To think this school's plan won't work

[Poppi89]

I work in a secondary school ( not as a teacher) and we have been kept up to date by email and zoom staff meetings.

There has been a lot of talk of when we will re-open and what will happen as like most schools it was very stressful closing the school and not being prepared so they are trying to put plans in place and keep one step ahead.

Due to a lot of parents in the area wanting the school to re-open and for life to go back to 'normal' they think the government might re-open schools sooner rather than later maybe before May half term, so the school has put in place an outline of what will happen:

• School will re-open but will continue sticking to the guidelines of social distancing - as this is not possible in a school with full capacity students will be split into halves or thirds to ensure they are spaced far enough away from each other. This means that the kids will only be in 1/2 days a week.

• Due to adults spreading the virus more than children (it seems) they don't think all staff should be in each day. So will be depending on parents to do a rota system - so one qualified member of staff to 2 parents to supervise.

Does anybody else think the school would be better to remain closed if this is the case?
It seems they won't be learning much and the risk of getting the virus will still be high.

I do get that this is the best plan they have come up with to keep everyone happy. My DD is missing her friends and wouldn't mind going back to school a couple of days a week and I guess it will be easier for parents to get back to work but I would rather wait until June/July at the earliest as surely the NHS is still overwhelmed.

What do you guys think?
AIBU - thinking this isn't a good plan

Poppi89 - I can reassure you that absolutely no one on this thread believes that you have personal responsibility for decision making, or input into planning for school reopening.

@QuixoticQuokka - as I have said multiple times - this would be put in place if social distancing was still a thing - work will social distance too meaning the parents won't be in work full time but the school's being re-opened will mean they can go back a couple of days. No-one will ever get forced to volunteer - they will probably ask who and what availability people have and see how feasible it would be. I don't even think it would be full days.

I am sometimes put on road crossing duty if other staff can't do it. I don't get paid extra and only do either mornings or after school for around 30mins no more than once a week. So if you live near the school and can spare 30mins in the morning then they might ask you to do that. If not they are not going to force you to.

@2ndStar - I am not asking for anyones details. I know SAHP who on the face of it have loads of free time but they have a sick child meaning it is impossible for them to have a job as they would need so much time off

Ah so you can excuse them because you know their circumstances. My point is that you do not know the information about everyone else, but you are criticising people, and had a particular pop at me for not volunteering. Even though you have no idea whether I do or don’t.

Sorry for the @ it annoys me when people start a thread and only acknowledge certain posts that they agree with so I was trying to show I was listening and answering everyone. I won't do that from now on - thanks for telling me.

Many posters have said it is MY plan and I have repeated myself over and over that it is not my plan and I am sick of defending something that wasn't my idea.

I welcome people who had genuine questions on how it would work etc - I can't answer them as I have said I honestly don't know but it is something I can put forward.

For those thinking it should not be deleted please go back and read through my posts and see how many times I have had to repeat/defend myself from people who have not RTFT.

I don't think many posters haven't said it is "your" plan as in dreamt up by poppi89 - they have been referring to 'your' plan in the sense of 'your SLTs' madcap ideas'.

you can bold people's names so they know who you're answering rather than @.

that was an erroneous "haven't" - should have been 'I don't think many posters have said it is your plan....

work will social distance too meaning the parents won't be in work full time Really? Mine doesn't, it's impossible, I still have to go. I'm sure many workplaces are the same. We have some 2m distanced tape on the floor in case we are inspected. I've been there full time except for when I was lucky enough to catch the virus and get some time off.

@Poppi89 it would be those already working in the school who have DBS checks but aren't teachers. Or to help with break time duties or road crossings etc. They definitely wouldn't be expected to teach or anything

Most school contracts include the phrase 'other duties as assigned by SLT' or words to that effect. Our admin/pastoral/it staff already ABSOLUTELY step up to supervise breaks, after school duties etc as part of their normal pre-covid duties. Why on earth would they not do this when we go back? Unions would uprise if they ask non-teaching staff en masse to teach (though I am aware it does happen all too often), getting non DBS volunteers in schools isn't really going to work in any scenario

myrtleWilson - thank you. I will do this instead.

