To object to neighbour's planning application?

[itsarainyday]

We've recently out out that the new neighbours next door are planning a huge extension to the back of their house which means they extend out 4 metres beyond where the back of our houses currently end. Our current view from our kitchen is of blue sky and trees. This will now be replaced with a huge wall (side of their extension). Last year, the new neighbours on the other side built a similar extension which went out 3 metres and we had months and months of disruption, including damage to our property and hassle from their builders. This has already affected the amount of light we get and is also an eye sore for us as we stare out at their brick wall. I'm now depressed at the thought of being hemmed in on both sides and the ever reducing skyline and new view of bricks instead of trees. We don't want to extend not least because we don't have £80k to cover the cost of extending but also because we don't need the space.

I don't believe there is a right to light in the UK and there is already precedent on our street with house owners building these long 4 metre extensions. So I'm not sure on what basis we could object and I'm also conscious of good neighbourly relations. We can't afford to move either as the stamp duty cost is so high. AIBU to raise any objections? I don't think the neighbours will care. They naturally want to build the biggest extension they can. I don't know what my options are. AIBU to express any concerns? They can't proceed until I sign the third party wall agreement.

(On top of this, I have concerns about the months long disruption, the noise as I work from home a lot, the possible damage and impact to our property, them wanting to pull our fence down which we only put up last year. Last year's experience when the other neighbours built their extension was not great - we had damage to our property as well as an inconsiderate builder - which is why I'm dreading this one as I fear we may have a repeat.)

I think as you didn't object to the precedent of your other neighbours building out so far, your objection to these neighbour's plans might not have too much weight. But worth putting it in anyway.

Unfortunately any objections you raise need to be based on planning points, rather than emotional or personal preferences, otherwise you are unlikely to succeed. If you are friendly with the neighbours then I would think your best option is to tell them what you feel and try to appeal to them directly to amend the design, but of course they may choose not to.

If it does get built, can you not put up a hedge to block the view of the extension ?

An out there solution but have you considered doing the same? Might get cheaper rates if the builder is doing them together (assuming you’re a semi) and bringing you forward will put the property lines back level.

As I say an out there idea but if this is a forever home worth considering?

And reread the op. Sorry,

Treat it as a secluded courtyard maybe?

You do have right to light, but not to a view.

Hi there, in terms of ensuring any damage to your property is made good, make sure you get a party wall agreement in place. This will need to be paid for by the people extending and you can choose who you use.
In terms of objecting, you can take advise from a surveyor as to which grounds you should use - they will be well versed in what will and wont fly but you need to balance this out with the upset it may cause with the neighbours.

4 meters is within permitted development so your objections wouldn't even be considered as it's permitted without question. Also consider that they can actually apply for 6m so they aren't going as far as they could. The extension will go ahead you can't stop it. You can hold up the party wall agreement but to be honest this would just cause a massive argument before the works even started. If I was you I'd pop round and say how nice it will be for them to have the extra space but you've had a really bad experience with the other extension and that x, y and z happened and you are very worried about your fence, damage to property and disruption and could you put some things in place before it started such as the safe removal and storage of your fence, no one coming onto your property etc

Yeah you have no right to a view. In my old house we used to have a lovely sea view before the neighbours horrible botched done-on-the-cheap extension. Add to that the damage to our property and neighbour relations deteriorated rapidly and never recovered. Not much help to you OP but you have my sympathy

You don’t have to let them remove your fence, they will just have to keep their building works on their side of the boundary.

They don't need planning permission, so there's nothing you can object to, unfortunately.

I have a feeling that some emphasis is put on your right to light, at least more so than on your view. It’s fine to make a reasonable objection, as they may be able to review the design at this stage. And you can certainly state now that you’d like considerations to be made by builders ie, certain hours of operation, taking responsibility for cleaning.
Obviously you do risk upsetting your neighbours, but I think it’s best to make your case early.

There isn't actually an awful lot you can do at this point, objections to planning permission need to be factual arguments relating to planning issues not subjective things such as a loss of a view.

You can certainly write an objection based on loss of light, but be warned, you would be surprised just how much light you are allowed to 'lose'. I have worked on projects before where adjacent properties lost 95 to 98% of their light to certain rooms, but because that remaining 2 to 5% was deemed above acceptable levels it still passed quite easily.

I disagree with previous posters that this is counted as permitted development that does not even require full planning permission, we can't possibly ascertain this without further information. For instance, we don't know if you live in a 'designated area' that restricts permitted development, or if it is a single or double storey extension.

Two separate routes to protect yourself (both limited though)

1. Planning permission. Unlikely you can object if there is precedent on the street. However, look at differences with the precedents: are they going slightly further out? Higher? (height makes a huge difference) Is their garden smaller than others so you could say they are not leaving a proportionate garden?

2. Party wall agreement. Find yourself a very good party wall surveyor (by word of mouth ideally, not an ambulance chaser who sends you a letter). You can ask for reasonable restrictions on working times ie not outside 8 to 5, no weekend work, advance warning of anything particularly noisy/messy. You don’t have to let them take down your fence (although if you don’t, they will build just inside the boundary rather than on the boundary, which will be annoying if you or any future purchaser from you want to extend). You can definitely get them to pay for repairs including replacing fence/plants, make sure your surveyor takes lots of “before” photos for comparison later. All of this is very reasonable.

Ultimately you won’t be able to stop it but you may be able to get them to reduce its size (if they have gone larger/higher than others) and hopefully make it slightly less painful to live through.

The best place to start is always a chat with the neighbours ... Also worth mentioning to them that your other neighbours had inconsiderate builders and it was awful, this may influence who this lot of neighbours choose to do their work.

With regards to loss of light - The extension has to pass two 45 degree angle test as to whether it will impact your light. They may still grant it if you are only affected by one, but not the other.

