To think the last 10 years of austerity is being thrown away?

[Snowy111]

I know some of you will say it was a waste of time anyway, and we should spend and raise taxes to get out of national debt, but...

Osborne followed by Hammond were following the traditional Tory policy to reduce spending to get out of debt. People and services have suffered very badly over the last 10 years because of this. If the tories carried on with their policy for a few more years it would turn the trend of debt going up and the debt would start to reduce. It’s around £2 trillion, that around £60k owed for every person in the country on top of any personal debt people owe.

And BJ/Cummings are throwing it all away with their election bribes. The NI threshold rise, the spending promises. Plus the BJ brexit deal is worse for the economy than where we are now, so there’ll be less money coming in.

But people completely fall for the election bribes and don’t think that the tories will eventually revert to type. Austerity will come back again and it will be harder and longer because of the throwaways being given now.

But of course it’s always labour that are the irresponsible ones with the finances

Unfortunately that’s the nature of our party political FPTP system - maybe it’s that that needs to change.

Can kind og agree with this, problem is that there is so many tribal voters out there that amplify the situation.

The PP tried to turn economics into a simplistic binary science and paint it as a right/left issue. That isn't a FPTP problem, its people trying to pretend they have an understanding but shows lack of knowledge. Trying to paint the situation as a simplistic black and white issue is the problem which then comes back to FPTP I suppose, I'm just rambling now.

Could be that now deficit spend is back to managable levels they can ease the tap on spending again, someone with your obvious understaning of economics should be able to see the nuance in that surely

What I see is a trashed economy with a poor growth outlook.

Turning the tap “on” again will cost more in the long run because of the decade long under investment. And that’s before we even get to the people who’ve died because of austerity driven mean spirited benefit cuts.

Further more, while the deficit has reduced, why has debt ballooned so much and what, exactly, will be done to tackle that?

The Tories are spending again but not tackling the huge levels of debt that have built up 🤷🏻‍♀️

Despite wanging on about it in 2010. Funny how it doesn’t matter quite so much when there’s an election coming.

National debt doesn't work like household debt anyway; this country has been in debt since the Napoleonic Wars.

Austerity is a purely ideological obsession and an excuse to shrink the state and punish the most vulnerable in our society. As a solution to debt it's an odd one as it creates a lot more debt among those with less money while others make money from the cycle of debt creation.

Plenty in the Cambridge Journal of Economics to get your teeth into if you need to read more.

You implied the banks have got away scot free, are you not even sure of your own arguments now

Ah, you’re one of those posters. Deliberately misunderstand and act as if they’re an expert

You mentioned a pay out.

I asked you which one. So I’m asking you, which one? Where did the banks have to make substantial repayments to rectify the billions of support they got? Where did they have to pay back into the system?

As for having to bail out banks to stop people losing their homes. Sorry - that didn’t happen. People did lose their homes because of the sub prime crisis.

And banks and financial institutions carried on as they were - well in some ways worse because they hoarded mountains of cash which mean the government had to come up with quantitative easing.

That ignores that Brown was promising to implement austerity so it wasn't just a Tory consipiracy, and you have yet to prove that the Cons used the debt to implement austerity because it isn't true

Point me in the direction of Brown having spending plans (austerity plans) on the scale of that carried out by the Tories please.

And then again when the Tories won a majority? They’ve made such severe cuts to public services that it’ll cost more to rectify them. How is that even sensible?

What I see is a trashed economy with a poor growth outlook.

Really?

Are we talking about listening to Multi Nationals with regards to brexit or part of a globalised economy where we are middling and still 6th largest economy.

Those same multi nationals that are scared of brexit are also scared of Corbyn so its for labour remainers to sqaure that peg, I'm a full blown neolib remainer, with the knowledge of basic economics displayed on this thread it isn't Tory supporters coming across uninformed.

