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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that the Wren kitchens sales model is almost mis-selling ? (Apologies for long post)

57 replies

albertcamus · 04/11/2019 17:48

So we’ve wasted 12 hours + going through the Wren Kitchens sales process, and have just cancelled our deposit payment. Maybe I’m being naïve, but I thought that the laws around selling were designed for the customer to get a clear price and a fair, transparent deal … but that’s not what we got at all. Our house is 18 years old and the kitchen’s beginning to look tired, so we chose Wren to quote for a replacement, hoping it would be a straightforward and price-inclusive process. We’re keeping the floor, doing our own decorating and required only a new dishwasher in terms of appliances; the ‘new kitchen’ is just replacement of existing cupboards and worktop, with Tek-board instead of tiling, and no change at all to the current design.

Step 1 involves a ‘Surveyor’ coming out; he was a nice guy who seemed to know what he was talking about technically, spent over an hour taking measurements and photos etc.

Step 2 is the showroom visit: based on the measurements taken by the ‘Surveyor’, your ‘Kitchen Designer’ salesperson shows you the cupboard, worktop and other material options. You are plied with cups of tea, shown 3-D and VR mockups (neither of which actually worked, but whatever), then given a heart-stopping price which dramatically falls with all the current ‘Special Offers’ applied – in our case it came down by 40%. It was still painfully-high, but we hoped that the high price reflected a no-hassle fitting service. When asked if this was a full and final fitted price, the salesperson replied evasively: ‘We send out an Engineer to check that everything you’ve chosen is OK for installation, but it’s rare for there to be any more costs.’

So far, so good; we paid the deposit, but asked for this ‘Engineer’ [how I hate the abuse of this word] to come out quickly so that any issues could be identified and we could be clear on the full price. So today he came out; it turns out that he’s not a Wren employee but an independent subcontractor. I was working in another room, but my bullshit radar was activated within the first five minutes, and I could hear my husband adopt his ‘I know you’re an idiot, but I’m too nice not to be polite to you’ voice.

Thirty minutes of nonsense and verbal diarrhoea later, according to the ‘Engineer’ we required re-plastering in preparation for the Tek-board due to the current tiles needing to be removed, vast amounts of electrical work despite everything going exactly into the current places etc. etc. No skip would be provided during the works, and the kitchen would be out of action for three weeks. So nowhere for rubbish to go, no kitchen for weeks and significant extra labour costs.

I said that we were already paying a high price for the kitchen, and had not expected all these additional costs, especially as an initial ‘survey’ had been completed and technical drawings etc. had all been made. He clearly did not like a mere woman bursting his bubble and flounced out.

We phoned Wren to cancel and ask for our deposit to be refunded, were put through to the Sales Manager who tried desperately to keep our business; it took 40 minutes of persistence to get our legal right, the refund, agreed to.

On reflection it’s pretty clear that the guy who turned up today is paid a low contractor rate by Wren and is therefore keen to invent unnecessary add-ons to increase his profit. Nothing he claimed was necessary was actually needed, and the additional costs were considerable.

I think that this sales model is mendacious, manipulative and capitalises on customers’ lack of time and technical knowledge to squeeze as much money as possible out of them. To me, the system borders on mis-selling in that we were led to believe that one (high) price quoted in the showroom would cover supply and installation with no hassle, when in reality we would have ended up paying a good few thousand pounds extra.

I’m quite disgusted that a household name company behaves in this way, and am now off to Howdens in the hope of better business ethics. Thanks for reading, please tell me if I am BU to feel that this is not a good sales model?

OP posts:
Sunsetsunrise1527 · 04/11/2019 19:23

My builder said that Howdens have to be decent as they have an ongoing relationship with the builder who will use them multiple times. As Wren only deal with clients and kitchens are replaced very infrequently the aftercare can be rubbish as it doesn't affect their profits.

We cancelled Wren and got the deposit back - we've just paid for our Howdens kitchen :D x

albertcamus · 04/11/2019 19:32

Sunsetsunrise1527 did you get the deposit back promptly? I've just been reading a forum where a buyer still hasn't had his refund back from 5th Sep 2019 Shock

OP posts:
smoresmores · 04/11/2019 19:35

We spent an inordinate amount of money with them and it was a disaster. The fitter (who was a local carpenter who looked about 12) did a really poor job. You won't speak to anyone from Wren once you walk out of the showroom. Utterly awful, you dodged a bullet there.