I do understand that some people have said my plan as it the one I am talking about. But some have accused me of making it up so it would be MY plan and others have asked me how I think this is going to happen when XYZ thinking that I have had some input on the plan.

Other posters have said their schools are doing similar things regarding half days or only going in 1/2 days and no-one has said they are lying but I am lying because I said that they have said if they don't have enough staff they are thinking of asking parents to volunteer.

Stronger76 - they did not say the ins and outs of this plan (I doubt they know themselves). But they said due to the lack of staff... so I am guessing they have worked out the ratio of not at-risk staff to the number of pupils and are trying to think of a solution so the school can re-open allowing people to start going back to work, whilst still remaining socially distant.

I do not think any teaching will be happening. Like now teachers will set then work and then people will just cover the lessons. Before we broke up me and another member of staff (both non-teachers) covered a lesson as there was not enough staff. But I was there only supervising I wouldn't know where to begin if I had to teach them.

QuixoticQuokka - I have a couple of friends going in 5 days a week but all my family are only in 1/2 days so they are still getting paid full time but can't be in full-time as they cannot social distance properly as there are too many people in. And everyone else I know is working from home or furloughed.

I think when posters are asking "how is this going to happen" - they're pointing out the gaps in the plan not asking you to outline your mobilisation efforts.

Generally, I think you're reading the thread not as a discussion about the plan (its efficacy etc) but as an attack on you, hence you are interpreting people questioning why a school would devise a plan to open dependent on securing parent volunteers as you lying it was said in the meeting - I don't read it like that.

@Poppi89 you have stated that people are horrified at the idea of volunteering.
I am working. Social distancing makes no difference to my job.

I will be continuing to work whether my kids are at school or not. My employer will not pay me to go to school to supervise children.

Why don't you understand that most people aren't anti-volunteering- they can't.

@Poppi89I do not think any teaching will be happening

Then schools opening, in any useful purposeful way, will be delayed until teaching can happen. By teachers. No unqualified non-DBS volunteers.

I'm glad I'm not the one in government who's neck is on the line to make this decision. Needless to say, schools will go back, when it is safe and productive to do so.

Anyone who is speculating any more seriously than 'what about if...' is wasting their time. What you and your colleagues think is of little importance. You should not be expected to babysit a class if your role in a school is non-teaching/HLTA (though it does happen, I know) unless in dire energencies. Nobody should be planning to use back office staff in this way, and in your place I'd be speaking to my union before engaging in any more discussion with SLT about it.

Some people have said outright that I am lying, I should be reported for starting a fake thread and if anyone believes me they're gullible. And I am getting defensive as people have said eg school's can't force you to volunteer - when I've said the whole time no-one will be forced.

Maybe I have taken some questions as personal attacks - so I do apologise if that is the case. I am just getting fed up with having to repeat myself as people haven't read my OP.

I have said I am shocked at people's views on volunteering as when I started the thread I thought some would agree with me (that they think its a bad plan) and some would disagree with me (that they think its a good plan).
But the majority of people have only spoken about the volunteering side (not worrying about the spread of the virus). Meaning the volunteering is more of an important factor for them than actually the kids going back when there is not enough staff - to me that comes across as selfish.

I have never said I believe these parents will be forced to volunteer.
I assume like with primary schools they ask your availability. If you cannot do it - then you won't. With over 1000 pupils in the school, even 1/4 of volunteers would mean 250+ = 50+ parents in each day -which definitely wouldn't be needed.

@Poppi89 So if you live near the school and can spare 30mins in the morning then they might ask you to do that (school crossing patrol)

No. No they won't. Parent volunteers will not be asked to supervise children across a road without training, insurance, safeguarding and (assuming unsupervised otherwise, again, what's the point) a DBS.

