South West England Vs the Red Wall areas post Brexit

[Tellmetruth4]

I’m hearing lots about the ‘red wall’ areas of Northern England and the Midlands and lots and lots of talk about how funds are going to pushed to these areas, investment in infrastructure etc etc.

However, am I wrong in believing that many areas of the South also voted Brexit and are also poor? Places like Cornwall etc? Do they feel a bit left out and cheated that no politicians are talking about their areas, are planning to invest in or planning to hold parliament in them (like they are in Sunderland today)?

Cornwall is ignored generally and treated differently to the rest of the UK - lowest per head spend on education and end of life care for example - and we're the only county not to have a subsidised bus service - hence why public transport down here is so expensive! Throw the ridiculously low wages/high cost of living into the mix, and the lack of investment and job opportunities here and you can see why people might vote for something they think might improve their lot. No idea if they'd be right - but it can't really make things much worse!!

For many years the SW were the natural heartlands of the Liberal party, but over the years they became more conservative due to the Lib Dem's abandoning them and becoming seemingly more interested in urban areas. At the same time labour has never really had a foothold because labour has never really got the rural poor. So that left the Tories who were the natural party of the farmers and the fishermen. I think that the thing that people don't appreciate is the high level of support for Tories in these rural areas.

The region also has some of the most deprived areas in Europe but it seemed like the whole of Westminster didn't give a shit. This is why, despite massive levels of European investment into projects for regeneration in the SW they voted leave.

Currently there is no real party that represents the real SW. the Tories have most of the region for the simple reason that there's no liberal party and labour never understood the region. The two labour seats in the area are the cosmopolitan Exeter and Plymouth Sutton.

No party represents the SW anymore and it is a massive opportunity for both liberals and labour to gain seats there - if only they cared, which I'm not sure they do.

I'm not from the SW but I and my family lived there for years.

Not sure Exeter is 'cosmopolitan' precisely. Rammed full of students more like, who being young and idealistic, vote Labour.

It's fascinating how this mythical concept "the North" has become the obsession now that we've supposedly got brexit done . That & towns rather than cities etc. Erm, quite a lot of us live in neither.

The south west is, as you say @Leighhalfpennysthigh overlooked & unrepresented but when it is talked about all focus is on Devon & Cornwall. I live in Dorset & we're one of the v few counties not to have its own BBC local radio, high levels of deprevation, massively high house prices & 2nd home ownership & several of the local secondaries are in special measures. The local councils have all been abolished & one big unitary authority.

It used to be a lib dem marginal but solidly brexit so no need to worry about losing seats in 2024 therefore another 5 years of insignificance & decline. Oh well, at least I have gin & mums net

Most likely nobody will get any money so I wouldn't worry about it. I think the attention to 'the north' is purely because they want to win labour seats for a long time. It's not like they suddenly care about northerners or deprived areas.

the Tories have most of the region for the simple reason that there's no liberal party and labour never understood the region.

Not just that 'simple reason' - also because there are also sections of massive wealth and landowners in those beautiful cornish/devon/dorset villages who are natural Tories.

Also, the media count about 75% of England as "the North" don't forget, so even, in the unlikely event a few £££ were thrown towards "The North", it would be spread so thinly it isn't likely to have any noticeable effect.

@scaryteacher that used to be the case in Exeter, but it has changed a lot in the last decade.

I agree that Dorset gets overlooked completely and in the same way that the north has a very flexible meaning, the south west to a lot of people means Bristol.

The problem is that Devon and Cornwall have no political party that represents them. As a pp said there are wealthy people down there - either people who grew up there or, more and more, wealthy Tory supporting retired people. But amongst that there are real pockets of deprivation, parts of Torbay for example are among the most deprived areas in Britain, same with the Penzance area in Cornwall.

The road network is shit beyond Exeter and the main railway into the South West is on the edge of a cliff. And buses.....hmm. If Flybe go under then the regional airports are fucked as well. Driving around in summer is a nightmare (I do it frequently as I have family and clients in the SW).

Many people struggle to access healthcare and other services and can't afford the extortionate prices for the poor public transport. Wages are lower than average too. Housing stock is below average condition in many areas and many people experience fuel poverty.

