to think 111 is a total liability...

[M3lon]

They advised us we needed to take our DD (8yo) to A&E last night at 10pm because she had a small splinter of ceramic tile under her finger nail.

I'm not sure the NHS needs this kind of 'help'.

IC, not ICT

I have found them really good, possibly because I’m in London but they’ve always set out OOH GP appointments rather than suggested A&E as a first-case

All the people saying “they sent an ambulance even though I didn’t want it” - my experience has been that they’ve suggested an ambulance but not forcefully sent it, they’ve always explored other possibilities, ie could you get to hospital yourself? Could the doctor call you back? Etc etc

Can’t quite believe some of these stories on here tbh.

I always understood 111 was to signpost to the most appropriate care.
The times I've called for me and DC we've been given a callback with a clinician or they've booked us in with an out of hours appointment within a couple of hours.

I've had 1 experience where the person said see how you go and it turned out to be a proper illness, but that was a few years ago. Otherwise I think they're quite reasonable in our area.

But what is the alternative?

If they’re telling to go to A&E, that’s solely based upon the information you have given them. You’ve either over exaggerated your symptoms or have a concerning symptom that shows as a red flag on their system.

I have had a few calls to 111 over the years - they have either asked my GP to see me the same day or booked an out of hours appointment? I have only been sent to A&E once and that was due to coughing a bit of bloody mucus so fair enough.

The ambulance then said it was policy to take all under 2's to A&E regardless - so we ended up in A&E for a child who had a bit of a tummy bug.

Some individual trusts do have this sort of policy. It is most definitely not "111 policy". The originally disposition recommended after the telephone assessment is over ridden.

my experience has been that they’ve suggested an ambulance but not forcefully sent it, they’ve always explored other possibilities, ie could you get to hospital yourself?

Yes exactly. We can’t say as health advisors to refuse it or go to the hospital instead. We can only suggest. It’s the clinicians that are medically trained to advise.

@bobbypinseverywhere no, I called because my five year old son had a cold and had woken up with a barking cough that I was concerned might be croup. By the time we got to the hospital it had cleared to a normal cough, apparently common when taking a child with a cough like that out into cold dry air.

I love 111. They've been very good to me. It's really hard to diagnose anything over the phone, but I'd rather they were overly cautious than go "it's probably ok, just leave it".

I used the service when it was NHS Direct. My friend was a senior nurse there and you could often talk to an actual nurse, but she said just following algorithms was useless - I was surprised to see a PP say that they had clinical experience as I thought it was just call centre operatives following a script now?

I would imagine when you phone 111 the calls are obviously recorded, for certain things they will send an ambulance because if they left you to make your own way to hospital, and something happened, they could be liable.
If you didn't want them to do something, why did you phone? What advice did you want?

The call takers are non clinical but you will frequently be called back by a clinician. They use pathways which is an evidence based system designed by doctors mainly gps. It is designed to be as risk averse as possible.

Ive only had positive experiences of 111, although you do have to use your common sense. I called for advice on colic when DD was 3 weeks, and they tried to send an ambulance because she was "hard to rouse and keep alert" - she was 3 weeks old, waking her up and keeping her awake was really tricky! I told the guy in no uncertain terms that we did not need an ambulance, and got put through to a nurse practitioner who helped me work out a plan of action for the colic.

What advice were you hoping to get at 10pm though? If you consider its not serious enough to need a+e, would you not just put a clean dressing on, give some pain relief and go to minor injuries or call your own gp first thing in the morning.

Exactly this.

You dialled 111 (an NHS number) to ask about a splinter under an 8 year olds finger nail and are now complaining about the pressure on the NHS? Ironic.

It was a splinter. Does nobody have any first aid common sense these days? Even a quick search on Google would have told you what to do.

You do realise you were probably holding up the line for someone who actually did need some assistance?

I've only had to use them once, thank heavens, and they were fantastic. I felt really looked after on the phone and they arranged for a doctor to call me within 2 hours but explained it might be 3(it was) as BH. I was also told that should I have any reoccurance of the issue in the meantime I should ring for an ambulance. The person was very thorough in her questioning and seemed pretty on the ball. I wasn't expecting to be impressed after all the awful things you hear but I have to say I was.
I just hope that if I even have to use them again I receive the same level of service and care.

They’ve been hit and miss with us. I’m not convinced non-medically trained call centre bods following a script can really hope to always get it right.

What is helpful is when they set you up with an OOH appointment you couldn’t otherwise get, for things that aren’t quite urgent enough for A&E, but equally can’t wait for hours till the GP surgery opens.

I could have kissed them when they organised an emergency dentist appointment for me when I had pericoronitis (sp?). My usual private dental surgery couldn’t have been less bothered to help, despite charging like a wounded rhino for routine work.

I have a complaint/ feedback being investigated currently. I needed an out of hours gp appointment for a UTI, I am high risk due to my medical history. They failed to take my medical history into account and referred me to a pharmacy for self care.

@RainbowsandSnowdrops the alternative would be to have medically trained professionals on the end of the phone, not just call handlers who have a script to follow. If I wanted generic advice based on a script I would be googling it, not phoning to speak to someone. I dare say the extra cost of the staff would be saved by people being given more appropriate advice the first time round!

Last time I used 111 I had a child screaming in agony and saying his eyes were going funny. It was the middle of the night. By the time I got a call back he had fallen asleep. I duly roused him as requested and got him to respond and then he lay down again. Was told I needed an ambulance.

Next thing I know the paramedics are here expecting an unconscious kid. I'd said he was still sleepy.

I must say though. The paramedic team were lovely And when I explained why I'd called they said we'd done the right thing getting him checked. They also said 111 constantly misinform them

Whenever I've called I've always been called back relatively quickly by a paramedic/doctor/nurse. You just have to get through the tick box process first so that they can get the right person to call. eg, broken toe - paramedic. Infant DD with serious UTI - doctor. Seems sensible to me. A paramedic is cheaper than a doctor and a broken toe is definitely something a paramedic can advise on. Blood in urine in a 3 year old... a doctor is probably a better call.

the problem is also that people don't know how to use these services. Sorry I know that's blaming the victims in a way, but even on here you can see that some people ringing are doing so because they don't have basic first aid skills. I once very badly sprained my ankle and due to a very disturbing crack at the time, I hobbled down to A&E about an hour later as I was a bit worried it was broken. I had been icing it pretty much constantly 15 mins on, 15 off, the entire time, including while waiting in A&E. Doctor also thought it was broken and sent off for x-rays. Turned out not to be. At which point he told me he'd expect more swelling from a strain vs a break (I think - the details are a bit fuzzy). I explained re icing etc and he said that it's actually extremely unusual for someone to come into A&E with a sprain/break that has received such basic first aid. I was shocked.

I learnt a lot of first aid at girl guides, but also at school I think. And my parents taught us a lot as we are somewhat accident prone as a family! I've already started trying to teach the DC and will be encouraging more formal training of some sort down the line.

My frustration is more that when we need OOH gp for the kids they always want to send us into the city (different health trust) despite there being an OOH gp service in the next town over which is a quarter of the distance away. Because computer says so and applying any common sense is beyond them.

Also when I called them feeling like death needing ooh gp and it took 20mins arguing on the phone to get an appointment, they told me to take lemsip and go to bed.
It was a kidney infection and the ooh gp told me I'd probably have been really ill by the next day if I hadn't been seen.

The last time i phoned 111 they tried to send me to an emergency dentist that it was impossible for me to get to as i do not drive. I spent ages arguing with them on the phone as i knew of a few emergency dentists that i could get to.