To expect dd's teacher to pronounce her 't's

[paolosgirl]

DD (8) has a newly qualified teacher this year (who looks about 12, LOL). She is in love with her, but came home shocked that Miss X says swee'har', le'er, bu'er etc (I'm forever telling DD and DS to say t when it's in a word)

Would it bug you too, or am I turning into my mother?

back to the OP the teacher is competent, the child "loves" her, so a professionally qualified woman doing a good job...but your concern is her pronunciation???so what if she is not wholly ennunciated

as adults we all work with a huge diversity of pronnunciation/accent, and of course some will drop "t" others will say "haitch" for H this does not impede or impair individual abilities. it is subjective judgemnet whether itis found appealling/unappealling

Irrespective of all her other "lovely" skills the teacher should pronounce the word correctly. Thin end of the wedge I fear!

i worked with a consultant who had did not pronounce "t's" said Haitch and you know what no one minded and patients found it very reassuring and normalising he was at the top of his game extremley intellectual and socially skilled

The point is, if you teach - do it properly. If the consultant diagnosed inncorrectly would that also be reassuring and normalising...probably wouldn't be at the top of his game either.

did you namechange for this thread, wakeup? if so, why?

Sorry who is wakeup?

It is interesting that the people who say haitch often drop the letter when they speak. What is that all about?

Is teaching children to speak properly part of the NC then?

Phonics.

shame that there is so latent prejudice about pronnunciation/accents, that the implication is that u can not teach properly or be a consultant if pronnunciation is not received pronnunciation

incidentailly the gentlemann i refer to is a well respected still practising and publishing - so most definitley at top of his game ...still dropping T's and H's and more the better for it

Indeed it is
National curriculum core subjects
English: Speaking and listening; Reading; Writing

speaking not elocution

oh, i see. you changed for the afternoon. bored, i take it.

there is NO latent prejudice about pronnunciation/accents. The point is that if you are teaching someone then teach them correctly.

phonics is to read and spell properly. reading is a form of speaking, but it is not impromptu speaking hence this thread.

yes the mastery and cognitive ability to produce and understand these complex tasks, not the pronnunciation or ennunciation that you are referring to

i refer to use of words correctly/properly implied predjudice being that there is correct spoken language but if if key skills are taught and imparted the teacher has indeed demonstrated proper teaching

i should think the brain of a child of average intelligence would have no trouble with the 'mis' pronunciations of this teacher. The brain processes in speech patterns which are new to us. Your child is more likely to assimilate the accent of the majority around him or her. Not one individual, irrespective of that person's position of authority.

Does that mean that i like it when people drop their 't's, etc. not really. I know how I prefer her to speak but I can recognise the things i can change and the things I can't and move on accordingly.

the content of speech is as importantas its phonetic components for example prince Charles has demonstrably got received pronnunciation in fact well ennunciated waste of space, so just because some may think he speaks properly does not necessarily mean the content is either meaningful or intellectual

Very difficult for a child to spell butter if the teacher says now spell "buer". Of course it matters.

Synthetic phonics ? refers to an approach to the teaching of reading in which phonemes [sounds] associated with particular graphemes [letters] are pronounced in isolation and blended together (synthesised). For example, children are taught to take a single-syllable word such as cat apart into its three letters, pronounce a phoneme for each letter in turn /k, æ, t/, and blend the phonemes together to form a word. Synthetic phonics for writing reverses the sequence: children are taught to say the word they wish to write, segment it into its phonemes and say them in turn, for example /d, ?, g/, and write a grapheme for each phoneme in turn to produce the written word, dog.

Analytic phonics ? refers to an approach to the teaching of reading in which the phonemes associated with particular graphemes are not pronounced in isolation. Children identify (analyse) the common phoneme in a set of words in which each word contains the phoneme under study. For example, teacher and pupils discuss how the following words are alike: pat, park, push and pen. Analytic phonics for writing similarly relies on inferential learning: realising that the initial phoneme in /p i g/ is the same as that in /p æ t, p a: k, p u ?/ and /p e n/, children deduce that they must write that phoneme with grapheme .

Caroline1852 - thanks for those definitions.

Now I know that the way I was taught to read c.1970 was synthetic phonics, so I can use the method I was taught with my daughter . Phew.

Our deputy head can't say 'th'. It's so shocking. She talks about the 'depf and breadf' of the curriculum in staff meetings, or says 'Maffs' (why not just say Numeracy?!!!)
We all wonder how she got the job at interview - and surely she would have shook hands and said 'Fanks!' when she accepted the position?
She used to be a Literacy co-ordinator (my position) and I have to bite my tongue when she tries to tell me how to do my job - how on earth could she teach the 'th' sound?
Even worse, her Y5 class have started to pick up on it, and too innocently imitate her. Her classroom discipline isn't the best anyway, so this doesn't help....

i agree with you caroline. last statement caroline. i wonder if OP has been in one of her dd's class when Phonics is being taught. then, i think the issue you raise is more valid. if in a phonics class, she still says bu'er, then i would also have issue.

i was taught English by second language, though near native, speakers. the teachers took a lot of time to enunciate during phonics. I can't remember much as i was little. However, i have always been an excellent speller and reader. I don't speak english that way anymore as i assimilated different accents as i grew up and moved to different places. Now, at different times i speak English with a Caribbean lilt, with a southern US one, with a mid-Atlantic one when being formal, and dare i say, with a NorthEast Mackem one when I chat with the boys I teach French and Spanish. I think these are all my genuine accents, just that it changes naturally to suit my audience.

Feenie - Sounds as though she was "Eternally grateful" for her post rather than giving thanks.

My mother taught us and presumably her pupils some spellings by sometimes pronouncing the word as it sounds and I've found that's helped the twins sometimes - wed nes day. Obviously they know the real way it's said but it helps the spelling.