...fed up at having to pay childminder full

[Tinkerbellone]

My child minder stopped working two weeks ago because of worries about corona virus.
She or her partner have no health conditions.
I am a key worker.
She always charges half rate over school holidays even though she doesn't have my children.
She is still charging me Full Rate even though she not working or having my children at all.
I know she has a business to run, but this doesn't seem fair to me; I could understand half pay.
As a single parent I'm struggling to get my children to and from school now. I'm relying on friends and/or my children walking on their own after I've left for work in the morning they are 11 & 8.
Has anyone else experienced this?

My childminder is available to us as we are key workers, but we are mostly able to work from home so haven’t asked her to as yet. She’s not expecting payment when children are not with her - she never does. We also only pay term time usually anyway because that’s when I work. Do you usually pay her when she can’t actually have your DC - like if she has appointments etc? That’s not really the norm for CM in my experience - it’s not up to you to pay her what is effectively holiday money or sick pay, she’s not your nanny, she’s self employed. As for the current situation she should either be taking your children as she can take key workers children - making her a key worker also, or apply for loss of earnings through the correct channels.

@BumpkinSpiceBatty
I have many friends also using CM who always tell me mine doesn’t charge for x,y,z... And they laugh at me for paying mine as much as I do and for so many extras. I say it’s fine as DC love her.

None of my friends CM have told them they need to still pay 100% fees, they have paid nothing (most) or a retainer. In my text about the 80% I also offered a retainer of 35% which is honestly more than I can afford but seemed doable short term, using my savings. She ignored me. I wasn’t rude (unlike her) I was desparate.

And I know she has no mortgage, she told me. Even with no savings, with retainers coming in from her 10 sets of parents and whatever the 80% should be she will still be in a better position than me.

So, 80% of my profit averaged out over those 3 years will bring me in about £30 a week to live on.

That's my 80% self employed rescue package. Like I say, I am lucky that I have other small sources of income (£40 here, £30 there) which will just about keep me afloat so.that I can reopen when all of this is over.

We still HAVE to pay all of these fees while this virus is going on: OFSTED, insurances, subscriptions, ICO. So, even if we're not buying food/resources right now, if we want to keep our registration with OFSTED we, by law, must continue to pay for these things.

So, again, are you saying you only get £50 a week, for working 3 days? So thats less than minimum wage, and why would you do it? You're not a charity?? I dont understand it? How are you making so little money?

A far as I know CM's are also receiving the money for the funded children anyway. I would think after 11 years she would have given you some discount, especially as she chose to close, you didn't choose not to send the DC! I'd give notice and see what happens when things return to normal. I bet she'll take you back if she has the places

Its a shame some try to charge full if they decide to close, this is the very small minority.

No contract in the world covers having to close other than due to sickness/holiday and a pandemic was not covered, most childminders had to close through no fault of their own losing their business overnight.

I’ve seen some fantastic parents on here offering to pay a retainer as they’re being paid in full still and would like to return and keep CM’s open.

Many CM’s will not be returning as being self employed is risky at the best of times and the govt only stepped in after there was uproar.

@Missesmiss

Your Cm sounds incredibly greedy and unprofessional.

I am a Cm- I don't charge when I'm closed. I'm closed due to self isolation just now but when I reopen i will be asking for a voluntary contribution to hold spaces so they have a service to come back to. I am not eligible for the 80% (not been in business long enough) and not entitled to UC or benefits.

Last year I couldn't afford a holiday! I couldn't even take time off at xmas even though I felt I really needed break.
I was banking on most people not needing me but there's alway one family who want their money's worth!! I had their child right through Xmas and new year on her own!

Some parents are ridiculous over money but in your case paying for her holidays, food and every outing is beyond the pale.

Your Cm has been taking all the perks of being employed like a nanny rather than a self employed business!!

I'm glad you called her on the 80%, she will get some money back though it is based on profits after expenses. She's probably panicking as she's been fiddling her books by claiming for all the meals and outings so she (and likely many others) have shot themselves in the foot!)

Leave and don't pay another penny. She's breached the contract by refusing care and in any case contracts at a time like this aren't worth the paper they are written on.

People like her make me feel so angry. I'm far too soft in comparison but I'd hate to be seen as greedy like this.

She's BU if she has decided to close she should be asking if you can pay something not telling you.

