To ask how much work your Y12 child does?

[SunshineAngel]

I remember my A Level days with fondness, but also remember them as incredibly hard work.

My DSS started sixth form in September, studying 3 A Levels. He never seems to be doing any work outside of college. I have seen him do work perhaps 3 times since he started, and even that was only for half an hour or so each time.

I have spoken to him about it with his dad, and he insists that he's doing all of his homework in his frees. But he has two days where he's only in at lunch time - which takes up the majority of his frees - and he doesn't go in earlier. He gets up at 12, so doesn't even work at home. Then one afternoon he does sport in his free and another free is taken up with football training.

I don't see how he can possibly have any frees left to work in, given the ones I've mentioned above.

I remember having a lot of homework, assignments and revision to do. I have explained to him that not all A Level work is just homework, and he's expected to revise right from the beginning and do extra research off his own back, but he's not doing anything.

He struggled with GCSEs and only just got into sixth form, but was insistent that this is the path he wants to take. But I worry because if he struggled for GCSEs, these are harder, and he's doing no work.

He's also been late about 8 times since the start of term because he messes around that much in a morning that we see the bus drive past the house when he's still brushing his teeth or something. It doesn't matter what time he gets up - he always runs late.

Can anyone let me know how much work their Y12 children are doing at the moment? Is it too early in the year to expect him to be chained to his desk, or are myself and his dad right to be concerned?

Unfortunately at his age we feel he should take responsibility for himself, so we're reluctant to push it if it's not a problem .. but I think it might be.

Appreciate any input :) and maybe tips on how/when he should be studying!

DD was doing 4 subjects in year 12 and had loads of homework. She dropped down to three subjects after AS levels, but still had lots of homework.

I think your DSS is being economical with the truth, and he will soon get a wake up call. What subjects is he studying?

@Ginfordinner That's what I suspected. He's doing philosophy, economics and history, all of which I would have thought would have plenty of work. I did history myself and even though I worked hard I underestimated it and ended up dropping it (back in the days you dropped one after the first year) and I regret that, as it was actually my favourite.

Just don't want the same thing to happen to him!

I think he's loving his new-found independence but too much.

He’s swinging the lead, OP. A Y12 student (by November) should be doing several hours of study for each of their subjects outside the classroom. 4-5 hours per subject at least.

Does he have a progress monitoring day coming up? This could be when he gets a wake up call. (Someone in my DDs class suddenly started to take the class seriously when they realised their parents were about to get a progress report.) If your DSS is really falling behind I would hope that college would be about to intervene anyway... Although this doesn't always happen.

My DD doesn't get that much work - but she is reading around her subjects as well.

DD doing Biology, Chemistry, Maths and Computer Science - has 2 hours of "free" study during the school day and does an hour to an hour and a half a night - some of it homework, some of it consolidating her work of the day. She probably does a couple of hours on a weekend, but that will ramp up for mocks during Christmas break after Christmas itself...

This is all done off her own bat, she is thankfully, bright, self-motivated and hard working, with some common sense too.
(yes - we are aware we are lucky)

DS in Y12 and has been, on the whole, fairly casual about work up to now, submitting just about what he thinks will cause him the least amount of hassle. I have to say he's putting in a fair bit more work at home than I'd anticipated.

He sounds like he isn't pulling his weight and isn't working hard enough.

I only formally collect in essays and homework but there is a lot I expect them to get on with.

It sounds like he could be a student who got his GCSEs because school threw huge amounts of intervention at him and so he feels entitled to doss in y12 in the hope someone (his teachers) will pull him up and spoon feed him in y13. That won't happen.
If he doesn't do well then in 6th forms I've been in students who don't perform in y12 exams (instead of AS levels) are called in for meetings with parents and a serious discussion happens about their future

Thanks all - this is what I suspected!

@BeyondMyWits I was that kind of student as well, like your DD, which I think is why I'm struggling to comprehend the attitude of my DSS. I just did everything! But I still didn't find it easy, which is what's worrying me more.

@MollyButton We get a report at the end of each term, but there are no parents evenings as they like to treat them like adults. He says he got an A in a recent piece of homework but I have a feeling that's made up because I saw it, and it was a couple of lines at best! That's not an essay in my eyes! Fingers crossed if the report is poor it'll kick him up the bum a bit.

@churchandstate Thanks. That's what I thought he should be doing (I always got told an extra hour at home for each class hour) but he's saying he's doing them in frees but he can't be doing that much as he doesn't have that many, and he stays in bed for most of them!

@BreconBeBuggered Yes, DSS has been like that. For his GCSEs we ended up confiscating his playstation for a few hours every evening while he did revision, and that's the only way he'll work. We're reluctant to do that now he's almost 17 - particularly as he's claiming he doesn't need to do anything, so he'd just be sitting there twiddling his thumbs - but I don't see what else we can do tbh.

It's also made slightly tricky because his dad never stayed on after school, whereas I did (plus I'm quite a bit younger) so I'm the one with A Level knowledge but I'm not his mum .. so as far as he's concerned, I can't tell him what to do because I'm not his mum, and his dad can't tell him because he never did A Levels so doesn't know what they're like .. his words not mine!

@LolaSmiles Yes that's exactly right. At GCSE they had exams every half-term, and two hours of compulsory revision most nights after school .. plus his dad took his playstation off him and we supervised revision at home. Even with all that, he got passes, just what he needed to get to college but nothing more.

I do feel like he needs telling what to do, but it's difficult as his college aren't as communicative with parents as school were, as they're adamant the students are treated like adults .. I've explained what I used to do when I was his age to help with studies (I started downloading past papers from day 1!) but he's not interested, and just keeps repeating that he's "done his homework".