Yet all the politicians see is the nice scenery and beaches......

Leigh hit the nail on the head and Exeter is slightly more Cosmoplitan than you think. It’s not all students by any means.

The facilities and transport links in Devon are woeful but still they build more houses with with no infrastructure.

The A30 from Exeter down is a fast road, or was when I drove it last week as far as Launceston on my way home from Brussels. Agree something needs to he done about the line at Dawlish, but that has been the case for decades.

Plymouth City Council were very stupid in closing the airport. I don't want to schlep to Newquay, Exeter or Bristol to fly. Buses...well, 0730 weekday mornings the bus is outside my house in a sleepy Cornish village, and there are lots of them haring round the lanes every time I go out in the car. We have a train station not too far away as well, so access to Plymouth by public transport is possible.

Having They did the same with Cornish councils...we have one big unitary authority, which imo concentrates everything on Truro and loses the local connections.

Having moved back in October, there have been no problems with healthcare access; New patient check, mammogram done; bloods, flu jab and smear to come.

I don't think poor housing stock is just a SW issue, neither is fuel poverty.

My nephew lives in Exeter, and says there are so many students,and so much student housing going up, it just isn't true.

We both work in Exeter and live close by. Really don’t see that, have lived in loads of studenty cities. The city centre is dying as transport links are woeful, prices sky high, ditto parking. Some crappy empty buildings/ areas are being made into flats. Not sure why that is a bad thing.The A30 is of zero use to us in the South unless we’re supposed to go across Dartmoor first. The A38 isn’t fit for purpose, it’s a battle to get into work, can’t afford the extortionate non existent late bus service and the fatalities/ crashes are far too frequent.

www.theguardian.com/society/2020/jan/25/former-red-wall-areas-could-lose-millions-in-council-funding-review

Leigh is correct. Exeter has changed over the 20 years I've lived down here and is more cosmopolitan now, although nowhere near the degree of larger cities.

I agree about the roads and railways too. My closest mainline station is on the Waterloo line, a pathetic single-track entity. If you are lucky, there is one train per hour run by SW Trains/Railway/whatever. Their trains have no wifi, no charging points and on every train I've been on in the last 2 years (when not on strike), no refreshments until we got to Basingstoke. The other line which runs beyond Exeter via Dawlish is scenic but subject to tides and weather, effectively cutting-off any one to the S & W of Exeter wanting to use the train. The A30 is a good road, but in the summer, it is dire. The M5 likewise.

People believe East Devon is a wealthy area. It isn't. There are pockets of wealth and lots of second homes. Youngsters in minimum wage jobs have no hope of getting on the housing ladder. I work a couple of days per week in a local primary school. The Head describes the poverty there as "working poor" - both parents are in work but still in receipt of benefits and struggling to make ends meet.

In the last couple of elections, we have had a wonderful Independent candidate who took on the incumbent Tory. Tory guy refused to attend any hustings with her, knowing that he could rely on the "retired to Sidmouth/Budleigh Salterton" brigade who would never vote any other way. He made way for a newbie in December, but still the Tories scraped in. I don't know anyone who voted for him. There is a massive disparity here and the gulf seems to widen every year.

I live in the SW, and in my experience many people aren’t very interested in politics and they certainly don’t bother to look at their MP’s voting record before they vote. Plenty of people here don’t know who their MP is.

@scaryteacher I'm glad you got everything sorted and good luck with your future life in Cornwall. However....

Being a student in a city is a totally different experience to living there and raising a family. I have been a student in Birmingham, Southampton and Leeds. I have no idea what it is like to actually live in those cities.

My brother lives in Exeter and, through his work, knows a lot about the problems of the south west. The university in Exeter is absolutely expanding, but along with bringing in students - it has been responsible for bringing in technical and academic staff, businesses and research. That has completely changed the city and it has become more prosperous and, yes, more cosmopolitan. There are still areas of deprivation, but in general, it is a great place to live. Indeed, I do love there part time.

The A30 in January is a different beast to the A30 in July. It is only one of three routes into Cornwall and the A38 and the A39 are equally as bad. Once in Cornwall it is difficult to get anywhere due to crap roads.

