Anyone's daughter go to Rainbows?

[Scottishgirl85]

I have an almost 5 year old who has been on the waiting list for Rainbows for about a year. I checked today if she might have a place, and have been told she won't get in before turning 7 unless I become a helper, in which case she can start next term!

I went to Brownies and enjoyed it, but remember there being quite a heavy religious element, is that still the case?

Just trying to work out if it's worth me getting heavily involved in - essentially, is Rainbows a nice enough activity to commit to?

Thanks!

I helped run a rainbow group for a year, then switched to be a Cub leader after we moved- we now have DH as a Scout leader (has been for years!), Me as Cub leader, one DD in Cubs, one in Beavers.

Both Scouts and Guides are great. I left Rainbows just before the programme change but get the impression it's more structured now. The actual activities depends so much on the leaders- and the same is true in Scouting.

More adult helpers are needed everywhere at the moment- and most leaders have full time jobs. I'm the only one of the 20 or so adults involved in our Scouting group not to have a full time job or in full time education (as two of our leaders are 18yo and in SSixth Form!)

Girl guiding is secular now, although you get the odd leader who can't let go of the religious days.

Rainbows, brownies etc varies greatly in quality depending on who the leader is. They're all volunteers though so I've never complained. I think it's good that they are ballsy enough to say you can have a place if you volunteer.

I volunteered at rainbows for most of the 2 yrs my daughter was there as they lost a helper and the unit would have had to close anyway. I lined up a replacement in the last term too, so they've been able to stay open. I enjoyed it - kids that age are great fun, and often the newest, smallest ones need reassurance so that's often what you're doing as a helper - holding their hand and helping them settle in.

Brownies on the other hand - I've helped out once as a one off and frankly never again! The kids are that much older they don't need a hand hold, and it was very well organised chaos. They have enough regular helpers anyway every week anyway.

Better to start off in Scouts where this hasn't reached.....yet.

Scouts has the same batshit policies I'm afraid - any toilet / tent sharing is decided on gender, not sex. So yes, penis having scouts can shower, toilet and sleep in with vagina having scouts.

@DobbyLovesSocks Completely disagree. It's great that both genders are allowed in Beavers. Of course you don't need to segregate kids' activities by gender.

The only hint at religion when I was there - 20 years ago - was in the promise. "I promise that I will do my best to love my god".

Other than saying those words, religion literally wasn't mentioned. We also got invited to church parades and services, but it would be up to the individual parents whether to take their children to those.

Depends on the leaders how good the group is - our most-local one was not the best run in the world and we ended up moving across to Beavers which has been superb - but we very much had a leader who expected the girls to be happy meekly colouring in every week and has a bit of a reputation locally as not being the greatest. Next area over has a fantastic leader (I know them from other stuff) and do loads.

For those who say that you can't complain unless you try to change it - I'd put in years as a volunteer at the linked Brownies before this, gently trying to change things and the whole "we've always done it this way" mentality was too deeply entrenched to alter.

IN my opinion it is important for girls to have an all girls setting
Having said that I think Guiding will come under increasing pressure to let boys in

Of course girls don't need all girls settings what sexist nonsense. Activities should be based on the actual activity. They shouldn't let boys into rainbows then insist on playing football but of course you don't need to artificially segregate the genders - especially at this age. You're free to create private events and activities for your daughters to include only girls if you for some reason for the need to.

The whole reason we chose rainbows for DD was so that she could do similar activities to cubs, beavers, scouts etc without boys. She hears enough "girls can't do this, girls can't do that" at school - I wanted her to be somewhere that girls can do anything they want.

All the research shows that girls' only environments are good for girls' self esteem, confidence and leadership skills. And girls' only schools get the best results. So yeah, girls do need girl only spaces to achieve their full potential.

@DontGoJasonWaterfalls

Rainbows/Brownies don't do the same activities as Beavers/Cubs. If your DD wanted to do those activities she should have just joined Beavers (which she would have been allowed to do!).

@CripsSandwiches which activities should she have joined beavers for that she couldn't do in girlguiding?

Girl guiding do a lot more crafts than Beavers, less physical activities, less sport.

@CripsSandwiches from what I can tell that varies by unit. I know some units only do drawing. DD's does plenty of practical stuff.

DD couldn't join Beavers anyway as she is only 5.

