For wanting to work 4 days per week after 6 months employment?

[sadibird]

I just started a new job in June this year and I am finding full time work (5 days per week, 40 hours at work) and motherhood to be so exhausting (my LO is almost 2). I have had three blocked ducts and one case of mastitis since I began my new job! I think exhaustion and stress of trying to do it all are the culprits.

My supervisor is pretty relaxed and there is one other mum on our team who has only worked 3 days per week since she had her baby 6 years ago, but she had been working here for 9 years at that point.. And apparently she had to fight quite a bit for that part time schedule. But that was under different management, so I think maybe it could be different now.

Anyway, I know that I signed up for a full time job but I'm really wondering how long I can keep this pace up. So I'm considering asking in the New Year if it would be possible to drop down to 4 days per week so I could have a rest to look forward to once a week. I will have been with this organization for over 6 months at that point. Also, I honestly think that I could do the same amount of work in 4 instead of 5 days because I have been spending a lot of time on self-study to get up to speed on the content of my role. But I'm not really sure how to address that one (if at all) without sounding like I haven't been doing 5 days worth of work around here...!

PS. I am posting from Canada but I really like the feedback that MN mums seem to give, that's why I am asking here! But I think we have different laws and rules regarding part time work here than in the UK.

It's very hard for us to say tbh, because most of us are familiar primarily with UK law and culture around this. In the UK you'd have the right to request it and if you were a good worker with valued market skills I'd say you would have a good shot at getting it, but North America seems to be more rigid around FT hours..?

@CmdrCressidaDuck That's a really good point about the cultural difference! I had not considered that. I wish we had something like MN in Canada where I could ask this question...! I'll look around. Thanks for your input

You are so not unreasonable to want it!

That said, I haven't a clue about Canadian employment law or culture.

Would compressed hours be an option? They might go for that - they'd still be getting their 40 hours out of you.

Only 4 commutes and associated costs.
And quite frankly, I found doing a ten hour work day and coming home to find dinner ready and LO ready for bed easier than an 8 hour day, pick ups, dinner and bedtime routine.

That depends on a lot of factors though.

Surely your need to look more closely at the business justification & impact? I.e. can your job be done in 4 days a week, and how? That's what your manager and employer will care about most... Think on it and have a rationale in place.

Posted too soon argh.

You have sort of already explained how to frame the "so you can do your job in 80% of the time, what have you been doing with your spare time".. optimization and getting up to speed, etc

OP, appreciate you're not in the UK but here is the legislation for us - see if you've got an equivalent in Canada. The reasons for being able to reject are important here - I had a boss several years back who was VERY keen to formalise an informal work-from-home arrangement I had... I suspected he wanted to try to take it away from me, but it backfired on him as he had no grounds to reject it.
www.gov.uk/flexible-working

@7Days Thank you! We don't have a law in Canada or in British Columbia (the province I live in) regarding part time work for mothers. But I think the culture is beginning to shift in favour of more flexible work arrangements, especially for mothers (eg. my colleague working 3 days per week for the last 6 years). I think asking in the New Year might feel right for me because even though there is no law, I feel like 6 months is good amount of time to have shown them that I am dedicated and a good worker.

I had considered compressed hours, but unfortunately I would not be able to make it work because DH works out of town for a week or two each month so I have to be available for daycare drop off and pick up. Otherwise I would! It sounds so lovely to come home to dinner ready and LO ready for bed!

@PlutoAjder Yes, that is a very good point. I have thought about that a lot, and I think that I am at a point now where I feel like I have gotten up to speed in a reasonable way so I expect that amount of self-study that I do will start to lessen. As well, my position has a lot of long-term, on-going projects associated with it, so there are not frequent deliverables. I think cutting back my hours to 80% will just mean that those projects will take a bit longer to complete or I will just have to work faster/smarter (which I think is doable and fine - it just is a tricky thing to pitch though!)

I don't know anything about Canadian employment laws, so may not be helpful.
I would avoid mentioning how exhausted you are because your employer might seize on that to claim that you're under performing.
Microsoft recently conducted a 4-day week experiment in their Japanese offices.
The London Stock Exchange are looking at shortening working hours.
This is something loads of companies are reviewing from the perspective of motivation and productivity.
Try emphasise the benefits of flexibility to your organisation as a whole. Are there any specific incentives or performance enhancements you can think of that you would like to lead?
Your employer needs to really see you as someone who is a good long term bet and who can really add value.
Or else look for a job with better working hours.

@scoobyd2 Thank you for the link! It is very interesting to see what legislation is like in the UK for this. I'm sorry to hear about the awkward pushing from your previous employer to formalise things - good thing you had the law to back you up!

