Rules when renting a holiday place - bonkers or completely normal?

[DragonMamma]

We are renting a large property for over New Year (for a total of 3 nights). There are 10 bedrooms and 9 bathrooms. We rent houses regularly and have done for many years. This 3 night break is costing just under £3.5k so it’s not exactly cheap.

We’ve just received the list of do’s and don’ts from the owner and it reads like nothing we’ve ever come across before. It’s like they are reluctantly giving us use of the place and barking instructions at us.

Some examples below copied and pasted from their 7 page (!) instruction manual.

*YOU ARE EXPECTED TO LEAVE THE PROPERTY IN A SIMILAR STATE OF CLEANLINESS AS YOU FOUND IT, IF THE PROPERTY IS NOT SO, YOU WILL BE CHARGED AN EXCESS CLEANING CHARGE.
Including all floors to be hovered or swept, bathrooms and toilets cleaned, kitchen to be cleaned, all washing up done and put away.

Hot water will be on in the morning from 7am until 10am, briefly at lunchtime and again from 5pm until 10pm. Options for extra heating and hot water are available please see our website. These must be booked in advance.

NEVER LEAVE THE WOODBURNER UNATTENDED. IN INTERESTS OF SAFETY UNLESS YOU ARE EXPERIENCED USING WOODBURNERS WE SUGGEST THAT YOU DO NOT USE IT.

Swimming pool - Shallow end depth of approx. 1metre, deep end depth approx. 1.9 metre. STRICTLY NO JUMPING, DIVING OR OTHER BOISTEROUS BEHAVIOUR*

AIBU to think that if you’re charging over a thousand pound a night and absolutely insisting on a 10am check out (OR face yet another additional charge) then you simply cannot expect the occupants to clean 9 bathrooms and do all of the general cleaning. There’s also a strict list of what cleaning products are to be used where.

We always leave properties in a decent state - we will set the dishwater off after breakfast, give the bathroom a quick wipe so it’s not excessively dirty. We’ll bag all the rubbish up etc and make sure it’s tidy and do whatever else we have time for before leaving (strip the beds etc.). But this reads like they want us to clean it to a professional standard all before 10am!

AIBU to think this is a bonkers and that it’s not the responsibility of the occupants to do the cleaning for you? And to also have to book extra hot water in advance?

How on earth are we supposed to know when we are going to want hot water? What happens if we go swimming after lunch, do we have to sit and wait for it to come back on at 5pm? They have take a £500 security deposit and based on the list of things we may get charged for is endless and it’s really put us off going 😞

This is the most cathartic thread I have ever read on Mumsnet. Let me join the party by detailing my horrible experience with Weird Owners.

A couple of years ago, I booked a holiday let for DB, his kids, and myself. I asked the owners (booked off their site) if, since we only had 2 days off, we could rent for 2 nights, either Fri/Sat or Sat/Sun. I offered to do whichever 2 nights were most convenient for them/their cleaners but owners said no, three night minimum. Ok, fair enough. I paid for the 3 nights Fri-Sun, about £800. They asked me to specify which 2 nights we would be in residence, which I thought mildly odd, since I'd fully paid for all three nights, but I said Sat/Sun and thought no more of it.

Fast forward six weeks, and I emailed owners the week before we were due to rent, and said DH would like to pick up keys Friday so he could put some food in fridge for DB, kids and me (DH, me & kids already up there in different house, DH was going back while I got together with DB). I wanted DH to get keys/do food shop because I had to go back to London for the day Friday, to work, which I explained in email to Weird Owners.

Weird Owners wrote back Weird email saying I had rented house not DH or DB so they would only release keys to me, but I had not told them DB would be staying which put me in breach of contract and they were concerned booking was fraudulent. I was quite confused so I wrote back and said I'd filled out their booking form for 2 adults, 2 kids, and the fact that it was DB not DH should surely not make a difference (since form did not ask to specify relationship of second adult), but sorry if so. I added that they had actually met DH as, the year before, he'd been round to take a few photos of the place to show me and DB prior to us deciding to rent. I asked what they meant by fraudulent and pointed out I'd fully paid for the 3 nights.

Weird Owners replied they would not release keys to DH now as I had "admitted" he was not staying, and added they had no proof ours was not a fraudulent booking and we were who we were claiming to be (???) I emailed again, nicely, and suggested they google us both - we have jobs and professional websites, and they replied DH's online photo didn't look like the bloke who came round to look at the place.

I offered to email a copy of DH's ID, his driving licence or any other ID, plus the timestamped photos he'd taken the previous summer, but they insisted, they would only release keys to me. They knew I was in London and couldn't pick up the keys myself. I protested that I'd paid for Friday and DH didn't want to stay overnight, just to put food in the fridge, and they could, if they wanted, just take it off him and put it there themselves. I added I could be there myself but only later on Friday night and explained again, it would be super helpful if DH could come instead, at any time convenient to them.

