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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to think if you’re STUCK in the RENTAL TRAP…

107 replies

Didyousaysomethingdarling · 24/11/2019 18:58

...and been reliably paying years and years of rent, you should qualify for a mortgage, which equals your monthly repayments?

If so, it looks like the Tory ‘Lifetime Mortgage’ pledge is aimed at getting your vote.

In a bid to get more people on the housing ladder the Tories have pledged to ease affordability rules arguing that more than two million people could afford a mortgage at a rate of 2.35pc but would fail the current tests of 7pc and above (taken from The Telegraph).

I think they’ve stolen the idea from the Jamie Pogson petition. Could this make a difference to you?

OP posts:
Didyousaysomethingdarling · 24/11/2019 23:11

@ posterferntwist

LOL. No just OCD about property. I spend too much time on house and finance forums (Money Week, HPC and Property Tribes). And have a lot of SE friends who would be better off if they could get a mortgage. It probably needs to be run in tandem with a Land Value Tax to stop house prices running away again.

OP posts:
Didyousaysomethingdarling · 24/11/2019 23:21

@SoxiFodoujUmed

IT'S FIXED. REPAYMENTS STAY THE SAME THE WHOLE TIME!

If you're worried about losing your job you get unemployment protection insurance, which pays your mortgage while you're unemployed. The government also help, Support for Mortgage Interest (SMI) you pay them back when you sell your home. If you can, you save, so that you've got something to fall back on.

OP posts:
zsazsajuju · 24/11/2019 23:23

I agree op, this seems like a good idea. They have long term fixes in the US though and they are underwritten by the government. I think we may need that in this country too. If you fix for 20 years at a low rate, that’s fine just now, but if in 10 years interest rates are a lot higher, that would start to cause issues for the lenders (who would have to borrow the cash to lend from somewhere.

Inebriati · 24/11/2019 23:26

The Tories sold off council housing stock which has ended up in the hands of private landlords who have raised market rents because they want to make a profit and you want me to vote Tory.

mmmkay.

Didyousaysomethingdarling · 25/11/2019 00:07

@Inebriati
It wasn't just the Tories selling off council houses, New Labour were at it too.
Labour had 13 years to stop Right to Buy. They could have stopped it anytime between 1997 – 2010.
They're all as guilty as each other.

OP posts:
PathOfLeastResitance · 25/11/2019 00:11

It’s a ploy to gain votes. There’s no way this will ever actually happen.

HeIenaDove · 25/11/2019 00:14

What's not fair is social housing where repairs are done free of charge and the rent stays low

Id say you are closer to Tory than you like to admit with a comment like that.

Meanwhile in the real world of social housing.........
www.romfordrecorder.co.uk/news/havering-council-tenants-report-to-ombudsman-1-6383664?fbclid=IwAR2I9CxUOlE7kAPHgPyGuJkzsRGFPXRWtAO8D8onrpDM_5GwqnQWZ6Bp-vo

A family is planning to take legal action against Havering Council after three years of misery in a home contractors said was up to scratch.

Retired bailiff Paul Lewis, 52, daughter Sophie and her three-year-old son moved into the house in Hilldene Avenue in September 2016
An inspection in the summer had given the council property a clean bill of health after basic renovations costing £6,700.

But from their first night, the tenants said, a series of nightmares - from chronic leaks to mould to rats, and the recent discovery of asbestos in the roof - have blighted their lives and led to further repair works costing tens of thousands to the taxpayer.

Mr Lewis, who is disabled and cared for full-time by his daughter, said: "We told them we've had enough of this place. We can't go on living like this

"This was meant to be my last home but it hasn't worked out. Instead they're digging their heels in, my grandson is caged up like an animal in the summer and we're running alive with rats."

In June 2016 an operative for Harold Hill-based contractor the Breyer Group inspected the empty property and found no issues with the plumbing or electrics.

Breyer was awarded a £35million contract in 2014 for repairs and void works in Havering's 10,000 homes.

The move was controversial at the time as the firm's last contract with Southwark Council had been terminated over a "life-threatening incident
The contract expired in March 2019 but has been extended until 2021, at a rough cost of £3.3m a year, before Havering begins re-procurement.

