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Original poster

My brother’s court case in Scotland

96 replies

Saladmakesmesad · 21/04/2020 12:49

Posting for traffic. V difficult situation so please be kind. 😢

My brother has been charged with a very serious crime in Scotland. Arrested in July last year. My family are trying to hush it all up and minimise it. I found out from regularly checking the court rolls that he appeared in court yesterday. As I understand it, this will have been to finalise the charges following the investigation. He will have pleaded guilty and I think there will be another hearing now for sentencing.

My question is - how do I find out what he’s been charged with exactly and what he is sentenced to? Remember that it’s Scotland so different to England (where I am). It hasn’t hit the press as far as I can find out, but might.

Thanks for any help. Sorry if I sound cold, I’m very distressed and trying to get facts so I can move forward.

OP posts:
GottenGottenGotten · 21/04/2020 12:54

Are there any local (to him) press that regularly attend court hearings? If so, they might know what is going on, even if they don't report on it. Assuming it was a public hearing.

Otherwise I'm not sure. I was watching a case about a neighbour last year, and very little appeared in the press until she was sentenced, so it might come out after that.

Alternatively, surah to your fault and say that you have heard he is being tried for (murder, child abuse, something heinous) and hope that they are shocked enough to tell you what it is actually all about.

GottenGottenGotten · 21/04/2020 12:55

Typos galore! The last paragraph should say speak to your family

LouiseTrees · 21/04/2020 12:56

Which court would he have appeared at? It’s slightly different for each one.

TheWernethWife · 21/04/2020 13:00

You can check Sheriffs Courts to find out hearings.

maggiecate · 21/04/2020 13:27

Local newspaper of the town where he lives might be your best bet - they generally cover the courts

Meggie2008 · 21/04/2020 13:36

Try the local papers for his area. I know my town has a section for the courts for that week.

Bridecilla · 21/04/2020 13:38

Local news. Our local Echo has a 'court roundup'

Can't you just ask him / family though??

FairfaxAikman · 21/04/2020 13:40

Hi OP,

I'm a court reporter in Scotland.

Was it sheriff court or high court?

I'm not sure what you can access as a member of the public but your best bet is to contact the clerk's office at the court he appeared in.

The purpose of yesterday's hearing would depend on which type of court it was and, if in the sheriff courts, if the matter was on the path for solemn procedure (would have gone before a jury) or summary (sheriff only).

Original poster
Saladmakesmesad · 21/04/2020 13:43

I’m keeping an eye on local papers but I think reporters might not be attending court due to the virus.

It’s a Sheriff court. I have a reference number from the website from him attending court yesterday. Is there no way to just apply for the information? If I phoned the court would they tell me? I acted as a juror once and was able to phone to find out the sentence from a case reference number though in that case I didn’t as it hit the press during sentencing.

Family won’t engage - and I know what it is in general but not the details. I feel I need these for the future because my family are trying to sweep it under the rug and already saying I’m unforgiving, don’t really understand etc.

OP posts:
Original poster
Saladmakesmesad · 21/04/2020 13:45

Thank you @FairfaxAikman for your very helpful input. Are reporters still attending court during the virus outbreak? I don’t know if they’re allowed.

It was a sheriff court and I don’t know but have been led to understand there won’t be a jury as he’s pleading guilty.

OP posts:
Nicolanomore24 · 21/04/2020 13:52

What city is the court in? Local press might cover it. If it’s a sexual crime you could maybe find out through Sarah’s law if he will potentially have access to your children (I have no idea if that is doable just a suggestion)

FairfaxAikman · 21/04/2020 13:52

I'm a staffer, so I haven't been attending as I've been seconded elsewhere in the company but some of the freelance reporters still seem to be attending.

We have access to a media centre where we get to know which section of law the accused is up for (for cases up to seven days in the future), but can't see the full charge unless we get the papers from the clerk.

As I say I know what I am allowed to do as a reporter but I've been doing this so long I've completely forgotten what the public has access to.