The school would be completely liable for any accident that happened. Even the most desperate-for-extra-hands school will not set themselves up for breaching h+s and safeguarding procedures like this.

I need to step away from this thread.

Stronger76 - I personally don't think the schools should re-open fully unless it's for educational purposes. But there have been calls for them to re-open to save the economy. And there are already less restrictive rules in lockdown and I've read that fast food places etc are starting to open up so I think they are looking at these things and working out what's the maximum amount of pupils they can have in at one time etc. - simply to have more control over the situation when it happens.

I will say I don't think there's any point making plans. But I think that the head maybe feels the staff are looking to her to know she has a plan in place or is working towards one so they feel better supported.

Stronger76 - as I said I have helped them cross the roads and I am not trained. I have also volunteered in school's without a DBS check. I am not lying I am giving my personal experience.

As I have said this is my reason for wanting to delete the thread as those giving their opinions are also implying that I am lying - so what's the point.

Those who do not believe me - start a new thread asking how to become a teacher and I guarantee people will say get some work experience in schools/ volunteer at your DCs school, brownies etc. It's only when you start your teacher training course that you need to apply for a DBS check.

Those who do not believe me - start a new thread asking how to become a teacher and I guarantee people will say get some work experience in schools/ volunteer at your DCs school, brownies etc. It's only when you start your teacher training course that you need to apply for a DBS check.

You do need a DBS check for them.

Anyone who does not have a DBS is not allowed to be alone with children in a school. They must be supervised by a member of staff who has a DBS.

If a school provided a person for crossing duties that would fall under the same rules.

If there was an informal parents group that took turns to cross kids that is nothing to do with school and a DBS is not relevant.

If anyone has been volunteering in school without a DBS and has been left unsupervised with children that’s a safe guarding issue.

www.safeguardinginschools.co.uk/do-volunteers-in-school-need-an-enhanced-dbs-check/

@Poppi89 I have helped them cross the roads and I am not trained. I have also volunteered in school's without a DBS check

You can do it in your own school as you will be insured. You should NEVER have been asked to do this sort of thing as a volunteer, and if so you should have refused. I do believe what you're saying, but there really is ZERO point in speculating.

I've done way more than my fair share of volunteering in schools, but what you're outlining is so far beyond the scope of a parent volunteer responsibility its scary to think your SLT are condidering it.

• To re-state some of my points:

• I have said when parents have volunteered in my DDs primary school they didn't need a DBS check. Nor did my mum in hers or her cousins' schools.

• I have said you can be in a school without a DBS check as long as you are with someone who has a DBS check ( People asked why would a teacher need a parent helper and I said it wouldn't be a teacher).

• You do not need a DBS check to have work experience in a school. I didn't and my friend didn't. I applied for mine after I was successful for the interview and my friend applied for hers once she had got a place on a PGCE course.

• I do not know what parents will be expected to do other than 'supervise' as I have said many, many times they will be there to supervise and definitely not teach.

-They will also not be forced against their will to volunteer. I would quit my job if this was the case - it is not a world war.

• I have given my experiences as someone who now has a DBS check and from when I didn't as so many people are accusing me of making things up so I am giving examples of the things I am saying for 'proof'.

• I am not saying none of you know what you are talking about apart from me, I have simply said what my school told me and trying to answer questions with my own experience. Eg. when someone said I was lying as a school would never have a parent volunteer in - I gave the example of my DDs primary school who used to ask for volunteers all the time.

• If you still think I am lying then that is fair enough and you do not need to post anything until I delete the post.

• Once again, thank you for those who are actually putting forward good information/advice - I am genuinely taking it on board even if it doesn't sound like it when I am being defensive

OP - you can't delete the post. You can only request a deletion but MNHQ will assess whether the post meets requirements for deletion. You can step away from the thread.