On the night the family moved in, the upstairs flooded as the radiators turned out to only be gaffa-taped to the walls.

Mr Lewis said, "An emergency plumber came out and said 'How the hell have they signed this place off?'."

Black mould that had been "washed down" for £8.82 in the summer was already re-growing and rainwater seeped through the ceilings from a a leak in the roof. The leaks, the family said, "destroyed everything we had

Builders were drafted in in October 2017 to replace the old tiles and rip down the chimney stack, which it emerged was on the brink of collapse.

The electrics cabinet was out of date and pronounced "unsatisfactory" in a later inspection, while wiring in the ceiling roses were not earthed: a possible fire hazard

In mid-2017 the family reported concerns about rats and mice to the council. The garden was baited but huge rats have been found scuttling across the garden and in the kitchen cupboards, and are now thought to be living in the cavity walls.

Sophie Lewis, a former NHS secretary, told the Recorder: "My son wakes up screaming 'The rats are going to bite me, mummy'.

We lost our whole summer; we couldn't have the back doors open. How do you explain to a three-year-old that he can't go outside and play?".

Mr Lewis's floor had to be torn up after birds found their way in through a hole left open in the wall

The bathroom - which the council paid £2,700 to be brought up to "decent homes standard" in 2016 - has now been ripped out and replaced three times
n spring 2019, contractors investigating the rats in the loft made another discovery: a full sheet of chrysotile asbestos, somehow not flagged up by roofers in 2017.

One thing the Breyer operative had flagged up in summer 2016 was the need for an asbestos survey.

And throughout the roof works in 2017 dust from that part of the house had been flooding the living room.

The family, two of whom have asthma, were told that they would be moved as a matter of urgency. But then the council said it was safe for them to stay as long as the material was not "disturbed" - although the sheet was already broken

The family complained to Havering Council and the Housing Ombudsman. In June 2019, a member of Havering's complaints team upheld it, saying: "I have seen evidence of service failure and evidence procedures have not been followed."

They also apologised "for the failure in services provided to you dating back to the start of your tenancy."

But in a letter to Julia Lopez MP in August, the council's interim head of housing, Bernadette Marjoram, wrote that to date all repairs issues in the property were caused by "wear and tear", adding: "The correct processes were followed at the time."

The family have said that once re-housed, they will be seeking compensation for the council for the thousands they have paid on independent expert help.

Mr Lewis said one sub-contractor alone told him they had made more than £60,000 from work since they moved in

He said: "A few months ago they knew we didn't want to be around anymore and fudged it internally, and they still haven't dealt with the problems. I can't carry on living like this. They owe me compensation for everything we've been through."

Analysis by homelessness charity Shelter this year found that one in 10 social housing tenants had reported an issue with their home more than 10 times.

Some 56 per cent of tenants surveyed in the UK had experienced a problem - from electrical hazards to gas leaks to faulty lifts - in the past three years

The charity has backed calls from campaign group Grenfell United for a new regulator for social housing. Chief executive Polly Neate said:

Polly Neate, chief executive of Shelter, said: "Tinkering with the current system just isn't good enough when people have lost trust in it to keep them safe."

The Breyer Group did not respond to a request for comment and Havering Council did not initially respond.

However, upon publication of this article, a Havering Council spokesman did then respond, describing Mr Lewis' case as "very complex" and claiming that the issues highlighted in our reporting of his living conditions "do not tell the whole story".

The spokesman added: "We have done and continue to do everything we can to resolve certain problems at the property. We are also supporting the tenants in finding a new home where we hope they will be happier.

But yeah they should just suck it up right? I cant believe ppl still come out with this shit post Grenfell.

Inebriati · 25/11/2019 00:17

What's not fair is social housing where repairs are done free of charge and the rent stays low

WTAF. Landlords should maintain their properties.
Social housing rents aren't low, they are normal. Private rents are so high you've been suckered.

HeIenaDove · 25/11/2019 00:21

HelenaDove Sun 17-Nov-19 18:36:22
17.11.2019
It’s Time to Be Honest about Housing
By
Glyn Robbins
For decades terms like 'affordable,' 'social,' 'mixed' have been used as cover for market failures in housing - it's time to move on from those schemes and commit to a real solution: council housing.

