To ask why voters don’t care about state schools?

[Lycidas]

Polling suggests that schooling has declined as a priority for voters. Why?? Unless your children are safely ensconced in a private school, can’t people see the:

• Relentless slashing of school budgets
• Atrocious SEN provision which impacts all
• Teachers leaving the profession in droves
• Too many stressful high stakes exams

Why have we accepted the dire provision of state schooling in this country?

Labour also plans to change the curriculum again. After a decade of curriculum changes, the last thing teachers really want is any more.

The current curriculum is horrific and the pressure of working within such a narrow and constrained syllabus is having a really damaging effect in the enjoyment and mental health of our children. I would welcome a change to the curriculum; I’m sure I’m not alone in thinking it needs a serious overhaul.

@Thatagain what are your children being taught that doesn’t fit in the brackets you’ve given?

As PPs have mentioned I don't think its because people do not care. It's probably a matter of priorities. Not all voters prioritise children and may consider NHS, Brexit, taxation, homelessness, poverty, immigration, climate change, business, emergency services, defence, etc more pressing matters. Everyone is different.

also many state schools get results close to that of independent schools

Because they are generally grammar schools and select only the brightest pupils.

@Thatagain
I am guilty of saying that they are taught the wrong thing's. The system should focus on the essentials ie maths, English, science, geography, and arts and sport. The school gets to choose what they teach now and the main lessons are lesser then they us to be.

What, on God's green earth, do you think schools teach children if not the subjects you give as an example???? What are the 'right things' to teach children?!

I am genuinely baffled.

The school gets to choose what they teach now and the main lessons are lesser then they us to be.

What are you talking about?!

I care about schools. I think the current state primary system now offers much less than the sink estate primary I went to in the early 90's. Firstly I don't think Corbyn will fix this situation and secondly until immigration both legal and illegal is appropriately controlled there will continue to be issues whichever party is in power.

Also my dd is in private school & Corbyn wants to push people like me who only just afford the fees back into the state system and I really cannot see how he will achieve this without being detrimental to all dc putting ever more pressure on the already hugely under pressure state system.

Labour is not going to abolish private schools. They want to remove their charitable status and make them pay their taxes like any other business.

I care about schools. I have a daughter who is too young to go to one yet, so I don't have any practical experience on the ground so I don't feel that well informed.

I know objectively that the tories have made what are in real terms cuts to the education budget. I see on here complaints about the current system, both in terms of funding and curriculum. I do know friends who are teachers but haven't seen them for a while and not long enough to discuss politics. I disagree with cutting education, but then certain of my other thoughts on spending priorities might be unpopular with others - that is the difficulty I guess.

I also have read the labour manifesto and I don't like some of the policies in that either - abolition of ofsted etc. I also don't think their funding plans stack up overall and there is a bad record of simply spending cash on stuff without accountability, entering into PPP deals etc, so I worry about their stewardship of increased spending.

Basically, I am not sure that it is a black and white issue and I don't have enough experience of it myself. But I do care.

I wonder whether its because people dont value education as much as they did.

When people admire reality stars more than scientists who have made amazing discoveries, and when people are 'sick of experts' and turning to unqualified youtubers instead of doctors when they are deciding whether to vaccinate their kids , when people think that lots of things taught in schools are a conspiracy (moon landings, spherical planet) maybe they just think traditional education is not as important as it once was. Also if people do get a great state school education then they have to pay a massive amount of money to go to uni so maybe they think there are better ways of escaping poverty

@Reversiblesequinsforadults has someone said labour will abolish them then?

The Labour manifesto says “ We will close the tax loopholes enjoyed by elite private schools and use that money to improve the lives of all children, and we will ask the Social Justice Commission to advise on integrating private schools and creating a comprehensive education system.”

Well schools are high on my list of priorities.

All the schools round here are in huge debt (£230,000 debt is normal at the moment according to the Union).

All secondary schools and some primaries are on 4.5 days a week. I imagine it will go down to 4 days if the Tories get in again.

10 staff were laid off in our primary school 3 months ago. I'm waiting for the begging letter to come. Other schools already have this.

Maybe it's not so desperate as the state of the NHS- because it's not about life and death- but having said that teachers are suffering and so many of the kids with SEN and problems at home are struggling. That's an understatement. The system cannot look after them. It can barely cover the basics.

My question is - why are more teachers not kicking up a fuss and drawing attention to this problem?

why are more teachers not kicking up a fuss and drawing attention to this problem?

We did. We went on strike. And we were called workshy whingers who should try working in the private sector where we wouldn’t get so many holidays and to go home at 3:30.

So teachers took that advice, found out the grass was actually greener outside of teaching, and now there’s a massive shortage of them.

What aren’t teachers kicking up a fuss?

Jesus wept. Where have you been. I supply teach so am in and out of lots of schools. The situation is dire. I know of a school with a 25 year old interim headteacher. High schools with 8, 9 or 10 supply in every day. People with no education to speak of, , let alone a teaching qualification,, standing in front of your children day in, day out. Headteachers teaching to keep the supply bill as low as possible. Bans on using the photocopier. Water pouring through ceilings and the only solution a bucket. Classes with multiple children with serious problems affecting everyone’s learning and no staff to help out. Schools with over 50% NQTs or RQTs....

But as Noble says, if we strike, parents moan. So we leave the profession. There is a massive crisis.

My question is-why are more teachers not kicking up a fuss and drawing attention to this problem?

I can’t believe I just read this!

What do you think we’ve been doing?!

We work to rule and nobody gives a shit.

We strike and you read nothing but posts from fuming (or sometimes fumming) parents on here who are pissed off they’ve lost ‘childcare’ for a day and the media/politicians go into one about workshy leftie teachers.

So what else can we do?

We leave-and that’s what’s happened.

The Labour manifesto says “ We will close the tax loopholes....

They're not "loopholes" - it's the law!

A loophole is something that wasn't originally intended by Parliament, such as a mistake or accidental omission.

It is loophole if it allows businesses which are not charities to have charitable status.

Corbyn isn’t a communist, he’s a socialist. I suggest people educate themselves on the difference because it’s fairly significant. He isn’t an evil old man, he wants to keep the NHS running and ensure the public sector is adequately funded.

It is loophole if it allows businesses which are not charities to have charitable status.

Lot's of "charities" have business/trading arms.

Different people vote on different priorities for them.

Can’t imagine parents with children at the Moriah in Pinner will be voting for Labour.

Because the alternative is communism (as proposed by comrade Corbyn) which has destroyed economies across the world.

Why do people keep saying this? It simply isn't true. Is it that you don't know what communism is? Are you hoping others reading your post don't, or that if you keep repeating it people will just absorb it as true? A lot of economists think Labour's policies area a lot better for the economy than the Tory's austerity.

JC is proposing things that were just normal aspects of capitalist/socialist combo govt here a few decades ago and in Europe right now. It's normal to have nationalised rail, water, social housing etc. We are the right wing capitalist outliers at the moment. Labour is proposing a correction to something more centrist. Your overton window is fucked, frankly.

OP, these questionnaires make you grade your priorities. Of course education is very important but right now there is an urgency re NHS and climate change and housing at the moment.

Lot's of "charities" have business/trading arms

That’s not the same thing, is it? And if there are “charities” rather than actual charities benefiting from the current tax law, that’s a loophole.

Why do people think that there isn’t an urgency about education?

Is it because that they’re unaware that the person teaching their kid is unqualified? Or that the school can’t afford to fix the hole in the roof and no one knows if there’s asbestos in it? Or that they can’t afford textbooks and teachers are buying their own stationery?

How bad do things need to get before there’s urgency in education?