ScrubbyDubby · 04/11/2019 19:36

We just had a Wren kitchen installed. Love the kitchen but no way would I have paid their fitters to install it. Used a local guy and paid a third of the price Wren had quoted for the install, in fact the salesman in Wren told us it would be loads cheaper to find someone ourselves.

smoresmores · 04/11/2019 19:38

Have to echo that the worktop people were brilliant. But again nothing to do with wren.

To PP saying buy a wren kitchen and use your own fitter ... That's like setting fire to money. Any trades person will say Wren is hideously over priced. You pay for the perceived convenience (which doesn't exist).

If I ever do another renovation I would find a fitter and get them to purchase the kitchen using their trade account somewhere like Howdens. Organise the granite people and appliances myself.

ScrubbyDubby · 04/11/2019 19:44

smoresmores I don’t agree, Wren came out equal to Howdens in cost. But I bought appliances, sink, tap and worktops elsewhere so it was literally just the cupboards from Wren

MoreThanJustANumber · 04/11/2019 19:49

Be careful with Howdens, I was very disappointed with my Howdens kitchen once it was fitted. Apparently builders love them – they are easy to fit because there is a huge space at the back of the units. Consequently there's a lot less space IN the units. I have to put my long knives sideways in the drawers because they won't fit in the normal way. It's a huge waste of space (have lost a quarter of the storage space) and I really wish I'd gone for an Ikea kitchen – my previous one from Ikea was excellent, but I couldn't take it with me when I moved and my builders recommended Howdens and I didn't know any better!

BlueJava · 04/11/2019 19:59

YANBU! I wanted to have a double cupboard made in the utility area- literally to house a washing machine and tumble drier. I had explained over the phone I didn't want an entire kitchen, were they happy to just do the cupboard - yes they said. The contractor they sent insisted on measuring every last detail of the entire room, then I was invited to go to the showroom. I had already explained I knew what I wanted - basically a double unit with the same doors and top as the rest of the kitchen. I then got several phone calls trying to invite me in to choose the new kitchen which I kept turning down! I tried explaining calmly and rationally that they had the wrong end of the stick and a completely new kitchen was never my intention, I was then given offers as they seem to think I couldn't afford it and that was the problem. I then blocked their number!

Babybel90 · 04/11/2019 20:02

We used Magnet Trade and got our own fitter, we told them how much we wanted to spend (not much!) and they were great, there wasn’t a sales person as such, they sent a bloke out to measure up, which took him about 10 minutes then someone emailed us prices and a plan and that was it, no pushy sales tactics, no hidden extras, couldn’t recommend them enough.

Hecateh · 04/11/2019 20:09

Get your own fitter - WREN don't have fitters despite their claims 0 they subcontract and don't guarantee the work.

Look at DIY kitchens. The DIY only refers to design and you know what you want. They are cheaper than Wren, their cabinets are better made (with proper backs not ply), they make their own cabinets, have a fab choice, and, generally, they are pretty good with exchanging anything that has been damaged (they were for me but I have heard that some have had issues but they have resolved eventually).

If you are anywhere near Pontefract they have a great showroom (and they do station pickups for those travelling.

Def no hard sell

albertcamus · 04/11/2019 20:16

Hecateh that sounds good, we're in East Yorks so only 90 mins from Ponty

OP posts:
Arnoldthecat · 04/11/2019 20:22

It amazes me the mystique and extreme cost of kitchens. After all,what are we talking about, screwing a few cupboards to the wall !

BarbaraofSeville · 04/11/2019 20:28

Builders love Howdens because they can get their customers to pay the laughably high brochure price and use their trade discount to buy the units much cheaper.

I tried to buy a Howdens kitchen, but they put so many barriers in the way that I quickly gave up on the idea - would only talk to me at the branch where my kitchen fitter had an account, ignored me when I turned up for the appointment, kitchen designer ignored all my requests for the layout of the kitchen and would only design it in his way, which was useless as he was a young man who had obviously never cooked anything in his life and then finally it all fell apart when it turned out they couldn't supply an island sized piece of worktop.

