-open schools sooner rather than later maybe before May half term, so the school has put in place an outline of what will happen:

• School will re-open but will continue sticking to the guidelines of social distancing - as this is not possible in a school with full capacity students will be split into halves or thirds to ensure they are spaced far enough away from each other. This means that the kids will only be in 1/2 days a week.

• Due to adults spreading the virus more than children (it seems) they don't think all staff should be in each day. So will be depending on parents to do a rota system - so one qualified member of staff to 2 parents to supervise.

Does anybody else think the school would be better to remain closed if this is the case?
It seems they won't be learning much and the risk of getting the virus will still be high.

I do get that this is the best plan they have come up with to keep everyone happy. My DD is missing her friends and wouldn't mind going back to school a couple of days a week and I guess it will be easier for parents to get back to work but I would rather wait until June/July at the earliest as surely the NHS is still overwhelmed.

What do you guys think?
AIBU - thinking this isn't a good plan

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It is so very complicated, and really the government need to be issuing guidelines as soon as they can, because I think it will be yet another logistical nightmare thrown at schools with no notice otherwise.

I mean, you could open up the year groups gradually - starting with the very youngest since they are at least risk. However, there is not a hope in hell of getting even three 5 year olds in a room to practice social distancing with themselves OR with the teacher. I guess, though, if you split the class into 3 groups and put them in different rooms and keep them totally away from the children in the other rooms it would be a form of "bubble" social distancing. But it would take more rooms - so either you move them into different classrooms or you only have them in 1 in 3 days. The 1 in 3 days would be fine for the very youngest children, but it wouldn't help parents get back to work at all.

I have a vision of maximum class sizes of 10 for primary children, Foundation and KS1 children take over the current primary schools.

KS2 children are sent to use the classrooms in the secondary schools.

KS3 children are sent to new Education Facilities - we can call them the Nightingale Schools - made of subdividing large stadia and conference facilities. The can be taught in classes of 20, as the rooms can be designed to allow children to be sufficiently spread out.

KS4 and KS5 children are given laptops and broadband dongles and taught online. Lessons will be taught by teams of teachers throughout the LEA. One teacher will record the lesson content which all children studying that subject at GCSE or A level (as appropriate) will view. A number of other teachers will be available on web chat to help children with specific queries and to mark the work for that subject. Practical lessons will be taught on site at sixth form colleges, on a rota basis.

Obviously we will need more teachers - I suppose it will be necessary to draft pretty much all supply teachers, Maybe also having trainee teachers, HLTAs etc.

It would work. It won't happen, because teachers and money, but it would work.

Obviously there are wrinkles that need to be ironed out.

@Poppi89

we do have quite a few older or pregnant staff.

But pregnancy isn't a condition on the shielding list. Neither is being "older".

If half the kids are in at a time, won't the other half need to continue the remote learning? (for the schools that are taking it seriously). This doesn't add up.

I think that's my main reason why schools shouldn't open - because social distancing would be impossible! It is also things like the canteen and toilets they will all be touching surfaces too.

@oakmaiden how would we get them to these new venues?

My best friend works in a primary school and is still going in and she said they try and put in social distancing and extra handwashing but it is so difficult and they think nothing of sneezing and coughing everywhere. I genuinely don't know how primaries and nurseries cope!

*Poppi89

Please RTFT before asking the same questions.

It definitely appears that some people are getting annoyed on this thread in case they need to volunteer themselves - which is quite sad actually.*

Or you know, they could be keyworkers. The kind that exist who can work from home. Who are choosing to not take up spaces in difficult to provide childcare in schools.

How about you answer a question?

What exactly are the volunteers needed for for an age group where you need one adult in a room?

Not wanting to volunteer at your own child's secondary school is unfair?

Chances are that the parents would have to give up their jobs to go and supervise children who don't need supervising if they are left at home.

I just can't wait to be back in my tiny classroom with 33 kids and no face mask, gloves and hand gel. I am so lucky to be on full pay. I am so happy that children are just spreading the disease and are unlikely to die from it. This is hugely comforting to me as a 55 year old with 3 elderly relatives who I am helping to shield by doing their shopping

I hope I didn't offend you with my 'full pay' comment, that was specific to something op said.

I don't know what the answer is to be honest, I honestly don't know how schools can safely return. I don't know how schools could facilitate small enough groups to make it safe.

I would hope PPE would be provided.

The answer however is not to send parents in to do the jobs of school staff so that school staff can safely stay at home. Would op even want me in her classroom, given that I work with covid positive patients? I have saw several teachers on here say they don't want to be mixing with keyworkers children, would they want to mix with me? Obviously the answer is to find a way to make it safe for staff, if that cannot happen then schools don't go back. Putting parents at risk instead is certainly not the answer!