Turning the tap “on” again will cost more in the long run because of the decade long under investment. And that’s before we even get to the people who’ve died because of austerity driven mean spirited benefit cuts.

Oh right, another one who has no basic grasp of economics and just political tub thumping. Stop reading the russian owned independent and have some understanding globalised politics. It will help in your future debates.

You are partly right. But the problem is that if the Tories dont offer some increased spending they will lose the election and Corbyn will bankrupt the country. Just yesterday on TV Labour were announcing that they would borrow £250 BILLION just to insulate every home in the UK for free and that is just one policy.

So whilst I would like economic stability the choice is a little borrowing by the Tories to avoid a shit load of Corbyn debt. That is the problem with elections, you cant do any long term planning.

Austerity is a purely ideological obsession and an excuse to shrink the state and punish the most vulnerable in our society. As a solution to debt it's an odd one as it creates a lot more debt among those with less money while others make money from the cycle of debt creation
^this

Name any economic institution that suggests austerity will work.

And again - Brown wasn’t going for austerity. He wanted to raise taxes and make some reductions in spending but his plan was to stimulate, not gouge.

I'm a full blown neolib remainer, with the knowledge of basic economics displayed on this thread it isn't Tory supporters coming across uninformed

You sound like someone who’s read a little bit of your favourite right wing rag.

Further more, while the deficit has reduced, why has debt ballooned so much and what, exactly, will be done to tackle that?

Imagine typing this when you first quoted me with this comment:

Don’t tell me, Justanotherlurker, you’re going to explain about the difference between the deficit and debt?

You need to step away and go do some background reading, you have no basic grasp of economics and little understaning of political history to try and tell other people to check their facts.

It would be funny if I didn't think you was trying to be serious.

Name any economic institution that suggests austerity will work.

The EU

I’ll admit, I’d never vote Tory but to test my understanding I decided to check if the Tories really had the better record when it came to the economy.

I’ve read both right and left wing books, I’ve read into the history of the financial crisis.

And I’m afraid, the Tory approach of austerity doesn’t come off well. Neither does the new labour approach of sucking up to big business/high earners 🤷🏻‍♀️

Neo liberalism is also a failed project. It’s nonsense.

The EU isn’t an economic institution.

Name any economic institution that suggests austerity will work.

IMF, ECB, Federal Reserve.

You really are out of your depth.

Ah bless you.

It's worth considering the issue of wealth hoarding. All those offshore bank accounts represent money drained from the economy - a far bigger drain on the economy than benefit payments.

And never mind all this waa, waa, companies will leave if corporate tax is raised - where will they go, when corporate tax is higher everywhere else?

The main reason so much money was illegally pumped into the Brexit campaign, let's not forget, was because a group of billionaires didn't want to be hit by the new EU tax avoidance laws.

Totally agree.

I’ve read both right and left wing books, I’ve read into the history of the financial crisis.

And I’m afraid, the Tory approach of austerity doesn’t come off well. Neither does the new labour approach of sucking up to big business/high earners

But I bet you think hard-left socialism works just fine, right?

But I bet you think hard-left socialism works just fine, right

Where did I say that?

I'm surprised no one has mentioned modern monetary theory yet.

(Throws it in, doesn't really get it - but has heard about it and has thought about where money comes from, what money really is, how it's generated, what taxes really do etc)

It's ridiculous that people are accused of being in favour of 'hard left socialism' or other such terms if they dare to criticise this government's policies. They're just lazy insults and an attempt at distraction.

I was about to say the same thing Sultan.

It's ridiculous that people are accused of being in favour of 'hard left socialism' or other such terms if they dare to criticise this government's policies. They're just lazy insults and an attempt at distraction

Agreed.

The Tories haven't reduced the debt at all. They just like to see people using food banks, it's fun for them and their pals to discuss it over brunch

Austerity is a ridiculous policy: it's utterly counterproductive. I don't know a single economics expert who thinks it is a good idea.