It's very, very dependent on the leaders. If the leaders have a skill they'll build it into the unit's program. There's a loose program from gghq but it's very much up the the leaders to adapt to suit them / the girls (inc. disabilities) / the physical space they have. Eg. When I was a brownie & guide the hut we met in was down an unmade lane, loads of grounds, so we did huge amounts of outdoor activities, lots of cookouts. DD won't be able to do that because her hut is in the centre of town, with a small car park as the only outdoor space. My mum joined as a leader (so that I could skip the waiting list!) because the brown owl was shit at craft and needed someone who was good at it to run those kinds of activities - before my mum joined they didn't do much craft at all. Getting your licence to run overnight trips, and another one to run camping trips, is a pain in the arse and a lot of extra work, so if you're lucky to have a few leaders wirh the correct licences you'll get to do more overnight stays. That's the nature of it being a volunteer led organisation - there is always going to be a variation in what people have the skills, time and inclination to do.

While it's somewhat dependent on the leaders there are also larger events organised by the organisation as a whole. My son in Beavers takes part in football tournaments, activity weekends etc that are lai on by the Scouts organisation not the local leadership. There's much more campfire building, climbing walls physical stuff etc. Guides never have football tournaments - they do have some camping/outdoorsy stuff but it is definitely more crafts based etc (which is what DD likes so works for us). Obviously if you wanted your DD to do "exactly what the boys do in Beavers" then you'd send her to Beavers! The whole point of rainbows/guides is to provide something different.

I think we're just lucky enough to live in a county with very active hands on and outdoorsy girlguiding units then 🤷‍♀️

Like I said, I like that DD gets to do similar (I never said exactly the same) activities to Beavers, in an all girls environment.

they do have some camping/outdoorsy stuff

I hiked up a Swiss glacier in guides. I built fires for cooking, and enormous, probably dangerously so, campfires. I put up fucking massive great big Icelandic canvas tents and whacked in the huge wooden pegs with a wooden mallet Thor would be proud to wield. I abseiled and climbed. Canoed and built rafts. I built "camp kitchens" in the woods with a ball of string, a single metal grill, and whatever else we could find. The only think my brother did in scouting that I didn't do in guiding was skin a rabbit.

Brownie Leader and District Commissioner here...

For all you parents who've had their daughter on the waiting list since she was 2, it doesn't make any difference. Girls are offered spaces in strict age order. Time on waiting list doesn't make any difference.

Guiding nationally has a huge waiting list. A few years ago it needed something like 50,000 new volunteers in order to be able to offer a place to every eligible girl on the waiting list.

I started helping so that my eldest DD could get a place, and I love it! I have a full on day job, but come Friday evening I become Snowy Owl for a few hours. Almost 20 years later DDs are all grown up, but I'm still volunteering.

We have parents who don't want to formally volunteer but who help with things like shopping for activities, which take the weight off a lot.

I'd thoroughly recommend getting involved in some capacity. Guiding is a fantastic organisation if only it would stop accepting males if any age to unit meetings and sleepovers, as long as they say they're female, but without asking for any GRC, nor highlighting this on the risk assessment.

I'm against it because of their policy of rejecting girls who are gender non conforming, and allowing males to identify in as 'girls' which means sharing sleeping and toilet areas

Rainbows is for 5-7 year olds 🤷🏻‍♀️. I doubt this will be an issue for the OP or her daughter

It will if her daughter goes on a sleepover and a mtf person with a willy helps her get dressed, or attends to her if she's wet her knicks or something.

Exactly Mrs.

What if Brown Owl was a pre-op trans identifying XY individual, who wanted to help your 7 year old girl change for a night over?
Sleeping in the same room, and you wouldnt be told because Brown Owl used female words to describe themselves.

t will if her daughter goes on a sleepover and a mtf person with a willy helps her get dressed, or attends to her if she's wet her knicks or something.

So are you suggesting she joins Beavers instead?

I get the arguments but not allowing a child to join because of it is frankly bonkers.

No. Not suggesting she joins Beavers.

A few years ago it needed something like 50,000 new volunteers in order to be able to offer a place to every eligible girl on the waiting list

I so wish I could commit to volunteering every week. They work so hard. I feel like I'm doing a little bit by helping them get their first aid skills builder but I wish I could do more!

Even that's a help though Dont. Thank you.