To expect dd's teacher to pronounce her 't's

[paolosgirl]

DD (8) has a newly qualified teacher this year (who looks about 12, LOL). She is in love with her, but came home shocked that Miss X says swee'har', le'er, bu'er etc (I'm forever telling DD and DS to say t when it's in a word)

Would it bug you too, or am I turning into my mother?

Good point!

Obviously u are from Scotland - no one down south of Watford - Windsor to Cheltenham pronounces a T..... just a fact

r u from scotland ?

I ve had english,american,canadian,south african and irish schoolteachers in english and I still have my scottish accent although I left there 28yrs ago.Don t worry xenia and paolasgirl your dc s will grow up to speak just like you and not with a scots twange(God forbid!)

Some people in adult life deliberately change their accent for career and life enhancement purposes. Others find a change they cannot help because of where they move to or who they mix with then means they are different from their family and that itself causes problems. Some people have one accent with one group of people and another with others. It's an interesting subject. But the main thing is to know that in some situations accent does disadvantage you. Just compare Prescott and Cameron for example. I just don't think Prescott is able to express thoughts clearly probably because of his background and education and class. I'm sure he'd never "betray his class/roots" by taking elocution lessons though.

Xenia, Prescott can't express himself b/c he is thick. It has nothing to do with background or class.

scots twange errr sounds rude ter an awwfyy lassie maman4 telling folks aboot yet twange before 8.30

Excuse me! Do not insult John Prescott's intelligence! Objectionable he may be in many ways, but the man worked his way up from being a ship's steward with Cunard to Deputy Prime Minister, via a degree at Ruskin College, Oxford and a further degree in Economics at Hull. You don't get that through tokenism and that was a cheap shot .

STT, you seem to have an inverted chip on your shoulder.

OP, YANBU, teachers of small children should be at least competent in basic English. It horrifies me that dd's nursery workers use double negatives and constructions such as 'we was' in their speech - people working with small children, teaching them to read, should pronounce their words correctly and use proper grammar, regardless of accent. If that makes me a snob too, then snob me up...

Sorry that should have read wange of course!!

seems ol' Prescot ain't done badly fer 'imself any'ow - fick or not...'ow are you doin'?

I agree with you Lovecat. When we as a society give people who work with small children a respectable wage, and put our money where our mouths are, then we may attact people into the industry who can enunciate standard English. It is a win-win proposition. Until then, we will just have to carry on enunciating at home.

just read OP, are you sure she isn't Granny Murray. [ugh!]

a n overwhelming majority do speak an excellent english
kiskidee.But I must say that for me it s the double negative and 'f' for 'the'.My husband says 'ze' but I think it s sexy.Who is this Granny Murray???

Lovecat, I don't have a chip on my shoulder but I do hate snobbery, particularly as I grew up being accused of it soley on the way I spoke. I worry that snobbery seems to be alive and well and that my children are growing up in a world that still judges people by how they speak. Equally I hate inverted snobbery and loathe the culture that denigrates 'posh' or 'clever'.

As for Prescott, he couldn't work out that during the fuel strike the supermarkets were going to run out of food b/c they needed transportation. That he had such power is deeply worrying. At the same time it is undeniable that he is a connsumate politician whio managed to be very popular within his own party. Personally I prefer Alan Johnson as somepone working class who is both a high acheiver and articulate.

I think it is loathesome that we still judge people as second-class because of their speech and background. What kind of children are we going to bring up?

Granny Murray is a character from a show on CBeebies called 'Me Too'. I find her (not because of her accent though!) and the show very annoying.

I think it is ridiculous for anyone to believe that they are not judged for both how they speak and how they look, to some extent. I can't stand Granny Murray because of the way she speaks: "Come away in, wee girurl" and looks. Who, in 2007, wears waistcoats and neckerchiefs ffs? She looks like she might not have clean underwear so I am not sure she is suitable to be around kids.

I don't know prescott's IQ level hut I do know he's not looking after his health as well he should and needs to lose weight not that that stopped him with that secretary though etc . As to his IQ I have no idea but his ideas often come out wrongly perhaps because at home and at school his speech wasn't corrected as it should be and I bet when he's criticised for this in the press he sometimes wishes his parents if they had the ability and teachers had helped him to speak in a fashion acceptable to politicans and the public. I mentioned him not because I think he's stupid but because his background is what hampers him (if you think he's hampered at all). On the other hand he's an example of doesn't matter how you speak, where you're from if you're good enough you'll get through.

For a man with a degree Prescott has a shocking grasp of how the country works. I'm not sure he's an example of being good enough but rather being determined. He must also be an example of someone who writes very differently from how he speaks if he has a degree, which in my experience is quite usual. Speaking 'incorrectly' is not an indication that someone cannot spell or write grammatically.

Accent most definately affects perople's perception of your intelligence. I am working class, I sound working class, and although I know mostly correct grammar for everyday conversations, I often catch myself not using it. I am always surprised when I read my own posts here - they sound half intelligent and reasonably articulate.

But when I am met in real life, my combination of appalling social skills and rich local accent make me seem like I border strongly on the Land of the Dim.

Caroline, i think you'll find Granny Murray has a wardrobe given to her, and a script

I usually remember to drop the accent, but i froget sometimes and am aware how much it affects people judgements of me- particularly as the west country accent IS often considered 'dim'. I'm not dim, I get good grades at uni and my essays never have grammar or layout corrected. DS1 who has Sn is eprceived as uch more intelligent than ds2, simply because a facet of ds1's SN is pedantic speech (sounds and looks like little lord fauntleroy!), whilst ds2 hasn't lost his strongS oemrset accent, and a slight mumble.

Peachy, But I daresay her underwear is all her own work.

Prescott was only ever present to placate the trades unions. Any working class chump would have done!

I am pleased and relieved to say I know nothing of her undies LOL

Peachy - LOL I may have been dreaming (nighmaring?) but I think I saw a greying Damart vest twixt the neckerchief and her blouse. Horrible. I say to my DD: "Oh no it's the scary lady" and then we both scream .