Next email: Weird Owners said they would be away from the property and wouldn't be back in time to meet me Friday. I replied, but I've paid for Friday? And they replied, again saying they had no proof it was not a fraudulent booking. I didn't and don't understand that. I had fully prepaid for all three nights. I offered any ID check they wanted.

What would a fraudulent booking person/people mean? And why couldn't they just call our employers or us on our work numbers, to see we were who we said we were if they didn't believe the websites? Clearly they did not want to give those keys over for Friday night.

It felt so completely weird and unwelcoming that I booked DB, kids and myself into a hotel, told Weird Owners that, and said I wanted a refund on the basis they had refused the keys/repeatedly told me it was a fraudulent booking/accused DH of not being the same person their representative had met the previous year (why? just why?) and I felt completely unwelcome by that point since they hadn't given me any option to prove to them it was not a fraudulent booking, just kept saying it was and refusing the keys.

Weird Owners replied if they could let it again they'd give a partial refund but I was in breach of contract with late cancellation and would not receive any refund if not re-let. I took screenshots of the fact that the place remained showing booked for all three nights on their website - so how could they have made a good faith effort to let it? Sent these to them after the fact and they replied saying they were within their contract - no refund, ignoring bit about them leaving it showing as booked on the website.

A friend of mine suggested an explanation - she thought it likely that Weird Owners had let it out to another family on the Friday night, so double sold it, which would account for their refusal to let my DH pick up the key or even put food in the fridge and the stupid excuses about "we don't know you are who you say you are etc" fraudulent booking accusations.

I tried to leave a review but it wasn't published.

Germane to this thread, OP I would be careful of cancelling and expecting a refund. I got not a penny back. And I strongly suspect they had double booked it. I did think about trying to pursue it legally, but Weird Owners struck me as paranoid and crazy - and they had my home and work address and a few more details I had given them to prove we were who we said we were, and I suspect they would pay a solicitor a fortune to prove their point. Or maybe I just crumbled under the overt bullying tone. £800 is enough money to us that I think about it regularly, and wonder if I did the right thing trying to let it go or, if I was somehow in the wrong - hence how much I have enjoyed reading this thread and understanding most holiday let owners are nice. Some are just plain nasty and grabby and.... Weird. We have rented for 20 years all over the country, literally never had any issue before (ok one place described as "luxury" in Spain that was clearly not, but 1 in 20 years)...

To this day, I have no idea what fraudulent renters are or would do, but the amount of proof I gave Weird Owners that we were who we said we were and their refusal to believe it/insistence on not giving us the keys makes me think it wasn't the issue. Weird Owners struck me as awful people who I would never want to see or interact with again. Karma will get them I hope (maybe some real "fraudulent renters" will show up, and do what, steal the sheets? not do a proper clean?)

OP: I hope it turns out well. If you decide not to go, please don't be me and give up on the money. I regret that! I teach my DCs not to give in to bullies but I did.

PS Didn't mean to hijack the thread with my novel OP but just to tell a cautionary tale suggesting you won't get a refund at this late date.

In my experience of renting cottages and houses, the out by 10am is pretty standard, the clean the 9 loos and mop the floors is just the owners saying don't leave it a tip, and the hot water thing needs clarifying. Some owners don't realize the tone of their rules/requests makes a massive difference. I bet if they'd added a line "Sorry if this sounds draconian, but with a 9-bed property we've seen some after-effects of parties and multi-family groups all thinking others have cleaned.." and you'd understand.

Good luck.

@DragonMamma, no not stayed but live in Devon and know that there can be some very particular and overbearing owners who treat people as if they're doing them a bloody huge favour.
I'm guessing my 2 bed would be of no use for a new yr house swap!!

The swimming pool rules make sense as it's not deep enough for any of those things but the rest is unreasonable. I would expect people to wash up or load the dishwasher and start it and make sure the toilets are presentable but not vacuum and dust.

Is it a youth hostel? They want you to clean the toilets? They should hand tools you these rules before taking the deposit.

Sympathies, OP. This sounds like a nightmare.

We rented a house in France a few years ago. We spent the entire last day cleaning (which we always do) but the manual in the house said there would be a clean after we left and we’d only be charged for excessive mess, which is pretty normal. The owner in her email has said leave as you find, again pretty normal.

Well, she kept most of our deposit. Sent us photos of tiny marks on mirrors and windows, said the sun beds weren’t where they were when we arrived etc. The manual it turned out had been written by the previous owners and it was her first season renting out. It was really upsetting at the time as she made us out to be total pigs. There wasn’t much we could do as she didn’t live in the UK or I’d have gone to Small Claims. All of it was bonkers and has made me wary of booking house rentals ever since.

Yes the American properties that want you to put a wash on but don't provide washing powder 😕

I've stayed in youth hostels. They don't expect you to clean the toilets, or anything at all.

Having worked in the holiday let industry I’d say the rules for cleaning and swimming are standard. I’ve stayed in many holiday homes and always give it a detailed clean even though I know a cleaning company will follow behind me. It’s someone else’s home so I treat it better than my own. That said, their tone sounds a little off so I’d preempt any issues and take photos of the place before you go. Are they asking for a security deposit at all?