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When it comes to housing, language matters. Politicians, bureaucrats, big business and self-appointed experts have become well-versed in using words that convey one thing, but mean another. This doublespeak has been deliberately used to underpin a particular policy approach which, at root, favours the failed capitalist market over socialist alternatives.

But whatever the political outlook, there’s no denying we have an acute housing emergency. As we approach a general election in which tackling the crisis will be a vital issue, it’s imperative to challenge and change the misleading terminology that’s been used as cover for policies that are causing huge damage to working class communities – and in some places, the reputation of the Labour Party.

If you want to get a laugh out of someone eager to hop on the housing ladder, say “affordable housing” – because most people know how little it means. The abuse of the term began in 2010 when the Tory-led coalition government defined affordable rent as anything up to 80% of the full market level. This opened a door, which was already ajar, for private developers to get planning permission while purporting to provide affordable homes, but at prices well beyond the means of most people and bearing no relationship to local housing need.

Another discredited term is “social housing.” This has been used as a convenient catch-all to disguise important differences between different types of non-market rented homes.

The prime culprits for this deliberate distortion are Housing Associations (HAs), particularly the big ones who have become virtually indistinguishable from private developers. The origins of this charade was in the Blair-Brown era policy of stock transfer, which drove two million council homes – and the land they stand on – out of public ownership into the private sector, a bigger transfer of wealth than any of the Thatcher-era privatisations.

This could usually only happen after tenants had voted in favour of the move. To persuade them, HAs needed to create the subterfuge that they were more or less the same as councils. They’re not. HAs are legally defined, constituted and operated as private businesses, and their tenants have significantly weaker legal rights and higher rents. Referring to HAs as “social landlords” providing “social housing” hides these facts.

The next item in the linguistic three-card trick is “mixed communities.” This term has assumed sacred status in urban policy and government circles, without any evidence to support it. The concept is that bringing people from different socio-economic backgrounds together in one place produces multiple benefits. On its surface, that seems plausible.

But in practice, what might be a laudable aim is based on deception, hypocrisy and class prejudice. The reality of “mixed” housing developments is often physical separation by tenure, as graphically illustrated by Guardian journalist Harriet Grant’s exposure of the segregation of children’s play areas. Commonly, so called “mixed” housing means social renters in one building, private owners in another, where they enjoy better facilities and probably a better view.

The mixed mantra suggests it’s better for working class communities to have middle class people living with them, acting as role models and bringing trickle-down wealth and cultural diversity to an area, reflected in new shops and coffee bars. I once discussed this with a property developer, who worked for a HA. He said “we thought it was going to be better for the estate as a whole to have a Tesco there that didn’t sell out of date milk and the odd bottle of twenty year old Blue Nun… we’d have thought we’d arrived if there was a Starbucks there or a deli, as well as the pound shop.”

The prime targets for such social engineering are council estates subject to large scale “regeneration” projects, another word that’s become heavily loaded. Again, some of the responsibility for this lies with New Labour. In 1998, Tony Blair launched the New Deal for Communities at the Aylesbury estate in south London. Today, the area is testimony to how housing policies dominated by private developers have reshaped working class communities and the role of HAs in this
The Elephant and Castle neighbourhood is being physically, socially and ethnically transformed. This started with the demolition of the Heygate estate, a classic for stigmatised perceptions of council housing and the people who live in it. As the local 35% Campaign has meticulously documented, a succession of promises to Heygate residents were broken to arrive at a situation where 1,214 council homes were demolished, to be replaced with 2,704 new homes, of which only 82 (3%) are for social rent. The HA partner was London and Quadrant. To be eligible for the cheapest one-bedroom home built by them on the Heygate site, people needed a minimum household income of £57,500. The average household income in that part of Southwark is £24,324

There are numerous similar examples from other places around the country, where a seductive lexicon has been used to camouflage brutal profit-seeking and displacement. At Labour’s 2017 conference, Jeremy Corbyn correctly referred to such practices as “social cleansing.” There is also a strong element of institutional racism in policies that favour better-off home owners and seek to recreate an area in their image – as James Baldwin bluntly put it, “urban renewal means negro removal.” But the other critical point about the policies that lie behind the words is that they don’t work! We’ve had over 20 years of the developer-led, public-private partnership model and the housing crisis has only got worse.