To all of you saying 'don't pay her', can I just point out the profit made on childminding is tiny after we've spent most of our (less than minimum wage) pay on food and activities for your children? Some childminders apparently don't make any profit and those who've been open for less than a year won't get anything.

80% of my profits aren't even going to cover basic bills, never mind food for me and my daughter, or the associated business costs that I've had to pay to cover the entire year. It is not our fault that we've had to close our businesses, unless you call protecting your family a 'choice'?

Luckily for me, most of my clients are lovely and can see the bigger picture so they've paid me 50% this month, going down to 20% if I get the 80% grant for subsequent months. Those parents who are in the same position as me are paying nothing but this won't affect their children's places.

You're all going to have a hell of a job finding childcare when life starts to get back to normal.

@LucieLucie

I don’t agree with it either but please I honestly cannot believe my eyes. Do you know how exhausting it is helping people understand the position childminders are in?

How dare you say she’s probably fiddling the books.

And how dare you complain about parents not taking Christmas holidays and because you didn’t take a holiday either you had to work - tough!!! If you wanted the time off you should have taken it. In the same breath saying the OP is unfair (she is). But so are you!

Unbelievable!!

@itwasalovelydreamwhileitlasted

If you're in England and the person caring for your child is receiving some form of benefit while looking after your child under the age of 8 in their home for more than 2 hours a day they must be a registered childminder.

To be registered as a childminder, they MUST pay for ICO, PLI, OFSTED fees, business insurance on any car they drive with mindees in it, CPD (including food hygiene, safeguarding and peadiatric first aid at regular intervals). This is by law.

So if your childcare doesn't do that they they are most certainly not a childminder!
@sorrelli

@RedRedScab

Honestly I wouldn’t bother. Childminders are tax fiddling horrid people making a mint on a cartel. Next you’ll be grilled on your income and taxes and have to explain yourself.

Luckily most people aren’t unreasonable and can see the bigger picture.

@sorrelli
How dare you say she’s probably fiddling the books.

How dare you assume that she's not!! She's getting over £1000 from a single parent key worker alone!!! She has been charging her parents for taxable expenses!!!!
Are you for real in shouting me down? How dare you!!! Do you understand how to be honest and how tax returns work!!?

And as for parents sending their kids at Christmas when they ARE AT HOME so they can get their £4.50s worth, I think that's mean spirited but more importantly and a shame for the child!!

After reading the horror stories on here from greedy childminders I will close for two weeks next year and charge them for it just like this one has been doing.

Get off your high horse and don't you dare try and Lord it over me. How dare someone like you defend other cm's who are taking the piss yet jump on me for being knackered and working with one child all through Christmas!! Beggars belief!!!

I'm being charged 50% by my childminder as she has stopped her services. Me and DH also both key workers. I offered to pay my childminder full pay (as our pay isn't affected and my 18m old isn't too much trouble to juggle between ourselves and keep her safe from potential exposure). Childminder very grateful for offer but refused saying didn't feel comfortable as wasn't providing service and in her words said was drinking tea all day feeling a bit redundant! She is claiming under gov scheme and will get it in June sometime she said. Your CM could easily be doing the same.

If she doesn't want to take the risk having the kids, fair enough that's her perogative but expecting full pay is a bit cheeky when there are ways to help her parents as well as be paid the rest albeit with a delay till June.

Part of me keeps looking out the window longingly at my furloughed neighbour sunbathing in her garden with a cocktail on 80% wage whilst I'm grumpily pregnant, up to my eyeballs as works gone mad and also dealing with my toddler 😂! (yes before anyone gives me grief I fully appreciate that whilst it's difficult it's a hell of a lot safer and a better off situation than a lot of people - I'm clearly trying to make light of this hellish pandemic!)

@SeriouslyRetro

Don't imply that I fiddle my tax because I most certainly do not!!!

One of my clients who always pays on time has asked what she owes for April. I have said nothing because I will get some funding from her child. It's not as much as the going rate but I'm prepared to take the hit because I value her custom. If I wasn't getting that money, I might have to say to her about negotiating something otherwise I will not be in business once she needs care again and there are very limited options for care for the under 5's in our area.

I appreciate my clients and they appreciate me because we have a sensible, mature working relationship where neither of us take the piss.