As for the hot water...crazy. We’ve only had this once and it was heating as well as hot water. The cottage was in Avimore in Scotland. At New Year. We’ve never been so bloody cold. The place was awful, too. Is definitely be raising this as an issue before going.

I've stayed in many holiday rentals. The only time I've had such specific and onerous cleaning requirements was when renting in France and there it was possible to pay a moderate cleaning fee to avoid full inspection ( didn't stop property owner tutting about perfectly normal state of apartment on leaving though).
Having a list telling you to hoover, scrub and clean on your last morning would completely put me off going . Obviously don't leave places a state and clean loos and wipe stains from cooker, but there's no way I'd be comfortable with being expected to get a big house up to rental cleanliness and also be reliant on my friends to do likewise for their rooms with presumably only one hoover between you all.

I’ve stayed in many holiday homes and always give it a detailed clean even though I know a cleaning company will follow behind me

Sorry but I disagree. If a cleaner is coming in to clean a kitchen and bathroom, dust, vacuum etc a property that was professionally cleaned a week or two ago, then there's absolutely no need for the renters to do any cleaning beyond rubbish disposal, washing up and removal of big stains and spills.

If the renters did a 'detailed clean' then what would be left for the cleaner to do? But as the owner would want the property you be independently checked, they wouldn't rely on the renters doing things properly would they?

@Mamawingingit1234 it definitely has

@SourAndSnippy I’m not overly bothered tbh. Hopefully it will give a warning to others looking to book. I certainly wouldn’t if I had seen such reviews before booking

Looking at the T&C on the owner’s website they are rather obsessed with banning nitrous oxide. They also promise spot checks to make sure only the people named on the booking form are present. The cleaning of bathroom and kitchens, and the sweeping and hoovering of floors is mentioned too. It’s a long list.

But nitrous oxide (prohibition of) is mentioned at least three times. Don’t even think of taking laughing gas, OP.

Four mentions of nitrous oxide in fact.

Me and my nitrous will live to fight another day.

What almost 40 something takes it on a family friendly do anyway...

Oh god, I've stayed in numerous holiday rentals and the worst by far for this kind of bollocks were in France.
I actually think some of them don't get cleaners in between rentals, they just change the sheets and towels.
At one nice farmhouse the owners docked us our deposit because we hadn't cleaned the leather suite with its special cleaner. (We'd wiped it over with a cloth duster)
We had left a bottle of good single malt for the owners (French people tend to appreciate nice whiskey) but when the chap said he was keeping the deposit DH picked the bottle up smartly and took it with us.
Another place had instructions for the final cleaning that covered both sides (closely typed) of a page of A4 paper. And this was a small apartment.

I've located it OP and you deffo can't take nitrous oxide, no way! 🙄

We rented a place a few years ago with similar onerous cleaning requirements. We had to get up at four to make sure everything got done before 10 am.

We kept our deposit and the owner later sent me a very nice letter complimenting me on the state of the house when we left. Apparently, it had never been so clean.

'Leaving it clean'

I clean an AirBnB. It has the usual 'please leave it clean' clause and most people do. But there is a difference between 'home clean' and 'hotel clean'.

Most people also expect 'hotel clean' when they arrive, but leave the place 'home clean'. It's not their fault. They're not being lazy or stupid but they are on holiday, have a plain to catch, the are kids running around getting in the way....

They're not professional cleaners.

I'm a professional cleaner. I can see when someone has tried and done a good job, and I appreciate it. I will also find a whole load of stuff they missed or didn't think to do. Every time.

'Plane' not 'plain' argh!

@TheSandman exactly kids running round especially with other kids which is likely in a 10 bedroom place is not helpful with cleaning.

Also with my rental I leave general kitchen and bathroom cleaner, toilet stuff and a couple of cloths and a scourer.

I don't leave gloves, oven cleaner etc as I don't expect a deep clean from guests.

And to be fair, people are paying for the use of somewhere and finding it very clean is part of what they should be paying for. How much a property is rented out for is up to the owners and they need to charge an amount that covers those costs.

Its bad enough cleaning your own house. Why would you want to replicate that when you are on holiday?

Four mentions of nitrous oxide in fact

Eh??!!! [confused}

Is there any chance someone could link this website please? After all, public sites aren't exactly state secrets ...

They are saying about 'spot checks' as some people hire a huge house for NYE and throw an enormous party and trash the place, end up drunk in the pool etc, etc, as already explained.

They are just putting these rules to protect themselves legally and to put off people trashing the place and leaving it a disgusting condition, parents booking for teenagers to have said party, etc etc.

Honestly, it is CLEARLY all this is.

The hot water I understand now a PP explained. Basically means if all 10 of you want a bath within the same 2 hours, there won't be enough hot water.

Obvs they HAVE to mention the pool and woodburner.

You DC dive in the pool and are paralysed for life breaking their neck... they are covering all eventualities. ESPECIALLY at NYE when people get drunk/take drugs/do stupid things.

YOU know you are nice, they don't! [smie]