So I went to Ikea instead, they were very helpful, helped me do the design I wanted and it was probably a fraction of the price of most other places of similar quality, which is excellent.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 04/11/2019 21:13

On reflection it’s pretty clear that the guy who turned up today is paid a low contractor rate by Wren and is therefore keen to invent unnecessary add-ons to increase his profit

Well spotted, albertcamus Wink Many of the big names subcontract work (while talking a blast about "our teams") and often accept only those who'll work for peanuts ... hence the mysterious add-ons which appear when they visit. It's also why so many turn out to be cowboys, since why would a reputable tradesman offer to work for so little in the first place?

I'm afraid I've little time for pressure selling and sudden "today only" reductions, and have walked out on a fair few in my time. Now I only deal with recommended, private local companies and get a much better job at a much better price

Mushypeasandchipstogo · 04/11/2019 21:21

Wren kitchens are a joke. My local radio station has been bombarded with complaints about them on the consumer advice show.

Runnerduck34 · 04/11/2019 21:27

We went to wrens to get a quote , had a surveyor measure up first, then spent hours , I mean hours in the showroom listening to sales speel and given an eye watering price even during the " sale". There was no real price breakdown given to us so we couldnt really see how it was so expensive. It did feel like a con, not a sale at all seemed there were so many hidden extras/ sundry items. They were doing 0% interest finance and I did like the units but the kitchen design was pretty much the same as we had already nothing inspired. In the end we went for an independent company who make and fit wooden kitchens, but we had to do a lot of prep work ourselves and get a builder in to do plastering, move sockets,tiling etc. Still spent a fortune but ended up with something bespoke.

etimram · 04/11/2019 21:29

We were put off when we went to thier showroom a dew days before xmas to find ALL thier stores were shut. When we phoned and asked whether were told they were all being rwfitted with sale kitchens.
Obviously they weren't reducing thier current ranges if they needed to shut every shop on a 40 mile radius of our city to be refitted with sale stock.
Put us right off. We all know the games they play but to bring in new stock for the sale isn't my idea of reduction or bargain so we we gave Wren a miss.
We ended up at Magnet who I have to say we're fantastic.

albertcamus · 04/11/2019 21:52

So, we've now obtained the details of a well-reputed local kitchen fitter.

We will go to Howdens this week to look at their range. We will also keep an eye on the bank to make sure the refund is processed this week as promised.

I'm just so glad the twat who turned up today was a very blatant cowboy so that I was motivated to tell him, and Wren, to get lost.

Many thanks to all for reading my long post and replying :)

OP posts:
NameChangedForTheDay · 04/11/2019 22:22

Thanks for posting this OP. Am looking for a new kitchen currently. Never done this before and was planning on going to Wren tomorrow. Probably won't now!

Have had a quote and design done by B&Q so far. No hard sell, decent price, but not many kitchen styles to choose from. So I want to get a second quote elsewhere. But where?!

raaaasss · 04/11/2019 22:28

Get your own fitter/carpenter and send your wren plan or quote to DIY-kitchens, they will quote you for the same or equivalent units. We did this with our Howdens quote and got a better quality kitchen for 6k. One Howdens branch quoted 9k, another 7k, I found their sales person to be a slimy git.

Ginnymweasley · 04/11/2019 22:33

When we were looking we went into wren to get a quote. Then I spent the next few weeks trying to get them to stop calling me. We went with magnet but used an independent fitter. It worked really well. Everything was done in a week. From ripping out the old kitchen, fighting new electrics, fitting kitchen and tiling. Magnet were actually really helpful as well.

albertcamus · 04/11/2019 22:50

Lol raaaasss 'slimy git' - he was here today Grin

NameChangedForTheDay I hope you get sorted. You andI have definitely dodged bullets with Wren.

OP posts:
DingDongDenny · 04/11/2019 23:05

I also suggest you check out DIY kitchens before going with Howdens. We bought ours there and it's really good quality. My DH fitted it himself

If you are looking for a specific colour, they colour match units from several paint ranges.

SusieOwl4 · 04/11/2019 23:11

I know someone who used wren . Were very happy with them but they fitted it themselves

FrangipaniBlue · 04/11/2019 23:17

Most kitchen places like Wren or Howdens use self employed fitters ( I know this because it's what DH does for a living!) so it really is pot luck and a bit of a postcode lottery as to whether you get a good one (like DHGrin) or a cowboy.

That said, I also know that DH has been to fit kitchens and realised very quickly that the "surveyor" was not an experienced joiner/fitter and more work was needed than the customer had been told.

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