Moving out of rental house and old inventory - how to get deposit back?

[WellWhyNot]

Hi all,

Looking for some advice please!

Moving out of a shared house (all housemates on same shared rental contract) after I lived here for a year.

The house hasn’t been inspected by the landlord/estate agents for at least 5 years - but we’ve been told we will have an inspection after we leave.

The inventory that the estate agent is using is a really old one (about 5 years old)

Apart from one person who’s still here from 5 years ago, the tenants who lived here 5 years ago have all moved out, and a lot of the items mentioned in the inventory have changed/are not in the house anymore.

We mentioned this to the estate agent, as we thought it was unfair to be asked to match the condition of the house when we move out to the condition on the 5 year old inventory (first of all, because of wear and tear of the house over 5 years, and secondly because a lot of the items in that inventory are not in the house anymore).

Also concerned about how estate agents will view wear and tear (the house was in disrepair when I moved in). We will definitely clean the house before we leave and may get a handyman to do light repairs, but I worry about how the estate agents will judge wear and tear.

What are our options? Do we have any way of getting our deposits back, given the outdated inventory and wear and tear?

Thanks!

What things aren't in the house anymore??

A variety of things - like chairs and tables. And my room isn’t even listed on the inventory (the estate agents have just put another bedroom twice ).

Did you take photos when you arrived and when you left?
I’ve done this with my two when they’ve shared accommodation at uni... I had heard many a tale of deposits being kept due to non existent damage/damage already in place prior to moving in.
What did the Estate Agents say when you approached them about the five year old inventory?

1MoreWine yep I took photos of my room when I moved in. Didn’t take any photos of the common areas (lounge, kitchen etc) as I didn’t think I needed to - I realise now I should have done this!

When my housemate told the estate agent about the 5-year-old inventory, the estate agent replied, saying she didn’t care and it was our problem to sort out.

I don't know if the situation in a shared tenancy is different but in a standard private tenancy the deposit must be protected in a deposit scheme.
There must be an inventory from the date you moved in. If the landlord cannot price the condition of the house on the date you moved in then they cannot hold any of the deposit back.
The tenancy deposit scheme adjudicate.

Prove. Not price.

Yeah they’re talking crap. If someone moved out a new inventory would have to be done if you’re all paying separately. If you’re not paying separately
Then it’s all on the person who’s the only person on the tenancy

Unfortunately I think you'll find that you (the tenants) will be responsible to make sure that all of the inventory is there! Actually none of it should have ever been taken out of the property as it was not yours to get rid of.

So the op is responsible for something removed from the house 4 years ago when she wasn't even living there as a tenant?

When you moved in you should have signed an agreement and inventory. If inventory is 5 years old, it is not your responsibility. Agency is telling you lies. Your deposit was supposed to be put into deposit scheme, details of which you should be given by the agent/landlord. If it was not put into a scheme, you can take agency/landlord to court and get x3 the amount of the deposit. Look it up on the internet, arm yourself with the knowledge and tell all of this to the agency. They will be glad to give your deposit back! If you still have some months left on a tenancy, I would personally not pay last month's rent, informing them that they can keep my deposit as the last month rent- if you have suspicion that they are planning to keep your deposit. It is harsh, but sometimes it's the only way.

It wasn’t a shared house but we had similar inventory issues. In our case we were never given the one for our flat despite pointing out we had received, and obviously not signed, the one for another flat in the block many many times over. And that coupled with a greedy landlord trying to charge for a lot of really strange stuff, e.g. £10 for a hello kitty toilet brush that never existed meant we couldn’t reach an agreement. In the end we gave up, went to the TDS and got the lot back minus the professional clean charge (which we weren’t disputing anyway since it was in the contract). I’d suggest you look into doing the same, if you haven’t signed an inventory then they should find in your favour- it did for us anyway.

Make sure your room is spotless and forget the rest - it's all you can do, especially as the others are staying.

My top tip from experience of at least a dozen HMO rentals with three student DC and 8 degrees is to lash it three quid or do on a pack of oven pride and make the cooker gleam. Oh, and wash the fridge out. That alonr will help save £100 of the deposit.

Next time take at least 100 photos on moving in day, especially closeups of stains, marks and dirt anywhere. That has saved us £100s!

Thanks everyone for your replies!

Just to clarify the situation:

• I made sure to take photos of my own room when I moved in and have these to hand to dispute any queries the estate agent/landlord may have about the condition of my room

• I don’t think it’s fair at all that, as I and Celticrose both mention in separate posts, I should be held responsible by the agency/landlord for things in an inventory that weren’t there when I moved in (as I mentioned previously, the estate agent is using a 5 year old inventory and I only moved in a year ago)

• I’m moving out in 2 weeks and have already paid my last month of rent. As PP suggest, I don’t think paying my last month of rent would have been a good idea, as it would have obviously annoyed the landlord and given him/the estate agency grounds to be even more critical at the moving-out inspection

To get around this whole situation, housemates and I have just said, we’ll try and find proof to back up our claims that the inventory doesn’t match the condition of the house by showing photos of the house when we moved in to the agency

Well done - I think you've been wise and careful as far as you possibly could be.

Missing items from the original inventory, if it has no photos, can be quickly and cheaply replaced from charity shops, if there are questions raised. A table and chairs in an HMO won't have been new! Try to match any descriptions as to number of chairs etc.