We can claim £0.45 a mile for petrol but petrol doesn't actually cost that (it's meant to cover the cost of running the whole car such as servicing). We can also claim 10% wear and tear for any breakages regardless. We can claim a % of our rent, heating lighting etc. So, I do make more than that but, no not much more hence why I have a small second income to support myself and my two disabled children.

My point was to all of these people saying that the government is going to give them 80% of their wages are misinformed. They are assuming that it is a larger sum than what is is as it's not based on gross income, only net profit.

If you read my posts then you will see that I have been completely fair to the OP in my opinions.

One of my clients who always pays on time has asked what she owes for April. I have said nothing because I will get some funding from her child. It's not as much as the going rate but I'm prepared to take the hit because I value her custom. If I wasn't getting that money, I might have to say to her about negotiating something otherwise I will not be in business once she needs care again and there are very limited options for care for the under 5's in our area.

I appreciate my clients and they appreciate me because we have a sensible, mature working relationship where neither of us take the piss.

I don't really understand the childminders saying their expenses are high so it doesn't represent their true profits?
Your expenses are things you wouldn't be paying if you weren't childminding for example, the food you feed the children, special furniture or resources, groups and classes you go to, mileage for school runs.
If you aren't working and get the 80%, then you won't be paying for all those expenses - that's money you're saving.

My expenses are usually about 30% of my turnover. The poster that says their profit is only £50 a week - does that mean you only take about £70 a week in fees?

@FillyBilly if you're claiming all of these expenses before your profits, then doesn't that mean you're used to only earning £30 a week? Those expenses were coming out and never saw your bank account before. If your profits were that low to begin with then that's just how much you earn.

I'm not understanding this either.

@FillyBilly - but you only ever have your net profit to spend though, not your total income? So what difference does it make?

Former childminder here. Have been watching this with interest.
My contracts stated that if I was ill or on holiday or shut when I could be open then parents did not have to pay me.
If I was open and they for any reason didn't send their child then they paid in full.
I paid for all trips/outings, food, nappies, baby milk when required. I did not at any time take the p**s, as seems to be the view of quite a few Mumsnetters.
I have friends who are still childminders, they are not looking after key workers children. Some of them are asking for half fees whilst we are in lock down. If I was still minding I would not be charging as I did not have any keyworkers children so at the governments insistence I would be closed.

So actually, you do take home more than your net profits that you claim to make? But 'not by much'? Enough to make a discernible difference to your living standards now though?

Next you’ll be grilled on your income and taxes and have to explain yourself.

Nothing to hide here. I don't fiddle my taxes (and neither does my accountant). As others have said, childminding is far from profitable at the best of times and most of us continue because we genuinely love the job and care about the children we look after. But at £6 per hour, I hardly feel as though I've been ripping people off.

I feel quite sad after reading some of the comments on here.

Don't pay her .
Of course she'll be claiming the 80% grant in June.
She's taking the piss.

@LucieLucie

You should be ashamed of yourself. Accusing others of fiddling their taxes you do not know this fellow childminder of yours so don’t be so ignorant.

And yes, don’t assume you’re the only hardworking childminder who’s knackered, please you are ridiculous. How would you feel if I come on here and accuse you of fiddling books?

You may be knackered (most CM’s are) but that doesn’t mean you have the right to come on here complaining about your parents sending their children to you at xmas instead of paying you and keeping them home, whether they’re home or not is irrelevant.

I’d say you’re the one on your high horse judging from your first post but you don’t like being told it.

If people are making so little in profit from childminding, it should be trivial, even in this economic climate, to find piecework that would earn a higher level of income.

I think anyone saying they're making £16 for a day's work is either cooking the books (for instance, by adding their family's food shop or other household purchases to their expenses) and I don't feel sorry for them in the least, or they should find a new line of work. You can't talk about how dismal it is to be missing out on 20% of your wage when that adds up to about the price of a fancy coffee.

She’s taking the piss and is trying to have it every which way. Not working and then being paid time and 4/5. Nice work . I’d bin her off for being so cheeky and greedy

@RedRedScab

I hear you, most don’t fiddle and don’t have much. Vital for the economy providing affordable childcare.

I feel sad too but can’t fathom other childminders slinging mud at other childminders they don’t even know affirming that they’re fiddling their taxes