I would suggest calling your local planning department and asking them. They may come round to your property to understand the situation better.

I doubt if objecting would get you anywhere tbh, OP. The precedent has already been set.

Definitely a good idea to speak to your neighbours about your concerns re the builders though. I came home one day to discover that next door's scaffolding had been erected partially in our drive, so I couldn't get the car in, and around one of DP's motorbikes, making it impossible to get it out! Neighbour went mad at the builders, the scaffolding firm had to come back, and put up had a much more complex, but less intrusive, scaffolding arrangement

Then, when they took it down, they dropped a big scaffolding clamp through our garage roof, where it hit another motorbike, ripping the bike cover. The builders fixed the garage roof and the neighbour bought DP a new cover, but we were pretty hacked off.

Thanks everyone. I'm even less optimistic about the build now!!!!!! But thank you for the many sensible suggestions and practical advice above. I've made a note. I'm avoiding them right now as I have a lot going on and want to give myself time to process this before I speak to them (and not get upset).

A huge concern is the fence as it seems that the fence posts are slap bang in the middle of the boundary line running lengthways. So I'm not sure if they could argue that the fence needs to be removed and the posts replaced entirely on our side of the boundary line.

Must take a deep breath. Thanks everyone for your support. I like the glass half full view offered above about viewing this as a private courtyard!!!!!

Sorry one more question: if they agree not to move our fence, I would want it in writing. Would the best way to do this be to appoint a third party surveyor so they can put it into the agreement? The neighbours would need to pay for this so I can't imagine they'd be happy. However, I'm concerned that they would agree but then renege later. Tricky thing is that the fence posts (not the slats) sit on the boundary line so I'm worried that, technically, they say the entire fence needs moving an inch over outside. Which it can't as there no room for it to go. For context, old owners of the house bought it to lease long term and refused always to carry out any repairs to the fence or help maintain. So it's been down on us to do this and we replaced the fencing on that entire side of the garden only last summer.

I wonder if you could get a quote for a mural artist to make a beautiful tromp l'oeil view of countryside on the new wall once it is built? And might you be able to persuade your neighbour to contribute to the cost of such a thing as a mitigation for the disadvantage that their plans will inflict on you?

Check if there is a likelihood of flooding. When I checked on our Council website there was something on there about it, neighbour at the back was going to build a new extension.

Go through the list of reasons you can object with and see if any of them apply, ours had a list to refer to. Surprising how many did actually apply.

I wonder if you could get a quote for a mural artist to make a beautiful tromp l'oeil view of countryside on the new wall once it is built?

The wall even though it's facing OP's garden is the property of the neighbour and OP would have to seek permission to paint it, hang something on it etc.

Personally I'd go with a rustic, Italian style patio and lots of potted plants around there, cypress in pots etc.

Precedent does not really exist in planning - each application is treated on its merits, assessed against hte policies in force at the time. every site and every proposal is different.

THe fact that there is an extension on one side of the OPs property is not really relevant. It is likely that the OPs house is different on each side - eg houses often have side windows on one side only; rear elevations are often not flat so there may be a projection on one side and not the other so an extension on the other side of the property will have a difrerent impact.

OP - it will depend on whether PP is required or not - if an application is made you have hte right to make any comments. For hte Council to take them into account, they would need to be relevant planning issues.

• loss of light particularly to principal windows of main living rooms
• loss of outlook (different to a view). your outlook should not be dominated by new structures, nor should you end up with an unacceptable feeling of enclosure
• unacceptable overshadowing (this will be particularly relevant if the new addition will block the majority of your sunlight) ie be to the south of your property

The fence is tricky - if it's your fence, it should have been constructed within your property, not with the posts straddling hte boundary line. If that is the case, I think the NDN could reasonably ask for it to be removed.

Appoint your own surveyor through the Party Wall process. THey should record the existing state of your property, and then assist if any damage/harm results from the extension.

Thanks.

AdobeWanKenobi, I'm thinking that will be our only choice or grow lots of climbing plants on a trellis and attach this to the fence. We will have 4 metres of a huge white plastered wall to the left of our patio. Our view from the kitchen window will be completely obscured now by this wall. Lovely.

Seeline. I'm not sure if we've missed the deadline to object but we'll give it a go. We just discovered yesterday that they are also planning on building a 4 metre long annex at the bottom of the garden the height of which will also dominate over the end of our garden. They haven't mentioned this but we found the plans on the council website. Means more trees chopped down to accommodate, meaning yet more views of another large structure.
Your suggestions are very helpful. The main one will be this: loss of outlook (different to a view). your outlook should not be dominated by new structures, nor should you end up with an unacceptable feeling of enclosure.

The fence was a tricky one. Both sides benefited from the fence and we were doing a favour in replacing it when the old one came down in a storm (but old owner didn't want to pay for it to be fixed as they let to tenants). In hindsight, we should have made sure the posts were moved slightly to our side given that we were paying.

You can object up until the decision is made. The date just guarantees that the application won't be determined before that time.

We've submitted our objections and concerns but we're not optimistic. Have also spoken to the neighbours and they have already said they are planning to rip down our fence (thereby killing our mature plants in the process) and that they want access to our property for the build. I'm so upset by this that I couldn't even sleep last night :((

We've submitted our objections and concerns but we're not optimistic. Have also spoken to the neighbours and they have already said they are planning to rip down our fence (thereby killing our mature plants in the process) and that they want access to our property for the build. I'm so upset by this that I couldn't even sleep last night sad(

They can want all they like but you do not have to agree. They would have to go to court to force you to give permission to access your land, and they would have to make good any damages, including your plants. Gaining planning permission does not give them these rights, so don't let them fob you off. They are CF's on that score!