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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to think these comments from Peter Tatchell are concerning? *title edited by MNHQ at OP's request

36 replies

CaveMum · 12/02/2020 12:07

Why on earth do people keep giving this odious man air time? And why on earth does he have an opinion on girls and their right to privacy and dignity.

Apparently we should be encouraging girls not to be embarrassed by their bodies so that they’ll happily get changed in mixed sex facilities. Sounds like a massive safeguarding red flag to me!

twitter.com/rtuknews/status/1226901136566870018?s=21

OP posts:
Languishingfemale · 12/02/2020 22:13

People like Tatchell have no business trying to influence children and practice in schools. His comments about adults having sex with children should automatically disbar him. Yet in this 'woke' world of ours schools are abandoning many of their responsibilities for safeguarding and allowing people like this - with no qualifications in child development, child psychology, safeguarding or education - to "advise" on how schools should operate and how girls should undress in front of boys and men.

He evidently believes that he is beyond criticism - so dangerous.

CallofDoodee · 12/02/2020 22:17

How does this man have any sort of influence?

Please MNHQ don't delete posters discussing what is happening here.

I am fucking horrified at his comments - talk about in plain sight!

MummyOfBoyAndGirl · 12/02/2020 22:23

Terrifying if he is able to influence young people

Thelnebriati · 12/02/2020 22:24

You don''t need to be prosecuted to have a hate incident put on your record. All it takes is for anyone to make a complaint that you have expressed an opinion about women's rights or safeguarding and to have that comment framed as 'transphobia'.
This will show up on a DBS check.

The end result is that women who have concerns about safeguarding children (for example, raising the issue of mixed sex sleeping or changing arrangements) can fail a background check and so be prevented from working with them.

OhHolyJesus · 28/07/2021 13:23

I think this is the most recent thread, though there are several, on Tachell, so sharing this here

twitter.com/twisterfilm/status/1420342338552057858?s=21

OhHolyJesus · 28/07/2021 13:24

Full text from the Telegraph yesterday:

By
Hayley Dixon,
SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT ;
Melanie Newman
and
Julie Bindel
27 July 2021 • 9:30pm
Peter Tatchell
Peter Tatchell has argued that “children have sexual desires at an early age” as he praised the “courage” of those selling what he later described as a “pro-paedophilia” book, The Telegraph can reveal.

In a review of a 1986 collection of essays compiled by Warren Middleton, former vice-chairman of the Paedophile Information Exchange (PIE), Mr Tatchell, a gay rights campaigner, said that children should be “educated” so that they can decide when they want to have sex.

Mr Tatchell had even written a chapter for Middleton’s anthology - Radical perspectives on Childhood Sexuality, Intergenerational Sex, and the Social Oppression of Children and Young People - but has since attempted to distance himself, claiming that he was “conned” into contributing to “that vile book”.

The Telegraph can now reveal that a year after the book’s publication, Mr Tatchell submitted a review praising the way it “speaks coolly, clearly and radically about a subject which has far too long been shrouded in emotional hysteria and adult chauvinism”.

ADVERTISING

Mr Tatchell’s chapter in the book, written when the age of consent for gay men was 21, argued laws criminalising underage sex do more harm than good. Other chapters covered child pornography and prostitution, incest and “how to make paedophilia more acceptable”.

In the review for the newsletter of the Communist Party of Great Britain in 1987, Mr Tatchell wrote: “Society would remove a lot of fear, anxiety and depression if, instead of repressing children’s sexuality, it acknowledged the fact that many children have sexual desires at an early age and accordingly educated children, so they are able to make free, informed and responsible decisions about when and with whom they have sex.”

On Tuesday night, Mr Tatchell said that he had still not read the book when he submitted the review, which a colleague had drafted, adding: “I apologise unreservedly for putting my name to this review, and for failing to make clear my unconditional opposition to adults having sex with children.”

The review emerged just weeks after a documentary celebrating the campaigner’s life was released by Netflix.

Advertisement

In Hating Peter Tatchell, celebrities including Stephen Fry and Elton John line up to praise Mr Tatchell’s work while Chris Smith, the former Labour MP, describes him as a “national treasure” and Dr George Carey, the former Archbishop of Canterbury, says he was “on the right side of history”.

The documentary, in which he is interviewed by Sir Ian McKellen, makes no mention of his comments on children and sexual desires.

But Mr Tatchell has long been dogged by accusations of being a paedophile apologist.

He faced a storm of criticism in 1997 for writing a letter to The Guardian in defence of another controversial book. In the letter, he claimed that some of his friends “had sex with adults from the ages of nine to 13. None feel they were abused”.

