To believe that I will leave teaching altogether within a couple of years ?

[Phoenixxx]

I am fed up of verbal abuse from students, and being spoken to like dirt and mocked. Some of them are astonishing. I'm fairly thick skinned, I get all sorts of comments about how I look, how I walk, my voice, anything, but it just wouldn't happen in a lot of other professions and we shouldn't have to put up with it. Because of the cost/issues attached with permanent exclusion, most are back in your lessons within a couple of days, even the next day.
Other teachers in my school have had death threats, and luckily i've never been assaulted.
But I have some very intimidating characters in my lessons, and the fear is there.
Like most other teachers, I frequently work more than my directed hours without extra pay. The 30 minute lunch break is rarely a full break for you to sit and do what you want.
I barely have any energy in the evenings.
Is it like this in all schools ? I saw on Facebook a friend who was posting practical jokes that colleagues were making on her during the day. I couldn't believe that people actually have the time at work to sit and mess around like that.
People going out for cigarette breaks when they please.
It's a shame for the students who do want to be there, who have good behaviour. I would like a less stressful job with better pay and no daily abuse or intimidation.
Did anyone leave teaching and find themselves happier in a new career ? Or is anyone in a school where majority of students are very well-behaved and respectful ?

I left this year. Whenever I go to the doctor’s I notice the sign that says any patient being verbally abusive to staff will be banned from the surgery. Same at the train station and the post office. The kids I used to have to teach will be absolutely astonished when they go out into the world and discover that their actions have consequences. When they find out their boss won’t take them for a nice hot chocolate and cosy chat when they swear at them or refuse to follow instructions.

Schools aren’t preparing children for the world and teachers are expected to put up with disgusting abuse and harassment. It’s ridiculous. I would never, ever go back!

I don't blame you at all for leaving this profession.
It's true, it's all about Ofsted and passing exams, it's amazing what we are expected to put up with.
I had a year 11 student say out loud that if he could kill a certain teacher in the school he would, and then made a comment about how hitler was a 'good man'. Day in isolation and now back in usual lessons.

I think it's especially tough because of expectations. I work in housing. I will be sworn at today. It's not every day but at least once a week I'm sworn at, shouted at or similar. I expected when I went into housing decades ago it would happen.

But teaching shouldn't be like that. Guiding young people in a mainstream school shouldn't involve that. It is a massive, intractable, societal issue that schools and teachers can't solve alone.

Not all schools are like that (for instance, most of the secondaries where I live & work are not like that), although I don’t think there are any where the job isn't exhausting. The onslaught of rudeness really gets to me too though, I’ve had some particularly grim classes this year and have been really surprised by how much it affects me.

Your school don’t sound very supportive, and this in the past has been the deciding factor for my friends who left the profession early on. Is it worth looking elsewhere at other schools, before deciding to leave altogether?

A lost generation in some cases. Very sad.

Thanks for replies. I agree it shouldn't be like this, don't like to generalise, but this is a challenging school in a not great area, I do wonder if the behaviour would be the same in a top grammar/private school in a rich suburb ?
We have the on-call system for highly disruptive students but half the time, nobody turns up to collect them.
I ended up giving the year 8s a lecture today about their rudeness. I was covering for a member of SLT, and some of them more or less admitted they will behave 'because it's him'.

Oh I do know this feeling.

I've taught for 17 years and changed school last summer in what I felt was a 'make or break move'. But realistically, though management are a bit better, the constant confrontation and battle are exhausting and demoralising and I wish I could get out.

Realistically though, I'll probably still be teaching and miserable in 30 years, because when I try and think what I could do instead for similar pay my mind is blank.

Sorry, that's not very positive, but know that you are not alone!

Try a different school. Could you get into teaching a level.. different ball game

I know what you mean, I feel like that would be the same anywhere.
It is a constant battle with some students. I have some year 11s at the moment who are just refusing to work in the subject as they are 'dropping it next year', it's not a core subject and they just don't care about it.
I've tried to just stop raising my voice altogether, though when you have a class of 30 and you can't get everyone silent it's tough.
I am also wondering what I could do for similar/more money.

Go to a different school. The independent schools don’t put up with poor behaviour. If there are any near you it’s worth looking into. Longer school day but lots of holiday and time not spent writing up behaviour reports. I feel really bad for the children who do behave and want to learn in schools where this goes on.

Having had a teacher friend told by a six year that he would murder her children and her I'm not surprised people are leaving.

Teaching A level would be great, I used to have a class of 2 in year 13 and it was just bliss. Both students always did the work, wanted to be there, zero issues.
Thanks for the suggestion, i'll have a look at independent schools.
I also feel bad for these students who have to be here. I have a class of loud, challenging year 10 boys, and 2 lovely, quiet girls and I really do feel for them.

I’ve worked in a lot of schools, and haven’t come across a situation as bad as you’ve described (I’m not saying I don’t believe you), but I have worked in some rough schools where there might be a small number of students like you’ve described. I’ve also worked in a couple of brilliant schools. Obviously the demographic of the catchment area has some influence, but the culture of the school and the attitude of SLT
also has a massive impact. The best school I worked in didn’t have the most well to do catchment area, but certainly not the worst, had a very basic uniform (wasn’t spending half my life telling kids to tuck their shirts in rather than teaching) and had a brilliant head teacher who supported his staff 100% and a strong, well implemented behaviour policy. Worst place was the one where we had a briefing after ofsted had left, the heads first words were “I’m fucking pissed off at you all”!

