To ask would you ever be a prison officer? And how much?

[TheQueef]

Watched a few telly programmes about prison recently.
I can now confidently say I would never do that job. For £24,000 or even £124k.

Would you be,or indeed are you, a prison officer?

What do you think the salary should start at?

Both my parents work in prison, not as officers though (chaplain and teacher). The situation for teachers has got worse, expected to do twice as much with half the staff but at least it's not as stressful or dangerous as officers have it. Dad loves his job as chaplain though.

I could never do this job, I'm a sucker for a sob story and would be eaten up and spat out before a day was over. So thank God there are people who can do it. Completely under resourced and under valued like every other public service. Who would have imagined it would be the Tory party, always banging on about law and order, who would strip the guts out of the justice system? Everything de-funded, legal aid, police, probation, prisons, hospitals, care system, mental health etc. Like Mad Max if something doesn't change soon.

Spice appears to have changed things irrevocably.
Unpredictable, violent and high risk users.
Almost impossible to intercept.
Simple to smuggle in and use.
That and mobile phones have changed the path.
Now a drug dealer with a mobile makes quadruple what they did outside whilst being fed, sheltered and kept safe by a PO making the same wage as a Dorothy Perkins shop assistant.

Spice has certainly been a game changer. The public see it as a zombie drug but everyone seems to react differently. Yes there are "zombies" but many become extremely violent, abusive, some convulse and vomit, some strip naked and cry for their mum. It's astonishing to watch and a nightmare to deal with.

On top of that you have vulnerable prisoners, bullies, dealers, suicidal prisoners, very young or very elderly prisoners and have to deal with assaults, self harm, suicides, escape attempts, regular fires and smashing up of property and cells. Along with daily abuse and daily general running of the prison.

But all of those things (bar the spice) we were very capable of dealing with day in day out....until the prison service got rid of thousands of experienced and knowledgeable staff and replaced them with poorly trained, poorly paid and unfortunately many unsuitable staff for the job. Life skills, communication skills, common sense, calmness under pressure and the ability to challenge are no longer requirements for the job.

That's the main problem.

The prison service is a mess, and I honestly believe it's only a matter of time before an officer gets killed. The recent murder in the news about Richard Huckle demonstrates this is possible, but people are focusing on the fact they're 'glad he's dead' without looking at the bigger picture. I have colleagues left with career ending injuries caused by their time in the service, and when things go wrong, the support just isn't there (on a national/government level)

Absolutely true. The officers are massively understaffed and are expected to be guards, carers, counsellors, experts in dealing with mental health issues, drug abuse and armed conflict. They are the forgotten service - and we need them to keep the worst of society off our streets. Officers who are in high security prisons and youth offending institutions are on the front line, risking their lives daily.
The reality is nobody gives a shit - certainly not the government.

Reading those on another site praising an armed inmate for killing another inmate makes me sick. That blade was just as likely to have been stuck in an officer!

Destiny did you see the latest episode of the ITV series?
When they showed the new inmate, in his cell for bullying a new officer, showing off his shank to the camera?
Gave me a liquid bowel feeling just watching it nvm the targeted PO!

Agreed stone I could easily have been killed. A 30 something year old man (not in a yoi or high security) was jumping on my head. He had no clue what he was doing (spice), completely out of control. I fought for over 2 years for my retirement despite this all being caught on cctv. It was a random, spur of the moment assault, no background story. I actually got on well with him. He couldn't remember a thing but held his hands up in light of the CCTV and my injuries.

Oh, and guess what? No charges brought against him as it was "not in the public interest".

That should spell it out. Prison officers safety and right to life is "not in the public interest".

£21k for a starting salary . They deserve at least double that. And probably twice as many staff, at least.

For the record I couldn't bring myself to watch anything about prisons or go near one ever again after seeing my kids the next morning after leaving hospital. No way. Not for any money.

The modern day prison service is embarrassing and dangerous

I am so glad that the vast majority of posters on this thread appreciate the work they do, and have only nice things to say. As a daddy's girl, this actually means a lot!

Prison officers are definitely the 'forgotten service'. I agree with a PP who said it was because they're hidden in society... I guess you just don't see them behind the wall.

DP is an officer and has been for around 10yrs so it's normal life for us- doesn't stop the first question I ask being 'are you hurt?' if he's ever off late though (Which is every shift as there's always something happening.) I think as a partner of someone who works within prisons it's very hard to accurately imagine what it's like on the inside. On one hand it's hard to imagine it's ever anything but miserable, but on the other hand at times I think it's also worse than you could ever expect. It's tough. I'm constantly worried about him being at work, as much as he tries to reassure me that he's ok.

Absolutely love @SingingLily's person spec for a prison officer.

@Milkstick thank you for the recommendation Ear Hustle podcast I've started listening.
I wonder if a UK prison would be able to do similar, it's a different side they talk about.

My DH was a Prison Officer for 2 years, he left around 3 years ago.

In those 2 years he had boiling water thrown over him (kettled) was threatened with multiple homemade blades, saw 2 dead bodies through hangings (one of which he had to attend coroners court and give evidence). Once he was not allowed to leave the prison for 26 hours when it was in lockdown due to riots and prisoners getting on the roof.
He witnessed riots and prisoners took control of whole wings of the prison. There is a huge problem with Spice and he was sent off to hospitals handcuffed to a prisoner at least once a week.

All of this was in a sleepy category 2 prison in the South West, and he was only getting paid around £22k.
I was so glad that he left when I was pregnant, even though he took a pay cut and went back into retail, it was one of the best decisions we ever made as a family.

Definitely not. People don't realise how difficult and what a high risk job it is to be a prison officer. There are some easier jobs in places like, for example, Ford Prison which is an open prison and nobody in there is violent - frauds and such like. Belmarsh is known as the South London Hellhole by inmates and staff alike.

They do get paid extra for unsocial hours and good overtime rates, also if they specialise in a particular category of prisoner, but even so, I wouldn't do it. They are so often fighting a losing battle which is demoralising.

Most people don't realise that it isn't only the 'prisoners' who are locked in, the staff are too. Some of the staff aren't very good either and don't set a good example to newly trained officers. Hours of boredom where they have to be alert even if they feel like falling asleep on a chair must be awful.

Someone has to do it of course but I do not believe it's a job that anyone should be doing for more than so many years, it would 'get' to you after a while. Some of the things they have to witness or even just know about cause a lot of problems for prison officers, depression and panic attacks, obsessive intrusive thoughts, etc. I'm sure I'd end up in therapy for years.

The violence in high security YOI is even worse. They want to prove themselves by getting a hard man reputation before being moved on to places like Belmarsh, mentioned above. They know they are not getting out so work to be the cock of the wall before transfer.

@TheQueef Yeah I'd love a UK version. San Quentin, from what I can tell, is good in terms of the programmes it offers to prisoners to give them skills for release, among other things. Not all prisons are as focused on rehab. I just listened to the most recent episode today, it's a hefty one. They're on lockdown right now, or they were when that episode and the prev one were recorded.

On the outside looking in ie: watching prison programmes in horror and disgust it is shockingly obvious what is wrong with the prison system how "they" could and should improve it so why can't "they" see it? Even small little things would improve it. Like for example why the hell r they allowed to keep their cells in such a state with so many places to hide stuff. Don't they have cell inspections? I believe if they had to keep things in order like military style soldiers and had cell inspection daily as part of a routine and if they were as strict as the army are with it it would ease some of the issues in fact get the army to run all prisons make them exercise so they are too worn out to cause trouble and stop giving them bloody PlayStation's and telis in their rooms. I saw one female prisoner held someone hostage cos she was upset the prison said " understand you were upset so as shortstsffed not gona do anything and she didn't get any punishment/consequence whatsoever!! How is that acceptable??? Unbelievable

I've been a prison officer for 23 years, at HMP, not private sector.
I can honestly say that during those years, conditions have worsened.
For example, in the past it was rare for a male prisoner to attack a female staff member, repercussions from the other prisoners would be swift and not pretty. Now it's becoming an everyday occurance.
We are understaffed and undervalued and as usual, all the shit gets dropped on the officers.
Staff sickness is a huge problem which poses a problem all on its own as the consequences for both the officer and the prisoner can be serious.
I will continue with my service until I retire in 7 years time, hopefully without serious injury.

Saucy tomato does it ever occur to you that you are basically in prison too? Working in that environment you must be affected by it almost as much as the prisoners themselves I would imagine that whilst it must be really interesting never really boring and sometimes maybe rarely satisfying it must also be bloody depressing I hope you are allowed and do take regular breaks outside in the fresh air and are not "banged up" inside prison walls your whole shift. The wellbeing of staff should be a priority not the blimmin prisoners comfort

Yes, we get a 60 minute lunch break, and assuming that there isn't a standfast we might even get it on time too.
However, I rarely go outside at lunch, it's a ball ache going in and out of the gate lock. I usually just go to the mess and get my lunch.
If we're on the route outside, we get fresh air then too.
To be fair, at home time I usually take a big gulp if fresh air once I get out. 😄
Half of the problem is, as I'm sure others who work in the establishment is the prisoners with mental health issues. The ones who, when on the outside would have had professional intervention and medication.
Since the closure of many mental health facilities which were replaced by care in the community, that's when the real issues began.
We are not mental health professionals!
So imagine, here we have a person who due to mental health issues, committed a crime, it could be to find a habit, it could be due to schizophrenia or it could be due to learning disabilities etc.
They receive a prison sentence, but with little or no mental health interventions.
They serve their time and are released, but to what? They have no job, no home, no family, no friends, no money and no help.
They then commit a further crime. Now they're in a revolving door situation.
Come out, commit crime, come back in, don't deal with it very well, come out, commit crime ...on a merry go round.
That is the biggest issue we are facing. The shorts tend to be the most problematic and mostly, the most insubordinate and violent.
But hey, you know, why should the government care? They're off the streets, job jobbed 😠

Sorry, I meant to type, as I'm sure others who work in the establishment will agree.

Fund, not find! Jeebers I'm tired.

SaucyTomato, I took early retirement in 2010, the day before that year's super-duper restructuring. I could see how it was going to go then.

The new reduced staffing levels and the fact that so many staff with so much experience were leaving in one fell swoop - anyone could see it was a nightmare in the making and although I'd locked horns with the local POA more times than I'd had hot dinners, I spent my final hour on duty pleading with them to put aside all petty wrangling and personal issues and concentrate on what was truly important: staff safety, staff jobs, decent pay and pensions.

You do a valuable job. You protect the public. You are unseen and unsung heroes.

Here's hoping that you stay safe today, and every day for the next seven years. I send you my best wishes.

Absolutely not

I work in rehabilitation with ex offenders (with mh diagnosis) this can be challenging, draining and rewarding but we don’t have the threat of violence and it’s surprisingly laid back. It has been a long journey for them to get to this point, they have a team of professionals around them to help manage their mh and behaviour any signs of their mh deteriorating is dealt with immediately

We often get hostility that can feel threatening (it’s often meant to) or when someone is feeling paranoid but only once have I felt fear of being lashed out against and they were very swiftly recalled (they were relapsing)

I have been to a prison and the atmosphere is completely different, good dedicated prison officers work incredibly hard it’s a very challenging role it’s not a job I could do i have great admiration for them.

The money is great if you are 22 and just out of university. The prisons are awash with young girls who 'want to make a difference' when in fact they don't, they just make it harder. When you need help on the landing, you want a big bloke or two to sort it out, not three girls or lads who have just finished prison college. These prisoners don't want to be told what to do by youngsters. I'm female but older with life experiences so I know how to talk to them. A lot of the time it's appeasement these days, when they just do what they want.
I would not recommend the job now