To ask about the American healthcare system?

[ZortNarf]

There's a lot of talk about the NHS being sold off to the Americans. From what I can see it's just about American companies getting higher prices from the NHS - so not 'selling it off'.

But if they were allowing American companies in to run the NHS would that be a bad thing? I've no real idea what healthcare's like in America except from TV. Is it bad? Don't we keep raising money to send sick kids there when we can't treat them here?

Genuine question. Surely doctors are doctors and hospitals are hospitals? Should I care who runs them, owns them, or whatever?

Watch the Michael Moore documentary Sicko if you want to know how shit the US a healthcare system is.

The prices vary state to state, The Economist published an article about the cost of Caesareans across different states. In one state it costs 25k, health insurance doesn’t always cover it all. Also health insurance providers have the right to drop you if your health conditions become too costly, then you really are up the shit creek.

Don’t underestimate how important the NHS actually is.

The spend is high partly because of price gouging medication - which will happen in the UK. How could it not?

@Kazziek You're wrong about privatising healthcare finishing a political party. It's already happening, services are being rationed and medication options limited according to cost. Even with headlines about people waiting months for cancer treatment, people accept it because we're told that these cuts need to be made. We're in this race to the bottom mentality where people argue about who is more deserving of treatment.

And so it begins.

If they can do all that in ten years, think about what they can do in another ten. More rationing, less treatment and medication options. And rather than kicking up a fuss we argue as to who is more or less deserving of help. So they get away with cutting some more, if you want help for these conditions you'll need to pay.

No one is going to privatise healthcare overnight, but there's no doubt it is happening already, and will continue at an exponential rate.

Your room charge came to $7k Serendipity shock did it come with a fucking butler?

Ah - don't worry about me. I would never get any insurance in the US under any scheme, having as I do a chronic condition. So there's no way I'd have been allowed to (or able to) rack up bills like that.

It's not a joke in "Better Call Saul" when they have to use a vet to treat the uninsured. It happens.

Have a look at this thread

There's a joke that if Breaking Bad had been set in the Uk it would have been over in minutes as the main character Walter White, who has cancer but can't afford treatment so starts making drugs to fund his treatment, would have gone to the drs, been prescribed chemo/radiotherapy & that's it. The fact they made what 5 series about it should give you an idea how bad US health care is. People go bankrupt & die prematurely because of the costs - & the remaining families are often liable for the bills after their relative dies.

We were warned ...

I hadn't thought about it that way MrsMaisels. I shall go away and consider my position!

My friend is American and an ear infection cost her in excess of 1500USD. She does have insurance, with added excess, which costs a fortune.

They charge you for skin-to-skin contact with your baby in the US. Let that sink in a moment.

Think about the consequences of such deals with US pharmaceuticals companies not only over pricing but our data before you declare it's all fine.

Think about the consequences of such deals with US pharmaceuticals companies not only over pricing but our data before you declare it's all fine.

You're suggesting that a deal with a US pharmaceuticals, which we already have, incidentally, would open the door for them to pass through unrelated charges?

You do know that there would be a contract, and there would be lawyers reading it before signing off?

The NHS is NoT being sold

You do know that there would be a contract, and there would be lawyers reading it before signing off?

Except the Tories have pledged to change the law so it doesn't work anymore. Well, not for you. Remember Virgin suing the government for losing a contract ?

www.independent.co.uk/news/health/nhs-richard-branson-virgin-care-legal-settlement-tendering-contract-a8080961.html

You'll see a lot more of that post Brexit. Contracts will be copper-bottomed, and if a company fails to make enough money from one, they'll just sue for the loss. It's called "no risk risk".

The NHS is not being sold

Except it is already, in degrees.

I pay $300 a month for health insurance for my family of five through my employer. I pay a $20 copay for a doctor visit, unless it's for preventative care (annual physical, PAP smear, mammogram, etc.), then there's no copay. I've had three babies in the US system, and I've paid nothing out of pocket. Hospital births with private rooms. I pay $75 for an emergency room visit, unless I'm admitted, then there's not out of pocket cost provided the hospital and physician are in my insurance company's network. Which most of them are. I don't need a referral to see specialists, I just go. I've been seeing the same doctor for 15 years, she's always seem me or my kids the same day if we're ill, within the week of we're not. Vaccinations are free. I take Zoloft, a 90-day supply is $1.50. I take diabetes meds (not insulin). They're free.

My dental covers 2 cleanings a year. Anything else is covered 80%.

My vision covers 1 exam a year. I do have to pay out of pocket if I want the digital test instead of the one where they dilate your eyes. Glasses frames are free up to $150, if they're more than that I pay 20% of the difference. Basic lenses are free, for extras like scratch proof coating or transitions lenses, I pay 20%.

My parents both died of cancer. They received excellent treatment, the out of pocket costs were minimal.