He later said that the letter, which he pointed out said it was “impossible to condone paedophilia”, was edited before appearing in the newspaper.

In an interview republished on his own website claiming to set the record straight on his views, Mr Tatchell describes Middleton’s book as “pro-paedophilia”, saying: “I had no idea that it had any connection to PIE and that it would even mention paedophilia, let alone justify it.”

Advertisement
“If I had known, I would not have agreed to write anything for that dreadful, nauseating book.”

But his denials have been called into question by his review of the same book, still available in the archives of the British Library.

Headlined “Radical thoughts on consent”, Mr Tatchell noted in the review that Middleton had “found it impossible to get a publisher”

He continued: “I am only writing this review because it seems that no one else is willing to risk association with this taboo subject.”

He wrote that while the authors “oppose coercive and exploitative child sexual abuse” they “also argue that consenting, victimless sexual relationships between younger and older people should not be penalised by the law”.

The review goes on to argue there should be “greater rights for children” who should be “given opportunities to exercise power and choice in every facet of their lives including their sexual and emotional feelings”.

Mr Tatchell said last night that he had still not read the book and did not know of its connections to PIE when he was asked by “[a] person I trusted” to write a review condemning the censorship of it in 1987.

Advertisement
His colleague drafted the review as he was too busy, the former Labour Party Parliamentary candidate claimed, while Mr Tatchell himself made some stylistic changes.

Mr Tatchell claims that he only learnt of the true contents of the book and Middleton’s connections when it was sent to him years later and he “felt tricked and betrayed”.

“I am very sorry and deeply regret the terrible mistake of submitting this review. I was very wrong,” he said when approached by The Telegraph.

“It does not reflect my opinion that adults should never have sex with children and that children cannot consent to sex with adults. Once more, I apologise unreservedly.”

Mr Tatchell said that he “condemns” sex abuse and has “never knowingly been in contact with anyone involved or associated with PIE”.

He added: “I have always supported victims of child sex abuse in their quest for justice. For the record, my view is that paedophilia is the sexual abuse of children.”

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plodalong12 · 28/07/2021 14:23

He faced a storm of criticism in 1997 for writing a letter to The Guardian in defence of another controversial book. In the letter, he claimed that some of his friends “had sex with adults from the ages of nine to 13. None feel they were abused”.

He later said that the letter, which he pointed out said it was “impossible to condone paedophilia”, was edited before appearing in the newspaper.

If someone edited something I wrote and it made me out to be a paedophile when I wasn’t, I would sue them without a shadow of a doubt. Did PT sue the Guardian over this? I can’t find anything on Google.

plodalong12 · 28/07/2021 14:24

*made me out to be defending paedophilia, I should have wrote above.

Xenia · 28/07/2021 14:27

Most people who are wise don't sue because you just run massive risks of losing every penny you have and might not win anyway. However the bottom line here is that women and young girls should be the ones deciding who can come into our private spaces when we are taking our clothes off, not men like Tatchell.

The cult Children of God used similar arguments to this kind of thing and it went very very badly wrong and vast numbers of very small children were abused.

ChainJane · 28/07/2021 14:42

According to Tatchell the Guardian apologised. I guess he thought there was no need to sue if they had printed an apology.

I can't help thinking that the latest comments about shared changing rooms are just the natural progression of the "equality bandwagon" that has been rumbling on for the past century or so. Decades ago people thought that giving women the vote was radical or nonsensical. But the equality movement persisted and women got the vote. People thought equal pay for women was outrageous, because a woman doing the same job wouldn't actually work as hard as or be as productive as a man. People opposed the decriminalisation of homosexuality, they opposed the laws to prevent discrimination based on sexual orientation because they felt gay people were inferior and/or dangerous. More recently, people have opposed gay marriage because they believe marriage should be between a man and a woman.

All these obstacles were overcome, often despite great opposition. It's the same fight today with gender recognition and the idea that a male-to-female transitioner should be treated as a woman, or that there should not be single-gender spaces because they prevent people gaining access purely based on their gender.

The arguments against them are the same old arguments - it's stupid, it's offensive, it's dangerous. No doubt they will be overcome in time and people who argue that girls shouldn't be obliged to change in front of naked men at the swimming pool will be seen as offensive and outrageous as the argument that homosexuals are likely to be paedophiles is today.

The thing to remember is that those arguing for change don't care about the interests of those who want to keep the status quo. There's not point arguing, all that does is delay things. You can't stop progress, whether you see it as a good thing or not.

AlfonsoTheMango · 28/07/2021 14:56

I don't trust Peter Tatchell and know that he has no right to determine issues regarding children's safeguarding.

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