High earner leaving UK because of tax

[DonningDaFlameProof]

Hi all,

I'm well aware that I'm highly likely to be utterly slaughtered for this (thus the name change) but having read the thread about Corbyn and seeing several people saying that the theory that taxing high earners would make them leave the economy is a myth, I thought I'd share.

I'm British and was bought up on the breadline, went to state school, have a disability - just to pre-empt the "privileged" comments.

I started a business not that long ago (fortunately selling a service globally, and not registered in the UK as its main market is the Middle East) in the first few months it became obvious it was going to do well and I hired an accountant.

To cut a long story short, if I remained UK resident then my tax bill for my first year would have been approximately £120,000. This would have been just under half of the money I bought in.
Year 2 - tax bill would have been £230,000.

My family are not well off, so I was supporting a fair few people on this plus I started with nothing, so my first priority (after my family) was to save for a house as I was living in rented accomodation.

I am well aware that I am earning a high salary, and would never argue otherwise. But reading on here, people seem to think that a 6 figure salary means that you buy yachts for a laugh and eat diamonds for breakfast.

Good size family houses in my area started at about £500k.

For us, it made sense to move abroad for 5 years or so, save the money otherwise spent on tax, come back with that lump sum and buy a property outright.

And that's what we've done, it was insanely easy.

Now, the current plan is to come back to the UK in a few years time and settle down. We'll have a nice house then, and the tax bill we'll just suck up because we like the UK.

I keep seeing people harp on about raising taxes for the wealthy...if this happens, I know that we won't end up moving back. Because paying out half of my earnings is galling enough.

The top 10% of earners pay 60% of the tax bill.
The top 1% of earners pay 28%.

These people will also be privately funding their own medical care and schooling for their children. They'll also be heavily contributing in other taxes and of course pay VAT on the things they buy.

Raising taxes, abolishing private schools, penalising the wealthy in other ways is just going to drive them out of the country - leaving the tax pot far emptier, but the majority of people still relying on it.

AIBU to think that penalising the wealthy is not the solution?

I think you’d be better off getting your facts straight first before making decisions based on false premises. Get a good accountant.

Just fuck off you loud mouthed lefties

When you have a heart attack in the street, caused by your frothing, let’s hope there’s enough nhs left to sort you out eh.

At the end of the day, one man’s riches is at the expense of another man’s - it might not be that obvious but that’s how the economy works.

Make it inequitable, but don’t complain when it all falls apart.

I'm intrigued how you managed started a business from zilch and in a very short time generated a hefty 6 figure turnover while running the entire venture singlehanded.

Not that difficult. I have several clients who've started with nothing, but chosen niche businesses where there was little competition and high demand and reached 6 figure turnover within a few years without high upfront investment. In this internet age with low barriers to entry, it's more achievable then ever.

But the whole purpose of this post was not to analyse my personal situation - I was using it as an example of how penalising high earners ends up reducing the amount coming in

But it is about you. Had your post been about high earners in general you could have posted some research that could ( ut probably wouldn't) have illustrated your point. But you didn't, so now you're pissing and moaning because you've more or less had your arse handed to you on a plate.

*To be really honest, OP, if people like you leave the country, it is no great loss.

when these people employ tens or hundreds of employees, you change your tune.*

Yeah, but OP has already clarified that she doesn't employ anyone.

Frankly it isn't much of a shocker. She has already moved out of the country to avoid fairly moderate taxes, so the fact that if they go up she might not come back? Meh.

My children attend 2 famous public schools and we have private medical insurance, saving places in the state systems for others

Bless.

i have sympathy op.
a lot of my wealthy friends think income tax should be much higher.
these same friends have benefitted hugely from:
a massive inheritances
b property prices/ie bought it for £40grand its now worth a million.
c cash in hand work/fiddling books

why wouldnt you be happy to pay more when youre already set up for life?

it sucks when the only way you have of getting on is the hours you put in - and thats the one thats easiest to take away from.
(i find many privileged mc people really don't get this)

Iggly - Read my post again. I'm not one of the wealthy brigade. I think it's you frothing at the mouth.

Yes. I do hope the NHS will save my life. After all I deserve their help as much as you. Grow up

Sod off then.
You pay more tax because you earn more.
I you have benefited from our education system, our social housing and our employment, if you have built a flourishing business that keeps a roof over your head an provides for your family, thank your lucky stars aoaypay your bloody taxes.
Because there are LOTS of people who work extremely hard without the rewards that high earners enjoy. They have no choice but to pay their taxes.
You only pay shit loads of tax when you earn even bigger shitloads of money..
Its really crass to earn loads if money then say that you should pay less taxes because you are sending your kid to private school so that they dont hav I kid with the oiks that work fir minimum wage and oay every penny if tax that's due.
If you want private education and private healthcare, fine. But you pay your dues first.

My children attend 2 famous public schools and we have private medical insurance, saving places in the state systems for others.

