To not find 'guys' an offensive term?

[DrSheldonCooperPHD]

We have a new manager at work. Our team is 20 people (12 women and 8 men).

New manager held a mini informal meeting this morning, all very nice and very chatty. At the end he said something along the lines of 'thanks guys, great meeting' and one of the women in the team said 'excuse me? guys? That's extremely offensive to the majority of the team who are female!' And walked out of the meeting room.
The MD was also in the room and he and new manager left for another meeting shortly after so I've no idea what happened (if anything) after.

Would this offend you? It didn't even really register with me until she piped up. Everyone seemed very bemused by it all.

@Binterested thank you

What Bit said.

We don't mind because we are trained not to mind. Men mind so it doesn't happen to them. Because they're trained to mind. And that them minding will be listened to.

Feminism is partially just saying women are allowed to mind. That's why it's despised by so many.

Someone who is not nice is often referred to as a dick. Dick is slang for penis. That is some pretty well accepted body shaming of males there. Theaching them that their body parts are like not nice people.

I think you’ll find there’s some pretty equal op genital related shaming out there.

@samyeagar and being called a 'cunt'. No worse insult for some. That's a guy part, since guys is a gender neutral term. How about being called a 'fanny' or a 'tit' or a 'girl'. Or addressing gossiping or arguing men as 'ladies'.

Cunt is 'worse'. Why's that?

And @samyeagar that doesn't actually address the issue. That many women have explained at length. Why not address those points?

Binterested

hands up if you find Dick more insulting than Cunt. I know I don't. I don't know anyone who does.

there's no point railing against it
But there is. And thank goodness people didn't go:
oh there's no point railing against women having to have their father or husbands signature on their mortgage agreement
or
oh there's no point railing against women not having the vote
or
oh there's no point railing against men being paid more than women for doing the same job

And yes, again, language does affect thinking. If the default is men women might as well stay at home doing embroidery or something.

Try it. It's liberating. Use either gender neutral language (nobody cares) or female oriented language (you'll start a shitstorm). And then think about why that is.

I think you’ll find there’s some pretty equal op genital related shaming out there.

Indeed, but contextually, calling someone a dick, or a pussy is not actually referring to anyone's genitalia. Same exact words, entirely different and unrelated meanings depending on context.

Quick! Look over here at this other thing! Get distracted and you want ever achieve anything. I'll just move these goalposts in case anyone saw that you're right.

@samyeagar is this another rope analogy?

Calling someone a pussy or pussy whipped means they are like a cunt. A pussy is a word for female genitalia. 'Pussy whipped' is a misogynist term for being under the sway of a cunt or a woman.

A dick is a penis. That's the context. And no, we're not talking about ropes.

Contextually, "guy" singular generally means a single male person, unless it is in construction, then it is referring to a support rope. Context.

Contextually "guys" plural, commonly means a group of people, mixed or not mixed. Unless of course it is in construction where it refers to multiple support ropes. Context.

As far as slang and vulgar terms for genitalia, the exact same words in one context are very sex specific reference to genitalia, in other contexts that have nothing to do with genitals, they are far more sex neutral.

And words that magically change from male to unisex upon pluralisation are like that because male is default. Which is sexist. And therefore women can be pissed off about that if they choose to be.

I suggest everyone head over to Man Who Has it All for a million examples.

Obviously shes never seen the Goonies

I am pretty old, allegedly, and I hear myself saying that at at the end of lessons and meetings. To me it's just informal and inclusive of everybody .

How about a variant on the theme...

Dude.

Anecdotally of course, but both my sister and daughter use that term excessively to refer to both males and females. Seems to be quite the rage using that word sex neutrally these days. Back in the day when I was much younger, that term generally referred to males.

Which is sexist. And therefore women can be pissed off about that if they choose to be

Yep

And therefore women can be pissed off about that if they choose to be
they can, but no one has to actually care that someone has decided to be offended.

It wouldn't bother me at all.
No more than being called love, darling, sweetheart, duck, pet or girl does.

I don’t want people to feel offended. Or care that I am offended (I’m not). But maybe to ponder on why language evolves this way and not in the other direction. Why is even a hint of feminine so toxic to men? It’s just interesting and enlightening.

I feel really sorry for the new manager! She was awful for flouncing out, or even finding offence in this.
There's always one, as they say.

I use it & see it as an informal term for a group, mixed sex or not. What do people use instead?

there's no point railing against it

But there is. And thank goodness people didn't go:
oh there's no point railing against women having to have their father or husbands signature on their mortgage agreement
or
oh there's no point railing against women not having the vote
or
oh there's no point railing against men being paid more than women for doing the same job

That's hardly comparing like with like. Yes, fighting against specific quantifiable, identifiable injustices and coming up with a solution and mobilising to realise that goal is a good and honourable and ACHIEVABLE thing.

e.g. Women don't have the vote. Women should have the vote. - one heroic struggle later* - Women have the vote.

Trying to micromanage the uncontrollable tide of language to make it inoffensive to everyone is just plain Sisyphean impossibility.

*am I allowed to describe the suffragettes as 'heroic'?