Please use the countryside responsibly- so fed up

[jacks11]

On a rare day off from my day job, I have once again spent the day dealing with a series of thoughtless and/or completely entitled idiots behaving totally irresponsibly on our land. I had thought the one (very small) silver lining of this awful situation would be that this lambing season would see us free from so many problems from people out for a walk etc. But still having issues.

Today I stopped no fewer than 7 families traipsing through either the yard, our garden (one family stopping to have a seat on the picnic table/bench in our garden) or the lambing sheds to have a look. One family also stopped off to admire the lambs in one of the fields then preceded to take there youngish children (under 10) into said fields to see them closer. Several gates left open, people climbing over gates etc. I caught someone feeding our old pony apples and a doughnut! We’ve had rubbish being dropped. Dogs off leads etc.

What I cannot understand is how so many are getting to us- they must be breaching the guidance to only exercise locally or walking at least 7 miles from the nearest village. Which I doubt with the ages of some of the children.

When DH politely approached the family in our garden they were really rude, citing their “right to roam”- not even slightly apologetic when pointed out they were in our garden so they had no right to be there. Ditto several other people- don’t seem to realise right to roam does not apply to private gardens or land used for commercial reasons- I.e. yards/lambing sheds and you must behave responsibly (e.g. close gates, don’t let dogs off leads near livestock, don’t leave rubbish, don’t worry livestock, don’t walk across crops etc).

When you add in the situation with Covid, you’d think people would be careful about touching gates etc unnecessarily- but no. Lots of people have vulnerable family members and this is just an added headache- having to constantly be aware that people may have touched the gates/railings/doors etc.

Please use the countryside responsibly- some of us live on the land you are using as a playground. You are putting our livestock at risk- please don’t feed livestock/horses for that reason- and sometimes yourself in danger. There is no excuse for leaving rubbish.

Rant over!!

Hester Have you any idea how stressful lambing is? We don't need distractions and extra work dealing with idiots.

mbosnz My car had a puncture this morning, But its alright the postman turned up just at the right time, so I ranted at him, chuck in a few swear worlds, buts that's ok, I am sure he understands

Yes dear. Did your postman cause the puncture? Did anyone of his ilk? No? Well then, perhaps you shouldn't have ranted at him.

Because he didn't cause you monetary loss, didn't cause you stress, didn't cause you actual harm. or loss of quiet enjoyment of your property.

@Hester54

If you love the countryside so much and feel so passionately about it, why are you not angry at those who are causing the initial problems that are ruining areas and driving farmers to close areas of their land because they have incurred losses and had messes to clean up, as well as being put at unessecary risk from the virus at the moment too, why only anger towards the farmers reacting to protect themselves?
If everyone were to use the footpaths correctly, there would be no damage, no evidence even of their use, unless you happen to pass a farmer physically.
They are not delivering a service in terms of footpaths, it's a responsibility they have. They don't need to be polite or anything else about anything, customer service isn't part of that responsibility.

And your analogy about pubs is rubbish quite frankly. If some of the behaviour listed just here happened on licenced premises, the police would be the ones closing the door because they'd be saying the licencee wasn't dealing effectively with the behaviour or putting strategies in place to prevent it happening. It's quite easy to put strategies in place to prevent that kind of behaviour in a pub, you bar people, you kick them out. Because it's a relatively small area to control in comparison to a farm with several acres of land to not only farm but control. They don't shut all the pubs, but they do deal with the ones causing the problem.

mbosnz I haven’t caused the farmers any problems, didn’t stop them ranting at me.

You posted earlier that you let your dog off the lead and it took minutes for them to recall after you realised there was livestock in the field they had gone in.

You posted earlier that you let your dog off the lead and it took minutes for them to recall after you realised there was livestock in the field they had gone in.

So in the car puncture analogy, that's more like someone carelessly dropping nails on the ground.

YouTheCat My dogs were already off lead, As I’m allowed to do within the rules, ( I didn’t let them off lead to chase livestock )
What are the farmers going to do about crows killing lambs now,? Put a net over every field

What are the farmers going to do about crows killing lambs now?

Crows don't tend to directly kill lambs, they peck out their eyes, anus and tongues leaving them unable to see or eat and in lots of pain.

Farmers will continue to shoot them as pest control within whatever legal framework applies at the time.

Sorry to say, but with the new guidelines it looks that you will all be having more visitors over the coming weeks, start to charge admission fee to your farms, charge to see the horses, with extra to feed, set up Pimlico spots for them ( chargeable of course) there must be away you can make some money out of the visitors?

Picnic spots, dame keyboard

Hester

As I said to you before, you may be exactly what you claim to be- a responsible walker- but many are not. We have no way of knowing which you’ll be just by looking at you, we’ll not find out until after the damage has been done (unless we catch you in the act) and we have to deal with the problem. Often we cannot prove who was the perpetrator, even if we have our suspicions. Even when we can there is usually very little come back or consequence for them. As the proportion of people who DO cause a problem rises, it is understandable (even if not entirely fair to you) that farmers and other landowners are increasingly unhappy to see people in their land. It really isn’t difficult to understand, is it?

I freely admit that whilst, in principle, I don’t have an issue with people using the footpath in reality the minute I see someone I get a sinking feeling. This worsens as time goes on, and is especially true just now.