One student DC moved into an HMO with three friends, new contract, and the inventory included a wooden breadboard, split in two, and a lidless kitchen rubbish bin... Quick phone call to the agent soon sorted that.

Another big 7 bedroom HMO DS shared had a tiny backyard with two broken washing machines filling it as well as dozens of other issues. I made that agent come and do a walk round with me and a camera and a clipboard before anybody moved in. He kept bleating, "But the seven of them looked round and were happy," to which I just said, "They're students! And they're paying £X,000 a month between them. Would you live here with it in this state? Would you let your son or daughter move in?"

A shedload of work got done in double quick time. DC are all a little older and a lot cannier now and sort these things themselves. Job done.😉

The biggest problem landlords have is cleaning, clearing out of dumped possessions and damaged carpets. Empty the house completely and leave it as sprarkling clean as you can. If a table has been "removed it might be worth replacing it with a cheap second hand. Not paying thae last months rent is very annoying. I have had this and then been out of pocket restoring the property. Rent should not be substituted for deposit. In ten years I have never withheld the deposit except in cases where rent is owing and in agreement with the tenant but it is not ideal, never the other way round. On a tenabt change over it usually costs me a few hundred pounds to mak a house tenant ready. I take the hit

Letting agents often have no idea what they are talking about. Ours tried to convince me I was legally obliged to let the landlord's contractors replace all of our windows two weeks before we moved out (gave appropriate notice etc) so he wouldn't have to have any down-time between lettings. After politely telling them no 6 or 7 times they relented.

Let them take it up with the deposit scheme, who would no doubt have a view on a 5 year-old inventory when you've only been there a year.

we’ll try and find proof to back up our claims that the inventory doesn’t match the condition of the house by showing photos of the house when we moved in to the agency

You're looking at this issue the wrong way round.

The Agency has to provide the inventory for the house as it was on the day that you moved in (not 5 years ago) - no inventory, signed and dated by both parties, means they have no proof of what was there.

The Agency should have protected your deposit in an approved scheme - failure to do so is a serious matter and you can claim up to 3x the deposit from them.

If the Agency wants to make any deductions and you dispute any of these it is the Agency that has to argue their case with the Tenancy Deposit Scheme and ; you have photos to support your argument.

the estate agent replied, saying she didn’t care and it was our problem to sort out.

Many agencies are excellent and run their businesses in a professional manner. You appear to have run into one of the less-professional agencies, of which there are also many, that are trying to bullshit and bluster you into paying something that you don't owe. Read up on your rights and then challenge her next time she tries the bullshit approach - www.gov.uk/tenancy-deposit-protection

I don't understand. Did you sign a contract when you moved in a year ago?
Did the contract contain an inventory which you agreed? If both of these are yes, then you are liable for anything missing from the inventory and it's your fault for signing an inventory without checking it. If not, then the landlord can't hold you accountable for some random old inventory you've never seen or agreed is present when you moved in.

all housemates on same shared rental contract
So did they redo the contract when you moved in to add your name? Did you pay your own deposit then? If so was it protected in one of the scheme?

Or did you have an arrangement with the person who left and you replaced and you paid them the deposit directly with them saying you'd get it back when you moved?

If the former, you might be ok. If the latter, you're in trouble.

Hi all,

Thanks for all your comments and tips.

Just to confirm, I didn’t sign an inventory at all when I moved in. The deposit is on a protected scheme (mentioned in the tenancy contract). All I signed when I moved in was a copy of the tenancy contract (which I have a copy of) and not an inventory.

Spoke to a relative, who happens to be a landlord, and they said they believe that landlords need to prove their tenants signed an inventory. So the estate agent will need to prove I signed an inventory. Is this right?

Bump in case anyone has any advice to add :)

Of course the estate agent would be well-advised to provide an inventory that you signed - otherwise they could claim that there was a £2,000 76 inch flat-screen TV and that the taps were all gold-plated and encrusted with diamonds! None of which you would have known about and none of which were in situ when you moved in. For future rentals, you should also insist on a detailed inventory to protect yourself.

However, an inventory is not a legal requirement, but in practice, any landlord attempting to withhold any deposit money would be hard-pressed to prove their case with the TDS if there is no signed inventory. If the landlord or agent has not provided an inventory, that's their problem, not yours. www.rla.org.uk/landlord/tenancy_deposits/tds-Inventories.shtml

I had a situation many years ago where on moving out the landlord tried to withhold a large amount of our deposit, however we hadn’t signed an inventory and the inventory provided by the estate agent/ landlord was dated 6 months before we’d moved in. We disputed this through the scheme we had our deposit in and ended up getting the full amount of the deposit back on account of the landlord not providing an adequate inventory and therefore there being no proof that any of the damage the landlord was claiming happened during our tenancy.

It did take several months of us putting in statements etc to get the money back through the protection scheme and the estate agent tried to dispute it but we got it back in the end.

Agents are often out to withhold deposit in my experience... Our last one tried to say we hadn't left it clean. We had left it in a much better state than when we moved in - when reminded of this they apologised immediately and returned the whole deposit.
As long as you have left it clean and undamaged (apart from wear and tear) they can't withhold anything so don't let them tell you otherwise.

If you didn't sign an inventory when you moved in then you should be able to get your deposit back, your deposit protection scheme should uphold this. The landlord has to show evidence of the inventory on moving in - the burden of proof is on the landlord not the tenant. Take advice from a specialist landlord/tenant or housing site