It is essential that the Labour Party breaks with the misleading, dishonest and failed housing policies of the past. The first step for doing this is restoring real council housing to the mainstream, as the centrepiece of a comprehensive rethink. The opportunity is there. Party conference has unanimously adopted a raft of transformative measures, including ending right-to-buy, improving rights for private tenants, using publicly-owned land to build publicly-owned homes and reforming HAs. They must be included in the election manifesto.

For too long, mealy-mouthed Labour politicians have seemed embarrassed by council housing. This has allowed the language of housing to be captured and twisted by corporate interests. Council housing cuts through the verbiage. Working class communities know what it means, how it works and why it’s important. Sometimes those qualities can be taken for granted, so it’s worth repeating them.

Only council housing offers genuinely affordable rents and secure tenancies that can form the foundation of people’s lives. Only council housing is directly linked to the democratic process. Decisions are taken in public, by elected politicians who can be voted out. Another linguistic distortion by hostile forces is that council housing is “subsidised,” when, in fact, it generates a net surplus and receives far less public money than the private market.

Council housing also has the capacity to link to wider social policy objectives, particularly around environmentalism. Climate change won’t be stopped through the individualism fostered by the ideology of private home ownership. Above all, council housing works because it’s not subject to the whims of the speculative property market.

It’s a supreme perversion of language that council housing is sometimes attacked because it provides “a home for life.” Labour needs to turn that around and say that’s exactly what we want

Bookmark
Add message | Report | Message posterHeIenaDove Sat 23-Nov-19 03:25:04
HelenaDove Thu 08-Aug-19 23:43:07
www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/residents-near-tottenhams-new-stadium-18864998

Residents near Tottenham's new stadium fear they're being 'pushed out of area'

Plush new £1billion stadium couldn't be further away from Love Lane estate as tensions between club and locals grow.

Outside, you are standing on streets that are among the 5% most deprived in Britain.

The stadium redevelopment was an opportunity to lift the prospects of the people who live here.

But, instead, as the regeneration surrounding the stadium continues with a development known as High Road West, many families now fear they will simply be swept away.

A new walkway proposed to bring fans from a new station entrance at White Hart Lane station brings its own statistics. 297 social housing homes threatened with demolition in a borough with a severe housing shortage

Where 10,000 households are on the council’s waiting list and 3,000 families are stuck in temporary accommodation.

Meanwhile, 30 small manufacturing businesses on the Peacock estate, providing hundreds of decent local jobs, are facing eviction via a ­compulsory purchase order

The proposals will also mean the loss of a library

iswhois · 25/11/2019 00:28

Really you think conservatives will give you a deposit for a mortgage?

Didyousaysomethingdarling · 25/11/2019 00:35

@iswhois
They were considering it last year.
Under the Onward plan the “Good Landlord” would be eligible for tax relief (CGT) with the windfall split equally with the tenant, who could use it as part of their mortgage deposit. The thinktank estimates that the average gain per property would be £15,000, meaning a first-time buyer could expect to benefit by £7,500.

OP posts:
Didyousaysomethingdarling · 25/11/2019 00:38

@iswhois
More carrot than stick compared to Labour/John McDonnell's thoughts on Right to Buy for renters. But the same outcome?

OP posts:
HeIenaDove · 25/11/2019 00:43

"because the insane amount we spend on housing benefit, a third of which already goes to pensioners"

Which is linked to Pension Credit which pensioners with younger partners cannot claim now as now it has to be Universal Credit

k1233 · 25/11/2019 03:51

I'm in a different country, but this was the exact way I got my home loan. Rental history was proof of savings, just needed a 5% deposit, which they didn't care how I got. I saw a mortgage broker and specifically asked about this type of loan as I'd heard of / read about them.

Didn't mean I wasn't assessed re ability to meet loan repayments. Just that I didn't need a larger deposit, which can be hard to come by when rent is the equivalent of, or more than, a mortgage repayment. My mortgage repayments are less than I was paying in rent and now the money is actually getting me something that will appreciate in value, instead of being an expense outgoing.