In addition, regarding your point about signs- in my experience it’s a waste of time as they don’t work. We have lots of signs. They are largely ignored. You, as a responsible walker, may follow the instructions/directions/request, on a sign but lots of people don’t. Those least likely to heed signs would probably be those not the ones who are selfish enough to have picnics in someone’s garden and leave the rubbish behind, or who are stupid enough to put young children in lambing sheds to play with the newborn lambs, or thoughtless enough to go into a field with livestock and leave the gate open; or who are so utterly ignorant they would feed a pony a donut/vegetable peelings etc.

I keep the signs in the hope if anything happens I can show we took reasonable precautions. I really shouldn’t have to, other than signs showing where the footpath is (though this is ignored too).

I just really wish people would remember farms are places of work, they are someone’s livelihood and livestock are living animals who should be treated with respect and not playthings/cute fluffy toys for a nice selfie for Facebook or instagram. In short, just want them to acquaint themselves with rules and regulations/rights and responsibilities before heading out into the countryside. If they did, I would be a lot less anxious when we see walkers!

Hester, FYI my BIL shot a dog that was in his lambing pasture yesterday. He also had (so far) 17 dead lambs to dispose of.
No dog owner was seen.

Haven't rtft and expected you to be unreasonably asking everyone not to use footpaths.

But the behaviour you described is really shitty.

Are the paths well marked?

Hester

I don’t want people to feed my horses. They have a carefully planned diet to control their weight. Failure to stick to this could put their health at risk. Frankly, at the minute we have enough to do without taking on guided tours of the farm. What we could charge would not cover the extra we’d have to pay in insurance.

Haven't rtft and expected you to be unreasonably asking everyone not to use footpaths.

Why would anyone expect that from a thread title starting 'please use the countryside...'?

Penners99 Sorry to here that, that’s my point any dog owner would stop their dog, A wild or lost and hungry dog will do what it can to stay alive,
A blocked or shut footpath would make know difference to a wild animal, what every it may be from getting to the livestock
, How many on average would he lose in a season and what percent would be definitely caused by dogs?

Hester, the issue that once a dog has started to chase, most owners won't have a hope in hell of stopping it. I have stopped my dog on a running deer, because she is reasonably well trained, but I still won't let her off near sheep that I know or suspect might be there.

any dog owner would stop their dog,

The point is, if they don't have the dog properly under close control in the first place - for most of us that's on a lead if there's the slightest chance of encountering livestock - then they may not be able to stop it. Even my 14 yo dachshund could outrun me or DH and get under gates etc. Many dogs may never have appeared to have a problem until that fatal first time they see 'prey' running - a sheep, or maybe a rabbit or hare in the field, and instinct takes over.

Sorry to say, but with the new guidelines it looks that you will all be having more visitors over the coming weeks, start to charge admission fee to your farms, charge to see the horses, with extra to feed, set up Pimlico spots for them ( chargeable of course) there must be away you can make some money out of the visitors? You're just mucking about now, aren't you.

It’s odd that people can claim to love the countryside and value access to it. Yet hate farmers and farming.

OP I grew up in a village in the middle of nowhere, and now live in urban London, and have done for 23 years.

The family and I often take holidays in the countryside (or did before the lockdown). It makes me so mad the things I have seen fellow holidaymakers do. As pp have said, feeding the animals, putting themselves or their kids in danger, attempting to ride the animals, not understanding it's the animal's home, and they have no right to harrass them, taking or damaging crops, and letting dogs off the lead. I've seen children chase animals through fields. They also fail to understand that farms are very very dangerous places. My teenage daughter who has wholly been brought up in the city knows how to behave, ffs.

Since even before lockdown we haven't been to the country to visit my family. We don't plan to until it's safe again. These morons have no respect for property, or the environment, or the local economy, or animal welfare.

If I was PM I'd close all public rights of way until winter. I also think rural Police need more support. But I'm not in charge and it's horrible for farmers, who essentially are trying to keep us fed at this difficult time, to be told to fuck off and similar. They are essential workers and it's the morons that need to fuck off imho.

Hester, at this time of year, your dogs should be on a lead and not running into fields and off the path at all.

I'm intrigued by the idea of a Pimlico spot

Actually, having just had a quick look at wiki, perhaps a Pimlico spot is exactly what 'townies' need.

"a district of public gardens much frequented on holidays. According to tradition, it received its name from Ben Pimlico, famous for his nut-brown ale. His tea-gardens, however, were near Hoxtonn^, and the road to them was termed Pimlico Path, so that what is now called Pimlico was so named from the popularity of the Hoxton resort"

at this time of year, your dogs should be on a lead and not running into fields and off the path at all

Here's the explicit direction from the Government site linked to above:

the access rights that normally apply to open country and registered common land (known as ‘open access’ land) require dogs to be kept on a short lead between 1 March and 31 July, to help protect ground nesting birds, and all year round near farm animals

"all year round near farm animals"

I'm a keen countryside walker, but I am always aware that walking paths are rights of way across someone's land. They are not paths owned by the public. There's quite a difference.

It’s odd that people can claim to love the countryside and value access to it. Yet hate farmers and farming

Yes, it's almost as if they think that the countryside is some big public park, with invisible workers coming in at night to tidy it up.

I'd bet that there's a Venn diagram you could draw which combines that attitude with the townies who move to the country, and complain about church bells or the smell of slurry, or a tractor leaves mud on the lane.

I'd be interested to see the crossover on that diagram.