Ex H

[LittleDonkeyKong]

Apologies in advance for the long thread!

I separated from my ex H 7 years ago when I was 3 months pregnant with our 2nd child. Divorced about 18 months later. We have 2 girls aged 9 and 6.
Since then we have arranged maintenance and child contact been ourselves. I am now going to be going through CMS for maintenance and requesting him to get a court order for contact, here's why....
His attitude towards the girls has always been out of sight out of mind! Being able to be amicable to him has gone out of the window these past couple of weeks. I was furloughed last month and he was still working so we agreed the children would stay with me. He was furloughed 2 weeks ago so that in my mind changed things. Last week I asked him if he was having the girls next week as it had been 14 days since he was furloughed and his response was 'who said I would have them after 14 days?' He then started saying he would get fined for driving to pick them up which obviously I know he won't and I sent him screenshots from government websites stating its classed as essential travel. He then said he had spoke to his mum and she told him no he will be fined. I messaged his mum and attached the sane screenshots I sent ex h. I then get told his mum had messaged him and because I had as he put it 'spat my dummy out' now he HAD to have the kids (I don't believe he ever spoke to his mum about it and in response to the message I sent her she spoke to him asking why I had messaged her that). I then get slagged off by him for 'putting ideas into the kids head's that they would be seeing daddy soon!
He picked the kids up this morning with a face like a slapped arse. Half an hour later I receive a message off him saying 'just to clarify how long am i having these for? THESE!!!! that's how he refers to his 2 beautiful daughters! He couldn't even wait until he got back to his house to message me he messaged while driving!!!
I'm 99% sure the only reason he pays maintenance and has the kids for 1 night every 2 weeks usually is because his mum tells him he has to.
I suppose I just want someone to agree that he is a deadbeat dad and I'm doing the right thing making things legal after all these years of me 'forcing' him to see his children.

I understand your frustration. How do the girls feel about contact. He is behaving like this because you stood your ground. I agree with the others. If the girls want to se him then carry on with the visits. Contact is 'in the child's interest'

I would agree a date. Say the first weekend of every month is his weekend. And if he wishes to cancel you need 24 hour notice. If he doesn't show up then fair enough. If he can be arsed to go to court and gets it ordered then let him.

Money through the CMS. Then you never have to chase him. Ask him or remind him again.

Good idea about email address! I know a court order wont make him show up but I'm sick of him taking us for a ride and I dont want the girls to go somewhere they obviously arent wanted. If he decides to go to court then at least its him 'wanting' to do it. I have a feeling he won't.

I think you need to calm down before you jump at anything.

I am a great believer in the cms in removing power- however currently they are only dealing with reducing payments to nrp. So depending on if you need the money you may be better waiting a couple of months.

Re contact. The comments he made would severely piss me off . However you do need to work out what is best for your children.

You can go low contact assuming he is meant to have them eow- document each weekend he lets them down and reason. You have a pattern . At the minute you don’t have that .

Also be clear he will get contact if he takes you to court- you haven’t said he is abusive in anyway - just not a great dad- not great dads get contact orders.

You are then legally obligated to have your children available for contact - he can still let them dh own continually.

Blocking will make you look like the bad guy.

I also wouldn’t involve his mum he is a grown man .

My eldest never really wants to go. The youngest only wants to go as she thinks he will have bought her a toy

With the best will in the world OP, a court order isn't going to make any difference. He can still pick and choose if he sees the kids, and you will be obliged to make them ready to see him. It's all about control, as you've seen from him messing you about with dates of maintenance.

My kids were about the same age as yours when my ex started dropping contact. Eventually (and with a lot of counselling for me and the kids) we got to a point where if the kids asked when they were seeing dad I'd say 'well it's his weekend but he's not been in touch so we'll see'. There was quite a drive to his (which I did 50/50) so that added to the logistics.

Put the responsibility back on him. As PP have said tell him when they'll be free, and if he's not been in touch to confirm arrangements say 2 days in advance, then you will make alternate plans. Text or email only, copy in his mum if need be. Take the control back OP. It's hard but so liberating eventually.

My kids now only see their dad maybe twice a year and they have zero expectations in the meantime.

I'm in tears here feeling a mix of guilt, anger and sadness. I guess I just took it for granted that their dad should love them like I do.

The MN mantra "when someone shows you their true colours, believe them" seems very apt here.
He's even put it in writing for you.

Your eldest doesn't want to go and the youngest only if bribed.
I bet if you asked, they probably aren't really that bothered.

It is really sad ☹️

CMS is the best plan for the maintenance to formalise it.

But don't make him go to court. The judge will not look well on you for it. Just wait for him to ask to see them, and if he does, tell him they are available on X day per week with at least Y days' notice. That way you only have to tell the children he's expected if he's given you the notice.

You still can't force him to turn up, but it's better than nothing. And far better than court (I can promise you wouldn't enjoy it). You'd have to go to mediation first anyway.

It's not about what You want @LittleDonkeyKong. It's about what's best for your children.