Um. That is one of the wrinkles.

Obviously primary children isn't a huge problem, as they will be placed at either their normal school or their local secondary. KS4 and 5 also not a problem, as they are still at home.

So KS3 and KS2 children whose local comp is too far to walk and don't have access to cars would have to use appropriately distanced buses. So the bus would have vastly reduced capacity, which means we would need more of them.

But there are enough large venues around that we could probably find enough to use that are reasonably local to people.

The reason not all staff will be in is because 1. there are a lot of people shielding or live with people shielding, older, pregnant etc.

@JemimaPuddleCat - I included those in my original list. They were not at work for the last 2 weeks due to the government guidelines as they were classed as more at risk. I don't know if the guidelines have changed now and they are not high risk but the staff meeting just said due to staff shielding so I am not sure if they were included but I assumed they were.

My best friend works in a primary school and is still going in and she said they try and put in social distancing and extra handwashing but it is so difficult and they think nothing of sneezing and coughing everywhere. I genuinely don't know how primaries and nurseries cope

Really? So coughing and sneezing kids are accepted in to school? How unusual Our school have a very low threshold for sending kids home which I think is fair and they are spending most of the day outside to reduce the risk. The teachers are saying social distancing is working very well, but then we had to apply for a 'keyworker' place and they were very particular that both parents have to be keyworkers with preference given to hospital staff (we are UK but not England, so the rules may differ). The most there in one day is 6.

@Poppi89

What exactly are the volunteers needed for in an age group where you need one adult in a room?

@2ndStar - as I said up thread - many school staff do not have sole charge of a class - they are not trained and probably wouldn't feel confident enough to be in charge of a whole class for an entire lesson so another adult would be there to help supervise. As I have said these people won't be teaching but will be only supervising. There is also break time duties, road crossing duties and canteen supervisors which will probably be asked first but many of these are elderly so it would need to be covered by other people.

As I have said many times before. I did not come up with this potential plan. I do not agree with this plan. And I do not know the ins and outs of this plan. It was spoken about in a staff meeting as a potential solution to a massive problem, with the school trying to form some sort of plan so the staff have time to put things in place.

My comment was not directed at anyone - just an observation. I am in work on a rota. We have 6 students in. They are not able to keep 2m apart despite repeated reminders. My anxiety is through the roof. No imagine that with a class of 33? I am in awe of supermarket workers, post men and women dleivery drivers, and of course health workers. We could not survive without them But in the main they are dealing with adults who can follow (to a degree) instructions. Children can't or wan't. there is no way I can feel safe in a class of over 30. I have my own husband, my own children. I don't want to put them at risk because other people's children can't or won't keep their distnce. Before lockdown I was coughed on, on purpose, by other people's children who thought that was funny. I am not prepared to put myself infrony of such students again.

Any SLT trying to make plans are idiots.

No one knows what the government will say. Why try and second guess? You're just wasting time. Wait for the announcement and then plan.

sorry - typos!!!

@PrivateD00r - seriously? Surely you can't help a child sneezing! What do they do if one sneezes?

I was working in reception a few years ago and one kid wiped their nose with their palm and then wiped it in my trouser leg! The older ones are usually more hygienic.

Hercwasonaroll That was exactly our HT's approach before lockdown. She said it was looking likely we would close, and to be having a think about what sort of work we could set remotely, but not to spend hours on it, in case it didn't happen. Be flexible, so those ideas could be moved to a later date, if necessary.
Planning in detail for re-opening is probably a waste of time at this moment in time.

I know a few parents who would gleefully volunteer in school just so they could have a good nosey at other children's educational attainment, behaviour problems, and mental health needs.

I am thinking of one in particular, and if she was volunteering, I actually wouldn't send my child. She used to line all the kids up she had invited for a Friday playdate and interrogate them on how they had done in their Friday test.

@Phineyj - they have not said ( I assume so) but that is why they are discussing it now so teachers have time to plan and prepare for these things.

I don't know why people are shocked that school's are trying to be proactive and come up with strategies to help relieve the pressure on teachers and parents.

Schools will open when the Government say so, not the parents or anyone else.

I’d be very happy if the schools went back to a reduced timetable. I could fill in the gaps.

noideaatallreally that is disgusting. I am sorry you went through that and are suffering such anxiety right now. It is a worrying and stressful time for most at the minute I think. I do worry too about bringing this thing home but I have accepted it is out of my hands. However just because I have to work in close proximity to infected patients, doesn't mean I think others should be put at risk unnecessarily.

I don't think schools should rush back, it is thought to be Sept at the earliest in my area and I fully support that.

But maybe I am being a hypocrite since mine are attending 2 days a week currently! They just play there though and do absolutely no work, so they aren't at an advantage as much.