*depriving the state system of yet another family who value education and could genuinely contribute for the benefit of all by helping to improve the culture of their chosen state school and by making education policy a priority in their personal voting choices.

Fixed that for you

But the whole purpose of this post was not to analyse my personal situation - I was using it as an example of how penalising high earners ends up reducing the amount coming in

You made it about your personal situation. You could quite easily have started a discussion without divulging your income. And btw corporation tax is going down to 18% from April 2020.

So, OP, you have moved to a country where presumably taxes do not cover any meaningful level of health or education, and, let me guess, much of the infrastructural work is fine by badly paid migrants who have no rights?

This all props up countries where it is ‘insanely easy ‘ to move to and make money.

And you will Sean back when it suits you and benefit from the labour of people kept healthy and educated on the state, and knowing that should your business crash, your kids can still get an education and an expensive stay in hospital.

Up to you what you do, where it is legal, but I have no respect for your values, or you.

"People who think Corbyn is right need to read about what happened under Labour in the 1970s"

People who harp on about Labour in the 1970s need to read up on what happened under the Conservatives in the 1970s.

"I'm intrigued how you managed started a business from zilch and in a very short time generated a hefty 6 figure turnover while running the entire venture singlehanded. I'd love to know what you sell."

My money's on Younique: fake it 'til you make it

If it goes to the government it’s tax.

You pay it, they spend it.

Tax includes personal tax, vat, stamp duty, death duty, national insurance, council tax, dividend tax, car tax, insurance tax .......

What’s that ? 65% to 100%.

Tax was introduced as a temporary measure.

Note. Does not apply to elites.

People brought up in poverty but then go on to make a good life for themselves should remember that life can (and does) change on a dime. They're best placed to know how awful living in poverty is and what a difference having money makes.

I was once a higher rate taxpayer with my own business but now live on benefits (with a stint as an employee paying standard rate in between). All down to a change in health and personal circumstances that I never saw coming.

My ex continues to sit pretty reaping the rewards of my hard work after taking advantage of my illness and inability to protect myself. He does all he can to avoid paying his share, too.

I was proud to be the highest payer in the area and looked after my employees. When he took over he employed part-time and minimum wage. Anything to avoid his share on NI contributions! He's not a very nice person.

It's good to give back - maybe you should consider this. Despite what would be a high tax bill you would still live a comfortable life. I don't think that you should say you never use the NHS either. Have you considered where you would go for treatment if you needed a transplant or other serious and life-saving treatment rarely offered privately?

As someone else has pointed out most professionals offering private services came up through the NHS or state schools. Tax paid for their training.

I'm not envious of you, OP. You've done well for yourself it's good to see ordinary people become successful. You do sound awfully smug, though.

Is it a country that discriminates on ethnic or religious grounds?

What's that to do with the discussion, I would say the US is still discriminative, the north Africans didn't used to be loved in France, but maybe that's changed now. Turks were discriminated against in Germany in the past.

So many goody two shoes on MN we don't get a debate just a whinge or boast!
I would guess the OP is in the Middle East - state of the art health care, excellent free education for locals. Someone mentioned oil, oooo goodness how dare a country make tax income from oil

My mother didn't receive child benefit.
My disability is a moderate mental health once, the provision for which on the NHS is extremely low.

Now you’re in a position to contribute something back to that system, you don’t want to so you scarpered.

That’s like someone who accepts a drink but is nowhere to be seen when it comes to their round. No-one likes that person.

In this example, i've actually paid back my round of drinks several times with income tax over my 12 years of UK employment. And by remaining in the UK i'd be paying for the drinks for everyone else in the pub, hundreds of times over.

But AGAIN, this isn't specifically about me - my point is that people leave when they are disproportionately taxed because they've done well for themselves.

Bluebillie - haha

So many goody two shoes on MN we don't get a debate just a whinge or boast!

Well it's the OP who won't say what they do or where they live.

I would guess the OP is in the Middle East - state of the art health care, excellent free education for locals. Someone mentioned oil, oooo goodness how dare a country make tax income from oil

You do know the Middle East is big. With different countries. Sort of thing.

And the bottom 10% pay about half of their income in tax.

This.

Why would your mother not get child benefit?

@Helmetbymidnight

I am lucky and privileged to earn plenty of money.

We have high wages, a nice house etc etc.

I would never vote conservative because I know that I got here because of the support provided by the state.

The conservatives shit on children like me (I didn’t choose what family I was born in) and on mothers like mine (she didn’t choose her mental illness).

It’s easy to preach when life is so fucking easy.

But AGAIN, this isn't specifically about me - my point is that people leave when they are disproportionately taxed because they've done well for themselves

Then why don’t the likes of Crispen Odey and Jacob Rees Mogg fuck the fuck off then if the tax system is so so punitive

But AGAIN, this isn't specifically about me - my point is that people leave when they are disproportionately taxed because they've done well for themselves

So what's a proportionate tax for such people? How does it differ from, say, PAYE workers who've risen from challenging circumstances such as you claim? Haven't they done well for themselves?