To think school spelling lists are unrealistic?

[ACupOfTeaSolvesEverything]

DS has just started Year 4 and as he has a summer birthday he is only just 8 years old.
The spellings he comes home with seem very difficult for his age. Pic attached. AIBU?

He struggles with written expression anyway and usually gets zero on all spelling tests despite reading well ahead of his chronological age. We are still trying to learn Year 2 spellings.
I know his spelling ability is unusually poor but that aside I think these words are hard for an only just 8 year old to be expected to spell...

[LolaSmiles]

Like others, I think that's a reasonable list.

If a child has additional needs then that needs to be factored in, additional support etc.

What I still don't understand is how primary students manage to spell all these words correctly and yet by y8 I pick up a class who think alot is one word.

[Ellisandra]

@CallmeAngelina it’s normal at mine’s school to mix them up.

But they get 3 columns to differentiate, and choose the column themselves - and can even mix and match.

[Br1ll1ant]

My eldest reads non-stop and can’t spell for toffee, despite practice and trying. My youngest (yr 4 summer birthday) hates to read but could spell his last week (v similar to your list) without trying 🤷‍♀️
My eldest’s teacher is pragmatic and he’s managing at secondary - his words are comprehensible but not right. So much is predictive or spell-checked as they get older. It is what it is. Your son has the right attitude to it at least.

[PumpkinPie2016]

The words themselves look ok and if that is the curriculum list then the school will need to follow that.

However, the issue here is that your son is clearly struggling with spelling and is getting zero on spelling tests which must be really disheartening, especially if he has made the effort to try to learn them

If he reads well then there is clearly an issue with the spelling that isn't his fault.

Have you spoken to the SENCo? That would be my initial advice with a view to perhaps a dyslexia screening? Or dyspraxia - is it that he cannot order the words?

I teach secondary science but taught a child in Y8 who was a bright child - excelled in maths/science, could read well and could write fairly good sentences. His spelling, however, was really poor - even for common words such as 'which'. Words that given his overall ability you would expect him to be able to spell. He was eventually diagnosed as dyslexic.

Please make an appointment with the SENCo asap. It's no good then trying to get your son to learn harder words if he is struggling with the fundamentals of spelling.

[hushnowthanks]

OP I had this same issue with my dc - reading age way above actual age but could not grasp even basic spelling patterns and struggled in every spelling test. This came to a head in year 4/5 when there was massive pressure on SPaG in preparation for SATS.

However, dc is now early teens and although by no means a bully whizz speller, is top set English and doing really well across all subjects at high school.

The best way to remedy poor spelling is with wide and varied reading - your dc is already excelling in that department. He’ll have other strengths and will excel anyway with the support of a mum like you!

[FairyBatman]

This is going to sound a bit odd, but have you had his eyes tested. Children with visual problems can quite often read well as they read the outline of the word and infer from context, but can struggle with spelling as it means they need to see the detail.

Might be nothing, may be worth a quick trip to Specsavers.

[hushnowthanks]

*billy whizz

DAMMIT!

[SmileEachDay]

If he’s got good reading comprehension he may find it easier learning spellings if you help him learn some “rules” - lots of the words on that list have a prefix, for example. So the prefix “dis” is an indicator of opposite/negative however you want to explain.

It’s a strategy that can massively help struggling spellers to have something else to “hang” the spelling of words on.

[CecilyP]

I’ve asked for them to differentiate spellings but they say they don’t do that and to just help him at home. Like I don’t already do that hmm

They’re supposed to be the teachers but it sounds like they don’t have a clue how to help him, so are delegating to you. Next time ask them how you should do that. I bet they don’t come up with anything you haven’t already done.

[littledrummergirl]

When my dc was in year 6 we were discussing spellings with his teacher. She said they all have the same list to learn but the expectations were different for each child. If Ds1 had got 15/20 it would have been below his expected level, if Ds2 had got 15/20 she would have danced a jig in the staff room. Unfortunately the national curriculum doesn't allow for going off piste for those less academic, it seems designed to lower their self esteem and remove any creativity and individuality.

[OoohRhubarbLetsGo]

The school doesn’t have a choice about the spelling rules and statutory words - they are from the National Curriculum for that age group. It sounds as though your child might need specific revision from the school to support him with spelling.

[CecilyP]

Agree with smile; anything that makes spelling seem less random can be helpful. But school should really be doing this, not giving a total mix and match list.

[SudowoodoVoodoo]

DS is y4 and his class' lists tend to be grouped with a theme that helps with a sense of pattern.

He has dyslexia & dyspraxia and still struggles with his name. I read the list to him and get him to highlight a sample that he wants to focus on rather than overwhelming him with the full list. The odds are that his sucesses will not be consistent anyway, so we make a token effort and keep it low-key.

More importantly for him, he has targeted interventions to support his literacy/ spelling. Spelling tests are just one of those hoops to have a go at jumping through.

One of the things that stuck with me during a SEN session at INSET a few years back was that it's not necessarily what children are good/ weak at as absolute values that is telling, but the discrepancies between them. So a child who is excelling at reading but floundering at writing with several "years" gap of ability does make me think investigating a difficulty such as dyslexia/ dyspraxia is worthwhile. Do you have any concerns about motor skills/ organisation? We had to wait until 8 before testing even though it was obvious from the start of school. In our case, it was a clear difference between very articulate verbal strengths (after catching up from SALT when pre-school) and slow reading and minimal writing development. It does take a lot of nudging to get the ball rolling as budgets are so tight.

[Crosscrosscrackers]

My 8 year old would struggle with this. I have battled school no end of times about spellings and this year she is getting different lists. What is his general writing like? If he is getting 0 each week when you are practising then they are obviously too hard and they should be being differentiated.

You could either ask he gets a different list, or that they only test him on some of the words.

To be honest I got to the point where we didn't even bother with spellings. We were spending evenings in tears attempting words that were too hard for her to get 0 correct anyway. But this year now the spellings are appropriate it is better.

As an aside we've get some success with "chunking" to learn spellings. So you break the word down into chucks and learn them that way. So inactive becomes three chucks "in" "act" "ive". This seems to work loads better.

[CecilyP]

The best way to remedy poor spelling is with wide and varied reading

[CecilyP]

Whoops posted to soon. I’m afraid I have to disagree with the above. There are plenty of veritable bookworms who are really poor spellers.

[RainOrSun]

If I gave those spellings to my kids cold, I'd expect my 8 yr old to get about 10. But my 10 yr old to get about 5 right.

Why do people focus on learning a rule?? If I give my oldest a list with words ending le, he dumps le on the end of each. Following week, give them el.
Week after he doesnt have a clue if its le or el, because he just dumped the letters on the end. Mix them up, or he learns what to do that week, not the words, imo. I'm obviously unusual in this respect tho, as teach a rule and test it seems the way most do it!

OP: check his vision, phonics awareness, and possible dyslexia or dysgraphia.

[Crosscrosscrackers]

SudowoodoVoodoo- interesting my daughter is being investigated for dsylexia due to difficulties with writing and spelling. She shows a huge discrepancy between what she can understand and articulate verbally to what she can write. Her reading is ok-ish. Behind but not terribly so. I think alot of people equate dyslexia to just difficulties reading

[x2boys]

This is mumsnet so there will be loads of posters telling you their three olds can spell these words etc ,however when ds1_was in primary school the less able ( of which he was one ) children were given different spellings .

[Breathlessness]

‘If he’s got good reading comprehension he may find it easier learning spellings if you help him learn some “rules” - lots of the words on that list have a prefix, for example. So the prefix “dis” is an indicator of opposite/negative however you want to explain.’

This ^

If you rearrange the list

Un +

Fair = unfair
Kind = unkind

Mis +

Behave = misbehave
Spell = misspell
Place = misplace

[Thingsdogetbetter]

Spelling without context is difficult and I don't think helps memory at all! Just spelling out doesn't trigger memory for most people so you need to get inventive. Start with smaller, easier words and work your way up as he recognises patterns and sounds.

Get him to put the words you are focusing on into different sentences and write and rewrite. Make flashcards and put them around the house - by the toilet is good cos they're seen freqently and what else you gonna do there lol.

I can't learn a new word without moving and saying out loud. Seemingly saying aloud doubles retention. You could try apps like quizlet.com where he can make his own word and definition/sentences lists and then practice. It does flashcards and spelling parts. There are computer games that help with blended sounds. So if you're saying the words to him he'll recognise the patterns.

Maybe pick a spelling rule once at a week (taking one word off the list) and concentrate on that. Not great for next test, but great long term as you can link to new word lists and it'll help his confidence. Start with smaller words, and when he's getting them right, move to the bigger ones. (I think the school should have recognised the issue before he got to this complex word level and given help earlier - It's like teaching a child to swim by throwing them in the deep end and wondering why they keep sinking.)

Spelling is both a talent and a skill. He may never be great at it, but he can improve.

[BeyondMyWits]

How does he do if you revisit last year's spellings? Our school publishes the list for the year, so you can revisit.

What are you and your school's method of teaching spelling? Do you use different strategies?

We did
look (at the word, see if there is anything odd you notice about the word/spelling),
say (the word out loud - how do you THINK it should sound - does it sound how it looks?),
copy (write the word out on a page 10 times using the reference list),
use (think of 2 sentences that use the word in a different way),
spell (write the word without the reference list)....

and NEVER do the list in order, always randomise.

[Muddlingalongalone]

They look fairly normal standard to me, I think dd1 might have had some of those in yr3 tbh.
I do think the school should be differentiating though certainly this was my experience last yr, not sure about this year yet.
Apologies if these exact terms are not correct but this is a concept i came across recently on a work course and has been amazing for me personally.
Can you determine if he a visual learner/auditory learner or tangible learner then find a method that best suits his learning style. E.g. writing them out vs saying them out loud over and over. I am a visual learner followed by tangible, so I would gave to look at them over and over, writing them would help muscle memory but i don't take in audio books at all so constantly saying them over and over wouldn't help me much, whereas dd1. Out loud/repition/rhymes/funny pronunciation to break the words up all help her remember.
Keep trying different things until you find something that works for him.

[CecilyP]

Yes, a lot of the words have prefixes. Can he spell the original word without the prefix? Is so, then it’s quite simple. If not, the he needs to be secure with those words first.

[FurrySlipperBoots]

I don't think that's an unreasonable list at all, but I do think it's unreasonable (cruel actually) that your son is made to do tests week after week that it's known he'll fail. What's that doing to his self esteem?! Bloody horrible.

In your place, if they flatly refuse to set him spellings suitable to his ability, I would pick one of the words and ignore the rest of the list. Help him focus on learning that word, with a mnemonic preferably,. Then at least he'll get that one right and he'll get a sense of achievement.