If you want to stay in teaching maybe look at some other schools, they aren’t all like your current one. Yes they all have the pressures of OFSTED and all the other crap that goes alongside teaching but some schools manage it better than others. It’s not for everyone but I loved doing day to day supply teaching, I got to see lots of different schools without any commitment beyond 3.30. (Although I nearly walked out of one at lunchtime)

@ioioitsoff that's horrific ! Did the child get excluded ? I hope so.
In my previous school, a child was permanently excluded for telling the head that he was going to 'bang him out.'
It just sent the message that it's only really if you do something to the head that you risk exclusion.

It is sad as it has always been hard work and more hours than is probably healthy for a work/life balance, but I loved it when I first started. Leaving for an office job which was 8 hours a day (taking no work or responsibility home), a lot less stress, better terms and conditions and more pay was the best decision I ever made. It is scary that it's been made so unappealing that people are (understandably) leaving in droves, and nothing is being done.

I'm hearing you OP. The levels of poor behaviour in my own, mainstream, school are absolutely astonishing. I recently had a boy moved into my form after parents of children in his original form group complained about him. He is known for his vulgar and highly offensive language, violence and generally horrible demeanour. He's only 10. He frequently calls staff members 'sex abusers' , 'cun*s', and tells us to fuck off. He's punched and hit, destroyed property and assaulted pupils. There is no punishment for him as there is literally nothing we can do but try and control him. His mum is useless and needs to give him a good telling off. He's just one of many. It's a horrible profession in this regard.

The trouble is is that a very 'them and us' ethos has been encouraged by the government which has trickled down to the pupils. Nobody is on the teachers' side any more. Even headteachers aren't on the teachers' side as they are under pressure to get excellent results and again, that trickles down. Pupils are accutely aware that teachers actually have very little power to enforce consequences, especially when not supported at home. We are all peeing in the wind. I left last year and although I know I will never find another job for the same money I also know I can work my paid hours in a supportive, respectful environment and go home to see my daughter before bed, spend evenings with my husband and not panic on a Sunday morning because I had a lie in and didn't start work early enough.

Different schools have different pressures. A naice leafy area could be easier to work in behaviour wise, but pushy parents and mental health issues linked to absent professional parents, bullying etc can he just as bad.

A relative of mine teaches in an independent school and the parents are so entitled it's unbelievable.

The grass isn't always greener

I worked in a rough inner city school for nearly ten years. It was pretty good when I started but went steadily down hill, mostly after it converted to an academy! Sounded easily as bad as your school at the end. The on call SLT who never arrive is very familiar. I moved to a secondary in a small town and it’s lovely! The majority of the kids are really good kids and the pastoral team are excellent and have a strong relationship with the kids and their families. I would definitely recommend trying a new school before leaving teaching, doesn’t have to be grammar or independent, just a nice one! I still have one difficult class and the odd difficult student but they are NOTHING compared to what I used to have to deal with! Good luck!

The behaviour in grammar schools is very good, pupils are very polite and motivated. Unfortunately, there are not many left.
I used to teach in a school where the majority of the pupils were Sikh , the behaviour was very good and nice atmosphere in the school.
Could you try to change schools?

There are plenty of secondary schools where the standards of behaviour are good. Move to a school in a better area, or with a better management or teach primary. You don’t have to leave teaching!

Thanks for all the replies. That is very true about extra pressure in certain schools. I don't have a single class without disruptive students, I have a class who are chatty but I manage to control them, and there are no really nasty or rude ones. Most other classes have at least 1 'character' known well in the school who will require on-call, or who will just be plain rude to me. I've managed to get some students on side by just having a very calm approach, as I don't think they respond well to raised voices. However some students are just rude, nasty and disrespectful no matter what, and it's a constant battle.

I left teaching a few years ago and am now a writer. I still have nightmares about being in front of the class and my PowerPoint not loading!! :) I left and did supply for a year and must say the schools I did supply in were excellent so there’s some good ones out there . I also did exam marking for one school as they didn’t want their teachers to be too tired from marking their mocks! A good school in my opinion just needs one thing: a headteacher on the side of his staff and doesn’t stand nonsense (ok well perhaps not JUST that, but after doing supply I learnt that was what was key!). Was in shock when on my first day of supply had a lovely class but a kid who swore at me and called me a whore. He was not only out for two days but by lunch, headteacher had found me and said he’d called parents personally and came to apologise on his schools behalf. I never had any trouble with any students there again and realised THAT’S how it’s done! I really enjoyed supply but just felt I’d fell out of love with teaching by then...

It’s definitely not like this everywhere - I work in an inner city academy with a very diverse intake. Poor behaviour is the exception, and management are very supportive. I would look around before giving up on teaching

I teach in Scotland. Since 2016, there have been 4 permanent exclusions in the whole country. Four. You can imagine what behaviour is like.

Last week, it took three promoted staff to get a pupil to leave a room and in the end he only left because the rest of the class (including a girl with mobility issues and several ASD students) were moved classroom to continue working without him. This same pupil has this year told me to fuck off on numerous occasions, has squared up to a male colleague and called him a cunt, I could go on... Several short exclusions, but no long-term solution.