FairfaxAikman · 21/04/2020 13:54

Ping me a PM. If I can help I will. It may be that the local press hasn't printed anything on it (for whatever reason) but the reporter has it in their notebook.

Worst case scenario you can tip them off that it might be worth covering the sentencing.

izzadogslife · 21/04/2020 14:02

Possession of illegal pornography, carries a far more serious conviction in Scotland than England - he could be given a prison sentence for something that your family are treating as a minor crime.

UnspeakableBode · 21/04/2020 14:04

I live in Glasgow. There is a grassroots magazine who report all court proceedings called the digger I think they cover Glasgow and the surrounding area. Its basically a coupke of people who attend all hearings. Notnsure ifnthey are doing so under the current restrictions but if it in Glasgow area it might be worth calling them to see ifnthey can shed any light.

charlestonchaplin · 21/04/2020 14:09

This sounds really unpleasant. The crime is nothing to do with you and is already being dealt with by the criminal justice system. While it is human nature to be curious, the depths to which you are digging and the undertone of your messages troubles me. Is it any surprise that your family isn’t broadcasting the alleged offence from the rooftops? What would that achieve? In any case it seems you already know enough details to make a decision about whether you wish to continue to engage with your brother or not. There seems to be some dodgy family politics afoot.

FairfaxAikman · 21/04/2020 14:14

It was a sheriff court and I don’t know but have been led to understand there won’t be a jury as he’s pleading guilty.

Missed this bit. While there won't be a trial if he's pled guilty, that wouldn't change whether the case was meant to be heard under solemn or summary. I just mentioned the jury to demonstrate the difference between the two.

ColdToesHere · 21/04/2020 14:14

The crime may be nothing to do with her, but it may affect her.
If the family member was charged with some sort of child pornography charge, and her family are minimising it, she may want to know to protect her children.
Or something along those lines.
If it’s public knowledge which she is allowed to access, then she is entitled to know.

charlestonchaplin · 21/04/2020 14:19

She knows enough. It is clear she knows enough to make any decisions about whether to withdraw from a relationship with her brother. She just wants to know all the gory details.

FairfaxAikman · 21/04/2020 14:24

Chaplin we have an open justice system in this country - if the OP was red "all the gory details" she was quite welcome to sit in court to hear them.

Speaking from experience the charge does not always reflect the full detail of the crime - that only becomes apparent in the narrative/trial.

YgritteSnow · 21/04/2020 14:24

She knows enough. It is clear she knows enough to make any decisions about whether to withdraw from a relationship with her brother. She just wants to know all the gory details.

She doesn't feel she knows enough and that's not for you, some random on MN, to decide. I'd want to know too. Most people would. The family are already hushing it up and telling her off for being unforgiving and not understanding. How can she do either of these things without being fully informed? How can she know how to progress her own relationship and that of her children without the details and she clearly cannot trust her family to tell the truth. I simply don't believe anyone would not want to know more and be fully informed of the crime of a close family member, especially if it was of a violent and/or sexual nature.

izzadogslife · 21/04/2020 14:24

@Saladmakesmesad is trying to make decisions for her own family and just wants to know about a process that she has no knowledge of, I really don't think the "gory details" are what she really wants.

Original poster
Saladmakesmesad · 21/04/2020 14:25

Thanks for all the advice, including some bits I’m going to follow up now.

I’m not going to go into why I need the information or who I’m trying to protect. It’s definitely not a situation I ever wanted to be in.

On a separate note, it’s a little bit alarming how easy it is to hush up things like this. If there’s no custodial sentence - and even if there is, if it’s a shortish one - most people who know him will never know. His wife, for example, doesn’t know what he’s charged with and doesn’t know he was in court yesterday.

OP posts:
izzadogslife · 21/04/2020 14:30

His wife is not being honest. As part of his risk assessment, prior to sentencing, his next of kin will have been contacted by social services.

Original poster
Saladmakesmesad · 21/04/2020 14:33

His wife knows the crime but not the charges. She’s also currently out of the country for an extended period (due to Coronavirus).

OP posts: