Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Child-safe in minutes.

Meet the Other Phone.
Child-safe in minutes.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To complain about school mixed toilets?

48 replies

flashbac · 02/11/2019 14:46

I'm in two minds about this...

Daughter is in year 7. Toilets are mixed. The area housing the cubicles opens out into the corridor. The cubicles have either green or blue coloured doors; blue for boys and green for girls but this isn't signposted. Children are told on their first day which colour is for which.
My daughter hardly uses the loo at school (thankfully) but she will accompany friends to the toilet area if they need to go. No one in her year group have started their periods yet. She says she is uncomfortable if year 11 boys are using the loos at the same time.

I'm not sure what to do really. The school is an academy in a semi deprived northern town in England. Senior staff are young suited and booted car salesmen type blokes. Sorry that sounds judge-y but need to set the scene.

OP posts:
Norma27 · 02/11/2019 14:59

People in her year group will have started their periods. Her close friends may not have tho. My daughter started hers the week she started secondary school and she is one if youngest in her year. Luckily her school has separate toilets for boys and girls.
I don’t understand these mixed toilets. Girls are making themselves poorly not wanting to go to toilets where there are boys too.

Trustmeimamidwife · 02/11/2019 15:01

When I was at school, I ended up with a shy bladder because I hated using the school loos when there was other girls in there. I can’t imagine how bad it would’ve been if boys had been allowed in there as well!

YourOpinionIsNoted · 02/11/2019 15:01

Complain complain complain. There has been a lot in the press recently about girls avoiding using the toilets and ending up with bladder infections, staying off school while on their periods.

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 02/11/2019 15:03

Complain. Also complain about the supposed ‘unisex’ colour coding. They ever go full woke or not at all.

It’s like getting the girls used to the idea early so that they accept mixed sex areas as the norm when they get older.

PotteringAlong · 02/11/2019 15:04

No one in her year group have started their periods yet

You know that’s not true, right?

LordProfFekkoThePenguinPhD · 02/11/2019 15:06

Y7 is what 12? I had started by then.

Hearhoovesthinkzebras · 02/11/2019 15:07

No one in her year group have started their periods yet.

How can no girl in the whole of year 7 have started their periods yet? Tbh, how would your dd even know this?

JoyceJeffries · 02/11/2019 15:08

Absolutely complain.

And some girls will have started their periods.

brighteyeowl17 · 02/11/2019 15:10

I think this is an awful idea. A school
I worked at had these and the kids felt so uncomfortable. Anyone standing outside could hear someone in the toilet and it lead of loads of kids not using the loo because of it. I think privacy is a good thing. It’s not about being ‘woke’. Hate that sodding phrase.

SarahTancredi · 02/11/2019 15:13

Complain!!

This is state sanctioned sexual harassment . Its not woke. It's not inclusive. Its abuse.

Children ( especially girls but this upsets many many.many boys too obviously) need privacy away from the opposite sex when they are in a.vulnerable state. Such as exposed or partially undressed in a toilet.

HandsOffMyRights · 02/11/2019 15:13

YANBU. Mixed sex toilets put girls' safety, dignity and privacy at risk. Single sex spaces were designed for a reason .

Ask if they carried out risk assessments?

If you don't get anywhere with the head, complain to the governors.

There are sadly many cases of this now in the news, but parents are fighting back now as this does not benefit girls at all.- and excludes them greatly.

gloriousglitter · 02/11/2019 15:16

The area housing the cubicles opens out into the corridor
Does that mean it's an open space? No door?

HandsOffMyRights · 02/11/2019 15:17

Submit a formal.complaint. The school will have a complaints procedure.
Ask to see the impact assessment
Ask how this benefits girls?
Canvas the opinion of parents and students
Contact your local media

RedskyToNight · 02/11/2019 15:18

DC's school have these same style of toilets. Most of the students like them better than the old ones as they have floor to ceiling walls/doors (the old ones didn't) and because they are open to the corridor there is no bullying in the toilets any more as it would be visible.

By convention girls tend to use the toilets at one end, and boys at the other (so a girl could choose to be in a toilet next to girls). however this seems to have naturally evolved and it's perfectly ok to use any toilet if "your end" isn't free. The blue/green thing just sounds bizarre (unless it's to do with sanitary bins - which was an issue at their school at first, as hardly any of the toilets had bins in)?