It sounds to me like it's you who wants the control. Demanding a 'legal document' and applying to the CMS. You do realise that all you need to do is open a dialogue with your children and ask what they want?

Stop trying to control your ex and do what's best for your children. Don't use them to score points.

I am not using them to score points! 7 years I've had of him paying maintenance when he feels like and him deciding when he can be bothered to see our children! All the millions of men who are fighting to see their children and heres me being a dick offering him unlimited access and he doesn't want it!

Another example of him being an awesome dad. My eldest still wears pull ups to bed as she is yet to be dry. Last year he informed me I'm a shit mum as she still pissss the bed. He hadn't bought pull ups for weeks and refused to buy any and was insisting she slept in her own piss to teach her a lesson!!! I now send pull ups with her

He humilated his own daughter by making her sleep in her urine? That'd have been the last time I sent them.

He sounds dreadful. I'm all for encouraging and supporting relationships between fathers but that shouldn't be done at the expense of the child's mental wellbeing. Letting his own child sleep in wee to teach a lesson is disgusting and damaging for your DD. If he wants to see them from now on he puts the effort in, if not then I'm sure they'll be absolutely fine with just you, mum, in the picture.

Why ask on here when you clearly have made your mind up?

Yanbu to go to cms, I think it makes it clearer between parents and easier to arrange.

YABU to stop contact with their dad. The girls have a right to their dad, not him have a right to them. So I suggest you stop forcing him, let him guide the contact. If that’s one night every other week then that’s it. No more no less just because of covid-19.

Do not let his hideous attitude (you’re right, it’s awful) mean that you become the bad guy. Your DD won’t thank you for it and he’ll forever have the “your mum withheld you” card.

Cms and dont force contact. If youre not forcing him, sounds like he will atop wanting them anyway.

I honestly thought I was doing the right thing trying to maintain a relationship between them

No. You need to maintain your relationship with you and your children. He needs to maintain his relationship with them. You can’t do that artificially.

damn you where in earth do you get the idea she is controlling her ex? It is in noone interests (except his) to have him dick about with payment dates and regular contact. By seeking formal arrangements the op is seeking to offer stability. She isnt saying 'I'll take him to court to stop contact. She's asking Him to specify what he'd like but he seems not to want that. It's clear from his messages he doesn't want them. My ex isn't as bad but never has them a minute more than he' must' for appearances sake and never takes up the offer of extra time. OP, I agree that you might be going a bit nuclear here by blocking all contact. Set up one dedicated email just for him. Do go via cms for maintenance but id leave court for now. Just clearly document in emails when the kids are available, request x notice for changes and see what happens.

Dont deny contact. But dont suggest it. Dont chase it. Dont force it. Dont ask for his opinion.

he will lose interest. And if he does it is because he is a dead beat.

He is not in the minority though. My ex hasn't paid a penny in nearly 2 years. Even though he has an income of about £60k per year. Cms can't catch up with him. He maybe sees the youngest child once a month. Sometimes goes 10 weeks with no contact at all. (suits me) The eldest has stopped going because dad doesn't give them any attention and is always on his phone.

It makes me bloody mad. But that achieves nothing. I get to watch the children thrive and grown into amazing people. And I can get by without him financially. It isn't easy. But I just focus on the positives.

He has to live with his choices and maybe one day the children will hold him accountable for his actions.

Just keep being the best mum you can be. You are enough for your dds

@DamnYouAutoCarrot can you read? It is the ex h who is controlling the cm payments. Changing dates. Making her ask. Op wants to go through the official route so he cant control it. It is op who is wanting the ex h to have contact. He doesnt give a shiny shit about having his children. For christ sake, have higher standards for fathers than he will take them when forced and pay to help them eat and be clothes when begged.

Go to CMS for the maintenance but why on Earth would you go to court to ensure this man has contact with your children?

He is clearly uninterested and horrible to them. After they come back do not contact him again in regards to seeing the children. Just ignore him. When/if he decides to ask for contact again advise him to go to court.

No I want to stop contact to see if he is actually that bothered about seeing them and if he would actually go to court to get a court order

@CalleighDoodle I can read perfectly well thank you. The ex H has contact and pays maintenance and op doesn't like that it's not on her terms? Her post is all subjecture, from her point of view... I'd like to hear his side.

The last comment says it all really. Op wants to play around with her kids and her ex to see if he's that bothered. Here's an idea, grow up and have a conversation. Children are not pawns, they should have the opportunity to grow up with everyone around them that loves them. Not just who @LittleDonkeyKong deems acceptable, he was OK enough to make babies with 🤷🏻‍♀️

My birth father was never interested in me. My mum tried to force it for a few years thinking any relationship with him would be good. I was always aware he didnt want me around and honestly would have been happier not to have seen him. Might be time to stop the visits.

He's that bothered about seeing his kids that he messaged me asking how long he's having 'THESE' for. Messaged while driving!! He couldn't even wait until he got home to ask! He was that desperate to know! He really doesn't give a shit! He has then because his mother would kill him if he didnt because his dad was a deadbeat dad and she wants to see her granddaughters! Him and his mum both live 1.5 hours drive away.