The regional airports - Exeter and Newquay are entirely dependent on Flybe. It's a good service, but it is vulnerable.

They wont get anything because brexit is going to make the country poorer. There was nothing stopping the Tories investing in poorer regions whilst a member of the EU.

Scary your experience of bus services/ public transport and healthcare is the opposite to mine in Devon. So much so we’re taking out private health insurance and got another car thus stuffing up the A38 even more. So many of us are having to get up earlier and earlier to avoid frequent queues caused by accidents. That said the 10 mile bus trip to work would cost the best part of a tenner even if it did turn on time on its hourly route which it never does. Teens are supposed to cough up similar.😱Taking a family into town is insanely expensive.

But hey you can get to Cornwall from Brussels ok.

The harsh truth is we got Tory government despite the SW being treated like shit. Therefore there is no incentive for any self respecting Tory to lift a single penny to help them.

Politicians are like insurance companies. If you don't switch, you'll get shafted.

If you have always voted for the same party, I can guarantee that you are the person that party cares least about.

Veg My Mum can get on the bus in Devon and be deposited outside my house in Cornwall. Equally, I could get from the Tamar Valley to Plymouth, or to Tavistock using public transport if I didn't want to drive.

Even though I've lived just outside Brussels for most of the past 13 years (HM Forces), I've been down to the Devon/Cornwall borders several times each year to see Mum; to rent a holiday cottage and see my house as well. I don't think the roads here are worse than parts of Hampshire, especially around Fareham and Gosport for example, which are permanently logjammed. Having moved back to Cornwall last year, I still don't think it's too bad on the roads, but then around Brussels it is hell on wheels, especially the Ring. We just got used to leaving more time than needed to get anywhere, so still do that now.

Leigh Until dh got posted abroad, we'd been down here since 1986, and I didn't move til 2006 to join him. The A30 is far better than it was then; I don't use the A38 from Plymouth upcountry unless I have to, as I've never liked it. It's bits of the A303 that need sorting next, especially at Amesbury. That's the big hold up coming down normally.

My nephew isn't a student in Exeter...he lives and works there.

@SerendipityJane I agree. None of the parties understand the SW, but with the Tories there's a feeling that they support farming and fishing so the poorer areas dependent on those industries will come for them. It is always assumed that poor communities are naturally labour supporters, but that's not true in the south west. Therefore the results of the general election were not much of a shock to those of us who have seen poor, deprived communities in the sw continually voting Tory despite the, doing fuck all for the people.

Labour has never bothered to make itself attractive to the SW - apart from Exeter and Plymouth Sutton and the Lib Dem's, after Paddy Ashdown turned its back on its natural heartlands in a bid to be trendy and urban.

The Green Party are totally alien to a region heavily dependent on cars, farming etc.

So the choice is Tory. Or the Brexit party.

@scaryteacher you are completely right, the A303 is awful!

However, the Tamar Valley is pretty good for connections. Further down into Cornwall, or in the middle of Devon it's not so easy.

Don't forget North Devon too- if you want to know what truly dreadful public transport looks like. The only trainline is the tourist 'Tarka Line'. Bideford, Ilfracombe, Barnstaple have terrible services and significant economic deprivation sitting alongside the wealthy retirees and second home owners.

Luckily Leigh dh being in the RN meant we had to be at most 30 minutes from Devonport dockyard, so geographically, it's Plymouth, West Devon, Ivybridge at a push or the Tamar Valley and Saltash.

We were also lucky in that he never got posted back to Hants (where we both grew up). Every time I went to stay with my brother I was appalled by the sheer amount of traffic there, and that was coming from Brussels.

I could probably live as far down as Liskeard without issues, and Launceston is right on the A30 as well. It's one of the trade offs for living down here however, and I don't want to live anywhere else, which is why kept the house when we were away.

Even with swept up public transport there are still issues; strikes, leaves on the line, a car stuck on the tram lines etc, so nowhere is perfect.

I taught in Cornwall under a Labour government with a Lib Dem MP. Cost me a fortune in resourcing and basic supplies.