This is my son OP. Got fantastic GCSE's and now studying A level maths, business, geography. Just got decent marks (not outstanding) for mid term exams on seemingly very little extra work, although he does say he does a bit in the library most days. The rest of the time he's going in late, working, at the gym or playing football. He's 'done all his work' too whenever asked?? I didnA levels too and don't remember having as much free time.

Speaking as an A-level teacher, he is going to come a cropper in year 13 when he realises it's simply impossible to catch up the lacking knowledge and skills. He may also score so low in exams this summer that they ask him to leave.

Something practical you could do is buy the CGP revision guide for the subjects and look through to see what he does and doesn't know. He should have covered roughly 15% of the material by now.

You could also consider UpLearn for Economics. Make him pay and tell him you'll refund the money if he passes.

@cptartapp Sounds very familiar to me, apart from without the fantastic GCSE results unfortunately. Fingers crossed the tutors will guide them in the right direction!

@Phineyj Thanks for the advice about UpLearn, I will definitely look into that. I have told him that if he doesn't do well he will probably not be entered into the exams, as they won't want to lower their averages, but he insists that because young people now have to remain in education until the age of 18, they cannot do that. I have repeated several times that they can and will, and he may then end up having to do something that he really wouldn't have chosen because, as he rightly says, he has to stay in education!

DS has done very little work at home but there are maybe some differences to your situation.

He did very well in his GCSE's and is doing 4 A levels.

He says he's doing most homework in his free periods/lunchtime. Outside of that he's possibly doing 2/3 hours school homework a week.

I was a bit skeptical but during assessment week testing prior to half term he got A*'s across the board.

He says he is finding A Levels a lot easier than GCSE's because he's finally whittled down to subjects he's really good at and interested in - as such he's finding he can get through homework relatively quickly as he knows exactly what he's doing.

I should add that he does read a lot around his subjects at home off his own bat (he's always asking for new books to read) and he says as a result he's ahead of the syllabus so I suspect that may also be a factor.

DS is doing Maths, Further Maths, Physics and Computer Science, so he's not doing long essays that require research into source materials which is again is point of consideration vs your situation.

I did History A Level and remember doing a lot of homework on that subject alone; simply reading through the background source material before starting an essay was at least a couple of hours in itself.

So overall I think for some children it seems to be possible to get most work done in school time, but I don't think it's a general "thing".

If it's any consolation, my DF was a Head Teacher (now retired) and said year 12 was always a bit rocky for a lot of kids. They are high of the back of their GCSE's, a bit cocky about being in 6th form and yet to fully appreciate how tough A Levels are. He said the majority wake up to reality at some point in the year and by Year 13 are fully back on track and focused.

He may also score so low in exams this summer that they ask him to leave.

DD's old school used to "manage out" students who looked like they were going to fail. Any student achieving less than a D at AS level was asked to leave (her school was one of the last to do AS levels in 2017). Your DSS sounds too complacent, and I think he will get a nasty shock.

but there are no parents evenings as they like to treat them like adults.

They are being short sighted here to assume that all 16/17 year olds are emotionally mature enough to understand the implications of not pulling their weight. I think the college are failing the students and are setting them up to fail if they won't even engage with the parents now and again.

DeRigueurMortis your son sounds exceptional. Most A level students just don't have the focus and single mindedness that he does. When DD was doing 4 subjects in year 12 she didn't have enough free periods to to all of her homework, plus consolidation and revision at school. At her school they had tutor time and enrichment every week, so DD had about 6 free periods a fortnight.

Given that the advice was to study an hour per hour of subject taught it meant that DD had 20 hours a week of homework/private study.

I believe that this advice is still given SunshineAngel so your DSS should be doing at least 15 hours a week of extra study in his own time.

Gin you may be right.

It's a bit hard to know what's "normal" when you only have one reference point. I also think the maths/further maths/physics crossover helps with the workload (or rather he says it does - what the hell would I know having done an Arts degree!).

He is exceptionally good at maths/physics especially and really enjoys it - as I said he reads subject books "for fun". He'd already read the A Level revision guides and recommend text books for all his subjects in the summer before he started year 12 .

There's no pressure from our side, frankly as parents we'd rather he expanded his social life a bit lot more rather than being a bookworm or coding the "latest" project online with his friends - I guess there is a flip side to every situation in that regard!

He should be doing about 3-4 hours of extra work a day.

Thanks again to everyone :). We've had another chat to him this evening and we've basically said that if he doesn't start doing at least some work every night (at my computer which I can see from where I sit, with no phone or TV in the room) we will have to be stricter and stop him going on his playstation again. Unfortunately that's all he seems to want to do.

You've all confirmed what I thought, but I didn't want to start muscling in without being absolutely sure. As I mentioned above, I'm in the slightly precarious position of only being his step-mum, but my partner never did A Levels so apart from telling him to work and discipling when needed, I'm the one who can really guide him and help with revision etc. So I'm more comfortable pushing that now.

Thank you :).

as I said he reads subject books "for fun". He'd already read the A Level revision guides and recommend text books for all his subjects in the summer before he started year 12

Most year 12s don't do this IME.

Rather than enforcing an hour or whatever, I'd ask to look at his notes and assignments.

Tell him his dad has been through the university of life and is not too thick to understand the bloody assignments! Mind you, your dss will end up with no A levels if he carries on like this.

@yasle At the end of the summer holidays I took him shopping and got him files, paper, pens, ruler, pencil case, folders .. everything I thought he might need.

His work is screwed up in his bag, there isn't very much there at all, and he now takes one chewed biro in his jeans pocket.

I know he's a lad and I was a teacher's pet but even so I would expect more than this, and his dad certainly does!