Protective equipment for UK GPs: coronavirus

[GPwife2411]

Hi

I've name changed for this to avoid anything identifiable.

My partner is a GP and owns the practice. He has been phoning his care commissioning group (CCG) on and off for a couple of weeks to ask for basic protective equipment to wear and give to other staff in the event of a coronavirus outbreak / patient presenting with concerning symptoms. This is looking pretty likely in the near future.

Yesterday the CCG basically admitted that they didn't have any for local practices and are not sure when, if ever, they would.

DH basically came home resigned to the fact that he was going to catch it and probably encounter massive exposure once more cases appear here.

AIBU to think that this is a truly shit way to treat medical staff?

Not only does this scare me in terms of DP passing it to me and the children, it also scares me even more in terms of DP passing it to vulnerable patients. He's not allowed to close the surgery if he feels it's unsafe otherwise he would be in breach of contract.

111 are also still merrily scheduling GP appointments for people with suspicious symptoms, and DP's and other doctors' efforts to override this (so people get a phonecall first to check their travel history etc before they arrive in the waiting room) have been rebuffed.

In summary, AIBU to think this is all just pretty shit? Or am I overreacting through my concern for DP?

@TheWickerWoman OMG, a supermarket!

That's what I'm mainly afraid of to be honest - infected people just going about their usual business despite advice, or turning up at the surgery if the queue at A&E is too long / 111 haven't called them back!

He's the sole partner. I'm not sure about the exact status of the contract but will ask him if he ever gets in from work (no sign yet!)

I actually think with this outbreak occurring the last place anyone should go will be the doctors waiting room or A&E as you’re surely more at risk there than anywhere else

Stay out of the doctors and hospital unless emergency

Our CCG not paying for PPE, practices have to get their own at the moment and work within the who protocol for primary care. I suspect this will change should it become more widespread in this country. You may just be getting annoyed prematurely.

It's a bit odd.

I left the nhs a while ago. This is no different to flu pandemic planning which is well overdue. That was planned for at least 15 years ago.
All practices were required to have their own plan as part of their funding arrangements, that aligned with their local area...

But that was before public health was moved from the NHS to councils...

@GPwife2411. Yup, crazy isn’t it.. knowing he could well have it he popped out for a bit of shopping while he was waiting for the call!

I’ve been checking to see if we have received a discharge report confirming exactly what it is/was but it’s not come through yet which usually means they’re still in hospital 😕

I was rather surprised to see a large notice on my local Pharmacy door today along the lines of, If you have recently travelled from China, Thailand etc..
do not enter this pharmacy, if you have a temperature and or cough, go home immediately and ring 111

Was rather surprised as i live in West Wales, and its a rural village!
I felt it was an extremely premature reaction at this moment in time..

Anyone else seen similar in their location?

I’m a GP and one of the schools closed due to the ski trip to Italy is in my catchment. 111 rerouted a suspected school staff member to go to GP surgery today- thankfully the patient rang us first and we managed to avoid an issue in the waiting room. We have no protective masks yet as far as I’m aware. I have 3 kids and am also dreading the worsening spread and associated workload I’ll face tomorrow with the local scare. However I’ll just crack on and do my best- as we do in the NHS! Worrying isnt going to change the situation as it’s outside of our control. I agree the increased mortality rate compared to normal flu is concerning- SARS was much worse though.

@TheWickerWoman You might want to get that post deleted because it’s pretty identifiable and you may have breached your organisation’s IG policy.

I rang my local surgery last week. As I was in the queue to have my call answered the information given out was very clear, and in line with PHE guidance. Once my call was answered by the receptionist, and I said I needed a doctor today due to my respiratory nightmare she was straight into the 'have you recently ...' PHE guidance and I could sense the concern in her voice. As soon as I told her I hadn't travelled, have underlying issues, and had already seen him once about this, she gave me an appointment that day. But you would have had to lie to a human on two counts to get through to the surgery. They were very clear about calling 111 if in doubt.

I understand why you worry, that is not U, but if his surgery is taking this approach (which I assume is standard guidance) that's more effective that PPE.

@ivykaty44 - I would agree, I've been avoiding popping into my surgery all week although I need to drop off some filled sharps boxes!

@SlB09 - oh okay, that makes sense - I wonder why that's not what DP has been told? I have been known to get annoyed prematurely ... if it ends up his responsibility then there's no hope of us finding protective equipment anywhere around here - everywhere's sold out.

@Endoftethermum1 - sorry to hear that you're also a) without protection and b) having to be a little wary of 111's instructions. I do appreciate they have a really difficult job to do but in the current unusual circumstances I think it would be sensible for call handlers to have to run it by the surgery in question before booking the appointment ...

111 sounds utterly useless as usual to be honest. I think we all need very clear guidance Now on what to do everywhere in every language

111 insisted I went to gp surgery with dd when swine flu was in full swing, they assured me she didn’t have it......she did

@WiseUpJanetWeiss the first one? I think you’re right .. I’ll go and report it. Thanks 👍🏽

No evidence for masks in primary care. Except for spreading panic

Our GP practice sent out a text basically saying don’t come anywhere near if you’ve got any chesty type symptoms. Phone 999 if you’re dying. If you die we’ll take you off the books. Please don’t use your GP for anything. 🙈

Stylish- It's a virus not a bacterial infection and it can survive for up to 9 days on surfaces.

Emem- alcohol based antibacterial gels might work for Coronavirus as there is some research suggesting ethanol based sanitizers are effective against Coronavirus (this is different from Norovirus/ non-enveloped viruses, which are not denatured by ethanol).

Was rather surprised as i live in West Wales, and its a rural village!
I felt it was an extremely premature reaction at this moment in time..

Does no one from the village ever travel elsewhere or receive visitors?

Why hasn't he just ordered masks,goggles etc in the same way as he orders gloves. I am a team lead for a community nursing team and we ordered equipment a month ago. Didn't have to ask CCG.

My understanding of the guidance for primary care is still that a patient should be isolated in a dedicated room in the practice - ie not examined/treated by primary care staff and therefore fit tested mask etc not required (because at the point you recognised that was needed you should instead leave the room and seek advice about transfer to secondary care).

There is no evidence whatsoever that face masks provide any protection from the virus.

But if your DH thinks otherwise why doesn't he just buy one? Its his job.

There is no evidence whatsoever that face masks provide any protection from the virus.

Lack of evidence does not always mean that something isn't effective. It can sometimes mean that it just hasn't been tested. You could argue that there is no evidence demonstrating that facemasks provide no protection. I think you need to interpret what the specialist say with a bit of common sense. Firstly, they will be unwilling to say that facemasks provide protection when there aren't any available. Secondly, much of their reasoning for saying they may not provide protection is that people often don't use them properly. They don't say they are ineffective if used properly. If they provide no protection, why do World Health Organisation advise people to use them only if looking after someone with the virus? If they didn't think they were effective they would suggest not using them at all.

Jellykat I'm in South Wales and work in a GP surgery, we've had guidelines about it and posters displayed for a few weeks.

First case confirmed at our surgery today op - we found some PPE thankfully! Good luck to your husband

Eeeeeek @Endoftethermum1 - good luck to you too, I hope that you don't see any more. Was the person directed there by 111?

I have passed most of the other comments on to DH and I think he is just going to go ahead and ask his PM to buy some although the practices in his area have been currently explicitly instructed NOT to do so (I wonder if it's to do with reduced availability ...) ... the mind boggles!