I’m in the US. I have several full time (female) colleagues who have babies under 6 months old and they manage to cope so I can’t imagine saying that it’s too difficult with a nearly 2 year old would go down all that well. Appreciate that Canada is probably different but I’d stick to arguments that centre around the business needs, the precedent set by your colleague and not get into your home life to have the biggest chance of being successful.

Also do you have a partner and are they pulling their weight? You shouldn’t be ‘doing it all’ when working full time if you’re in a relationship.

Good luck with your request!

@Obsidian77 Haha yes I'm definitely not going to tell them I want a day off a week so I can sleep! But that's a great point about mentioning that this is a growing trend in the workplace and finding some stats to back up claims to greater productivity (TBH I do perform better under a bit of pressure and I think if I had 4 days to do 5 days worth of work, that little bit of pressure would motivate me to work faster/smarter).
And that's a good point about coming up with more ideas. I did just pitch a new, big project to my manager last week and he said it was a good idea and adopted it into the business plan this week! So that was a nice win. Might be a good time now to ask for the PT schedule - after that recent win...? Hmmm. I think I want to wait until 6 months has passed but maybe sooner might be OK too?

@sadibird worth pointing out I have no reason whatsoever to work from home - no children, or other dependants - we're protected here so anyone at all can ask for flexible working, be that part time, compressed hours, work from home..... We don't have to say why (it helps when we speak to line manager, but we do not have to say). I now work full time from home, its a massive help to my general health, but it comes down to whether there is a work reason why the employee should not/ cannot. Its down to the employer to give a work reason for rejecting it, not on the employee to justify why they want it.

@Expressedways I appreciate that other people's situations are different and they can go back to work at 6 months PP and be fine. I don't know anything about their situation that would have a big impact on how well they can cope being back at work and having an infant. Things like the support they receive from their partner, their immediate family, their friends, their physical health, their mental health, their emotional health, how much their baby sleeps, whether they are still BFing or pumping, their diet, their community etc. are all huge for how well a mother can balance family and work. My situation has it that I am tired while working FT and having a family, for a bunch of different reasons. Some of which are that my DH works out of town for up to two weeks at a time and I am solo parenting in a city without immediate family members for support and that I am exhausted because my almost 2 year old still wakes frequently at night to breastfeed. I also am recovering from PPD and have physical complaints that I need to see a chiropractor for weekly. I was not planning on releasing so much personal stuff, but I think it might help others see the reasons behind the exhaustion and not compare my/their situation to others! Thank you for your advice to not bring my personal reasons for wanting to work PT into the discussion with my employer - I was not planning to do that. I was simply being honest in my post here, which is anonymous and directed to other mothers. Maybe I should have been more clear in my original post that I was not going to tell my employer that I want to work less because I'm tired? Haha

I think maybe Canadian law is possibly a bit more similar to the U.K. than you might think. Anyway... I went from a full time job to a 3 day a week job after my 12 months maternity leave ( after 13 years in the same organisation). At the time I delivered a 2 week course several times a year. I negotiated my new hours in the basis that I would still deliver those courses ( and my mum helped with the extra days childcare). I’ve stayed part-time since although moved in the organisation a couple of times. When my daughter started school I went to 4 days a week but reduce to 3 days a week during the school holidays. Initially I did a pretty dull job and it was easy to fit in the hours. Now I’ve taken on something more challenging and it’s tough.... I’m definitely doing a full time job in 4 days. Quite a bit of it is time critical so I have to stay late to get it done. Luckily my DH does the pick ups so I can do this... although I’m often in after DD is in bed. The other advantage of my job though is the ability to work from home.... I’ve worked from home today and the relief is enormous because I haven’t had a 3 hour commute. You need to show that other people are not going to be inconvenienced by your absence one day a week. Would working from home 1 day a week be a possibility for you? Would you have flexibility to work your free day or a day at the weekend if a project necessitated it? I’ve recently worked 2 rest days ( 1 paid overtime and 1 for the day back) because we had a tight deadline. I don’t do it often but the fact that I would do it helps strengthen my case.

@sadibird the link I gave before, click on 'Applying for flexible working' and in there is a standard form - its a government form, my employer uses exactly the same questions. Again, very aware you're not in the UK, but using these might help you focus your arguments. Go for it!

It’s ok to be tired. I’m tired. I’m 49... I only have 1 pretty well behaved 7 year old and a DH who does his fair share but I’m menopausal and I don’t sleep well ( 4/5 hours a night) a 3 hour daily commute and a full time job fitted into 4 days. I do an online food shop on the train on a Thursday and I have a cleaner. I’m probably going to drop off a load of ironing tomorrow to get done. I get to pretty much every school event of which there are lots and I can afford cool excursions and holidays because of my job. It’s a balancing act for sure. We all do what we can to get by.