To not understand why parents would volunteer their young children for testing

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I got a big pack of information through the post a couple of weeks ago on a clinical trial for young children. They want to test immunity to vaccinations including testing for existing immunity to Covid 19. But they dont think the Covid 19 test is accurate enough to tell the parents the results. So you are putting your child through painful blood tests just for travel expenses and the fluffy feeling of benefiting the greater good of furthering medical research. My children are 6 and 8 so couldn't consent to this trial in any way. I dont get why any parent would agree to this.

I would absolutely allow blood samples
to be taken. Regardless of finding out the result. The blood is being used for the greater good of the human race. We would be screwed if we all thought like you

@Aveisenim my GP is a research practise so they send these out on behalf of the large local hospital to anyone that fits the criteria. I think it's the first time I've ever received anything though.

I think it’s fantastic that there are children out there willing to do this for everyone’s children. I know my dd wouldn’t as it could trigger her medical condition.

I think you are so wound up about needles that you have transmitted your phobia to your DCs. So much pain folowing a jab that you considered not taking them for the second dose? Sorry, they have picked up on your anxiety.
Could someone else take them if they need anything in the future?

A blood draw on a child isn’t easy so I wouldn’t subject a child to one without some direct benefit to the child.

@PurpleArtichoke
My 5 year olds phlebotomist draws 5 vials from him in seconds!

You're doing children a disservice to declare they can't make informed consent at 6 & 8. Of course they can, it's just a bloody blood test. 🙄. Yes of course I'd ask my children to take part.

Your kids are really going to struggle if God forbid they get ill, now or in the future.

Lots of people need jabs

Pressed go to soon

Lots of people need jabs and blood taken etc especially as they get older, if you have transmitted this fear you are doing them no favours.

No one likes this stuff but it's a fact of life if you are lucky enough to live somewhere with accessible healthcare.

It depends on the child.. I bleed children as part of my job and some are absolutely not fussed, some are terrified. Theres also numbing agents used so majority of the time, if the cream is used properly, the child wont feel anything. My dd had bloods when she was 7, had the numbing cream, was absolutely fascinated and didnt feel a thing. I know she would be happy to do it, shes 9 and if she was happy to go ahead I would consent for her to do it. So if it's for the greater good and the child is ok with it then why would you not help at a time like this?

The fluffy feeling of furthering medical research???? Jeez OP. I presume you don't have a child with an illness or condition then?

I'm another one whose child loses blood as a result of testing required for a chronic condition. Blood tests aren't pleasant but are necessary for so many reasons whether to monitor a condition or work to try to find a solution to help.

The same child also needed blood transfusions as a baby so won't be able to donate blood as an adult and pay it forward. I hate needles too but I grit my teeth and give blood regularly on his behalf because it's the right thing to do for others, and quite frankly I owe it to him to show my gratitude to the the stranger who had blood taken out of their arm to help him.

Imagine everyone decided not to give blood because it hurts getting the needle in? What would happen to prem babies, cancer patients, people with catastrophic injuries?

So have a think again and imagine every parent agreed with you and no children's blood was ever used for studies. Consider why some parents would gladly allow their children to have blood tests taken to help others.

How would medical research into illnesses and conditions affecting children ever move forward otherwise?

Yeah, the phrase "fluffy feeling" is weirdly aggressive - it sounds like you think helping the health service BATTLE A GLOBAL PANDEMIC could only be either virtue signalling or misplaced hippy nonsense.

You seem defensive - clearly you wouldn't even think about letting your kids participate, so you're convinced that everyone who would can only be a showoff or an idiot?

My eldest took part in a trial when he was under 1. They were testing to see if a particular childhood vaccine needed as many boosters as we're typically given. Turns out they don't!
He did have a few blood tests. We were given numbing gel I put on an hour beforehand and he didn't feel a thing! I tried a bit on myself and it really works. He wasn't at all distressed, I'd have withdrawn him if he had been.
Now he's 9 he probably would find it difficult.

Meh. I had blood tests every other week from the age of about five. No freezing sprays back then. Or specialists in Paediatric Phlebotomy. For the kids who are needing blood tests anyway, it's no hassle to take another phial. And when they don't, it's not that big a deal anyhow (probably useful to get them accustomed to the procedure for the future anyhow).

Mind you, I wasn't the type of kid that had the screaming adabs over vaccinations, either. I was shocked one year at work when I saw the setup for the HPV vaccinations - the school staff had laid out PE mats and blankets for the numbers who would 'faint' from the sheer agony of a tiny needle in their arm - apparently, once one went down, everybody behind that one would follow. It's a fashion. Nobody gave a fuck about having the things in the 70s and 80s apart from the one or two 'delicate' children and mad antivaxxer parents like my FIL .

A small child is capable of saying yes to a blood test. They might not be able to quiz you about funding and the declared interests, but they can say OK to doing it to help doctors to find out ways of making sure other children don't get sick. By the time I was six, I'd probably be asking what diseases, haven't they been vaccinated and lecturing Phlebotomists on the correct gauge needle and showing them the most productive (and least painful) spot to get blood from.

If you're all flappy over vaccinations as per your post about not being sure if your kids would have the second one, you're not the type of parent they want to hear from, so just chuck the information in the bin and leave altruism to others.

I think it’s hypocritical that you recently had your children vaccinated and are then dismissive of parents of children who contribute to scientific research so that your children can get vaccinated.

I dont think they love them enough. But im grateful because we will benefit from their lack of emotional connection.

I volunteered my then three-year old for a vaccine trial for diphtheria and polio years ago. The reason I did was because I had seen my father suffer for decades with the after-effects of polio.

The trial was carried out very carefully, with full disclosure. She actually loved the nurses coming round to the house and playing with her and making a fuss of her. We volunteered for years.

Both my DC (aged 9 and 11) have had blood tests so would both be able to give informed consent to this.

DD wouldn’t as she hates needles, but I’m pretty sure DS would love to do something like this.

I am needle phobic so kind of understand why you might have a strong reaction to the idea. However for a healthy and well hydrated child having blood taken by an experienced phlebotomist should not be an unpleasant experience. Most children will need blood taken at some point, so it’s not a bad idea to get them used to the experience.

With my daughter it helped ignite an interest in medicine and she's now finishing her third year at med. school.

Any vaccine will need to be tested on children to ensure it is safe for them. Even if it's not, the first batch of children to get it will be guinea pigs anyway.

It's only a blood test, don't be so dramatic.

DS1 wouldn't agree to it so that would be fine with me. DS2 has had hundreds of blood tests, cannulas and portacath accesses ( he's had chemotherapy) so wouldn't bat an eyelid. I think it's a good idea if the child is in agreement

Thus initiative is nothing whatsoever to do with the BATTLE against the GLOBAL PANDEMIC (to use the capitalisation above)

If anyone does want to know what it is all,about, there is info here:

whatsthestory.web.ox.ac.uk

You do sound rather dramatic. Both in your disgust at parents allowing their children to take part in a simple procedure to help influence future medical advances and your consideration of not giving a vaccine because it hurts!

Ds is 10 and has for many years now been able to give consent within his ability for procedures he needs. Because both me and his medical team ensure things are well explained to him.

DS2 has type 1diabetes and had to have finger prick tests several times a day from the age of six. He accepted it matter of factly as part of life.

He's 24 now and is part of a research group of highly motivated young diabetics who trial new technology. He currently has an implant he can scan with his phone to get a blood glucose reading.

Taking part in medical trials is a good thing to do. It's public spirited. It helps the wider community and it can - as with the implant - help you.