Lessthanzero · 25/11/2019 04:01

The tories are only offering this so house prices can keep going up. They don't actually care about people getting on the ladder.

If mortgages were still only 3 x salery then hardly anyone would be able to afford a house at the current rates and so prices would come down. But the tories keep inventing new ways to get people to buy property at these over inflated prices - thus keeping the costs high.

CrumpetyTea · 25/11/2019 04:18

There are absolutely no details so its impossible to say. what a surprise that is.
I can't believe that pension funds would queue to tie up money long term in this (unless they are getting a backhander in some way) - they want access to rising rates.
You can't compare the rates offered on this with government bond yield.

For individuals- you are looking at people who are reliably paying off their rent but not saving enough to save a deposit - then these people are hit with repairs and maintenance - its a different cost base

katewhinesalot · 25/11/2019 04:28

Surely it just changes the risk from banks to pension funds. Imagine the crisis if pension funds fold.

How can any government guarantee a rate for 30 years when the economic climate is unknown? It's too risky.

Lilyflower1 · 25/11/2019 04:41

To remind those on this thread who have very strong views but without the knowledge and understanding that underpins them :-

Marxism believes in the state ownership of land and the means of production. McDonnell’s plans will end in the transfer of property from public and private owners to the state. This means the state will eventually own your house and will control who lives where and who works where. It is a system which purports to aim at equality and fairness but which is , almost necessarily, pursued in a framework of state control backed by force.

Capitalism is not a stated ideology but an observation of how free markets work within a framework of law. Individuals may own what they can afford, say what they like and think what they please as long as what they think or do conforms to the law. Capitalist societies do not have to resort to force and rule by consent. They rest on truth and freedom.

Lilyflower1 · 25/11/2019 04:47

I would have to agree with those the OP and posters who are complaining that under a Conservative government those who currently can not afford a house would be helped to buy one. What infamy! How dreadful. To be forced to have a rising capital asset, a home and a place of safety and security, a bulwark against trouble and a source of capital for funding the future of children - and an asset which which costs less than renting.

Really, how could they?

Ilovetolurk · 25/11/2019 04:52

I can't believe that pension funds would queue to tie up money long term in this (unless they are getting a backhander in some way) - they want access to rising rates

There could well be some appetite for fixed returns for part of pension scheme liabilities. Many pension funds will be converting GMPs to fixed increases in payment.

Hard to say how attractive this scheme would be without more details though

GhostofFrankGrimes · 25/11/2019 06:40

There should be massive reform of the private rental sector so that tenants have more rights/security. Given a number of Tories are landlords this will never happen.

GhostofFrankGrimes · 25/11/2019 06:43

Handing over property to children just perpetuates inequality generation after generation but then if you're tory this is probably seen as a good thing...

cochineal7 · 25/11/2019 08:00

@lilyflower1 Capitalism also relies on the markets doing their own job. The conservatives mortgage for life is not market-conform as it is priced below market. So it has to be funded. Now tell me why our tax needs to be paying for people to get on the housing ladder (an argument can be made for that, but it is more McDonnell than capitalist). Tories like their handouts just as much; they just disguise them so it doesn’t look the same, but massive VAT breaks for private schools, in-work benefits to top up underpaying companies (who then get to keep the profit), or propping up lifetime mortgage, are handouts too. You can’t have your argument both ways.

Lilyflower1 · 25/11/2019 14:40

Cochineal7, yes, you have a point. Human nature and self interest will operate in any system and both parties have a track record of 'picking favourites' and throwing bunce at them.

However, given that law, institutions and free speech go hand in hand with capitalist type political entities we are free to identify problems and argue until they are reformed and there are mechanisms for doing this.

Try and complain about the inefficiencies of a Marxist state.

Look at the economy of Venezuela, or the fate of Hong Kong, or what is happening to the Uighers in China. An individual does not dissent in a planned economy backed by force.

I would rather be poor and free than well fed and fearing the knock on the door in the middle of the night.

egontoste · 25/11/2019 15:25

I'd rather live in a cardbox box in the middle of the road than vote Tory.