Except the Tories have pledged to change the law so it doesn't work anymore. Well, not for you. Remember Virgin suing the government for losing a contract ?

If the NHS has a bungled procurement process that leaves them vulnerable to lawsuits, then here's reason number 1,498 that it desperately needs reform.

If you have some links that suggest that the Tories or anyone have proposed changes to contract law, I'd love to see them.

When DS2 was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes I went home and googled it. In my haste I didn't specify NHS information and the first two results were American.

They immediately went into the financial aspect. Apparently I could look forward to crippling medical bills. Bankruptcy was mentioned near the top. NHS information was all about my child's health.

Americans have a phrase "catastrophic illness". This doesn't, as one might assume, refer to the severity of a condition but to the catastrophic effect such an illness has on the individual or family's finances.

The American system is the worst in the developed world. In some inner citya neighbourhoods they have infant mortality rates similar to the slums of India.

Presumably it would still just be 'NHS' to us and the charging is done in the back office? We wouldn't need to worry about costs would we?

No, it would all be fine. Inserts irony emoticon.

If you have some links that suggest that the Tories or anyone have proposed changes to contract law, I'd love to see them.

Contract law is below constitutional law (obviously),

p48. Tory Manifesto:

vote.conservatives.com/our-plan

“After Brexit we also need to look at the broader aspects of our constitution: the relationship between the government, parliament and the courts; the functioning of the Royal prerogative; the role of the House of Lords; and access to justice for ordinary people. The ability of our security services to defend us against terrorism and organised crime is critical. We will update the Human Rights Act and administrative law to ensure that there is a proper balance between the rights of individuals, our vital national security and effective government.”

I get that people are scared of the US healthcare system. Before I moved here (and I have epilepsy) I was frightened of it, despite my American husband constantly reassuring me that there’s nothing to worry about it. But there is a lot of misinformation and misunderstanding about it in the U.K.

Yes, we pay premiums and deductibles but we pay a lot lower taxes. If I add what I pay in tax and what our healthcare costs are here, it’s less than someone on the equivalent salary in the U.K. would pay in tax. For the two of us our premiums are $400 a month (total for two, not each). We pay that every month whether we go to a doctor, dentist, optician, etc or not. On top of that we pay a portion of each service. There are caps in place so that you will never spend more than your cap (ours is $5000 combined for both of us) in one year, even if you require treatment every day. My husband was recently diagnosed with cancer. Looking at cancer survival rates between here and the U.K. I am eternally thankful he was diagnosed and is being treated here.

The amount of money spent in each country doesn’t mean much. Depends on how and where that money is spent. The U.K. is spending more on the NHS now than it has ever done but waiting times at A and E are at an all-time high, many countries with a less developed economy have higher survival rates for many serious conditions.

Our health insurance covers more than just the basics also. I used to have float tank sessions at a spa and there were people there who were getting them on their health insurance. I can also use my health insurance payment card for things like a box of plasters or cough sweets. It also covers my petrol costs to go to hospital or doctor’s appointments. All sorts of things.

The NHS isn’t “for sale”. Already private contractors carry out many functions within the organization. I get that British people “love our NHS” and want to keep it, but like anything else it gets to the stage where it’s no longer fit for purpose and needs either a major overhaul or to be replaced. I also get the fear of the unknown that seems to permeate whenever this topic is raised.

Having lived in the U.K. and now living in the US, I know where I’d rather be ill.

BritWifeinUSA

A friend of mine developed Multiple Sclerosis in 1987, aged 17, just after her DF died suddenly leaving the whole family without a penny to their name. How would she have coped these past 32 years without insurance ?

@nononever $1500 for an ear infection? She’s kidding you. My husband isn’t even paying anywhere near that to be treated for cancer. Either she’s exaggerating or somethings messed up with her insurance billing. I’ve never had an ear infection here but I have had bronchitis. GP visit is $10 and the prescription was less than $7.

I was in a US hospital a few months ago. It was extremely shabby, think NHS circa 1992. There were old men parked on trolleys, unattended throughout the night, groaning. I waited many hours and was charged thousands and thousands of dollars for the routine tests they did. They missed the actual problem (UTI) and sent me away still unwell. This was in Manhattan, not a rural hospital or anything.

At the end of the night instead of just discharging me they led me to a small room and closed the door. This is the billing room. You can't leave until you've settled the bill.

Whatever happens, I definitely won't seek medical care in the US on my own again. It's really a horrifying, destabilising setup. It means nobody ever, ever can feel safe. I think that's the point of it.

@SerendipityJane is she here in the US? If so, disabled people are covered by Medicaid, which is financed by taxation.

Thanks for all the info.

@BritWifeinUSA what's the situation for people who can't afford to pay the $400 per month or the fee up to the $5000 cap? Is it free like it is here?