I also don't believe that no one in her year group has started their periods.

HandsOffMyRights · 02/11/2019 15:18

Ask if their insurer knows about the change

SarahTancredi · 02/11/2019 15:31

red

The gaps under the door are a safety feature though.

In fully enclosed cubicles someome could be collapsed/passed out or being assaulted and no one would see it. a child could be pushed in in a split second.

So although on one hand fully enclosed cubicles in a row seem reasonable they still also have their dangers and repercussions. Such as a girl having to clean pee off the seat before she can even use it if it open to everyone.

If it's one that's in a room but open plan so people can see in and there are toilets either side of the sinks/wash troughs which seems to be other design they go for well that is even worse..

RedskyToNight · 02/11/2019 15:55

The main reason my DD says they prefer the open plan toilets is that it stops "pervy boys" (her quote) coming into the girls toilets as there isn't anywhere to hide. Or standing outside the toilets and haranguing girls going in. This, I suspect, is a problem that is specific to toilets in schools that isn't such an issue in adult world. So in her view, this style of toilet is actually safer/better.

SarahTancredi · 02/11/2019 16:01

Kinda sounds like instead of ensuring the boys behaved appropriately and respected girls privacy, they took away the single sex loos altogether.

I dont understand why it becomes a toss up between enabling boys to carry on being pervy, or stopping boys going into the toilets but giving them the opportunity to.shove a girl into a cubicle, and putting diabetic or epileptic or asthmatic/allergic children at risk of not being seen should something happen.

All rather than deal with boys behaviour.

Original poster
flashbac · 02/11/2019 16:30

Ignore the bit about no one in year group starting periods yet, I meant friendship group! (Bloody cold given me brain fog!)

OP posts:
Original poster
flashbac · 02/11/2019 16:36

Ok, so I think I will do something (but after I have recovered from my brain fog!). Are there any specific laws or regulations I can quote so I don't come across as a bigot?

OP posts:
AutumnRose1 · 02/11/2019 16:40

OP so are the cubicles fully enclosed, ie floor to ceiling, and where are the sinks?

HandsOffMyRights · 02/11/2019 16:42

Start with this:

womansplaceuk.org/mixed-sex-toilets-ins-chools/

There is nothing bigoted about girls needing single sex provision for safety, privacy and dignity.

SarahTancredi · 02/11/2019 16:43

Are you able to do a quick diagram.

I believe if they are fully self contained floor to ceiling cubicles they are legit.

If they have shared hand washing basins then they are unlawful.

Is it an open open plan room with cubicles either side of sinks or self contained individual doors in a.row that open.straight out onto the corridor?

HandsOffMyRights · 02/11/2019 16:45

^What can you do?
If your child’s school has plans to move to mixed sex provision and you have concerns about this, you should raise it with the Head Teacher.

You could email or ask for a meeting.

Questions to ask:

What is the toilet provision in the school and is it in line with the School Premises Regulations (2012) as outlined in the Department of Education guidance ?
Has the school consulted with students, staff and parents about the proposed change?
Has the school carried out an impact assessment (especially in relation to the protected characteristic of sex) on the change as is required under the Equality Act?
Is there adequate provision for all children to meet all their needs?
You might also like to ask some general questions about toilet provision in the school especially in relation to the needs of girls and young women.

What rules are there about using the toilet during the day and are there any restrictions?
Does the school provide free sanitary products for girls who need them?
How does the school teach about menstruation and what is it doing to increase understanding and to reduce stigma?
If you are not happy with the answers you receive you should challenge the plans.

Talk to other parents and their children
Find some allies who will work with you
Contact the Chair of Governors and ask to meet with her/him
Contact the National Governance Association for advice
Contact the local authority or the Chief Executive if your child’s school is run by academy chain or is part of a Multi-Academy Trust
Contact the local press about your concerns
Contact your MP and ask them to take up your concerns with the school on your behalf
For further guidance and information on how to raise the issue with schools see the Transgender Trend guidance^

Koloh · 02/11/2019 16:48

Gosh, not to miss the main point but actually colour coding is a bit unfair on the boys, too. 1 in 12 boys are colourblind. (1 in 200 girls)