To pull DD out of 11+ (Kent Test).

[Torple]

We live in Kent (clearly, as the thread title suggests) and my DD is about to go into Yr 6.
All through primary school she’s done well, always achieving good marks, even getting a couple of prizes for projects etc.
Now, we are facing the Kent Test, and suddenly she’s dropped off so much, she is very, very unlikely to pass.
She has done a week’s summer camp with a couple of tutors and other kids, 2 hours a day, and where she needs 80-85% to pass, she’s getting marks of between 35 and 70% depending on the paper.
We haven’t made a massive deal of it because she can only do her best but the problem is two parts.
One - her school and teachers have said repeatedly throughout Yr 5 that she is definitely a prime grammar candidate and she would stand a very good chance of passing so now she suddenly thinks she’s useless, and two - she has ASD, cannot cope with large crowds and open plan buildings, she has panics and meltdowns in airports, shopping malls, museums etc but every single high school within a six mile radius is designed this way.
She went to one with Brownies for an event and we had to come and pick her up after half an hour because of the noise.
Our nearest, the only one in our town is enormous, I think about 1800 kids.
Her primary school is one form entry.
There’s one “older style” one 8 miles away but it’s a faith school so she would need a miracle to get in.
If she’s passes the test, there are three grammar schools within a reasonable distance which are smaller and she would feel less stressed at.

But her marks over the last few weeks have seriously got me concerned that we are setting her up to fail.

The test is in two weeks. I’m not sure whether to keep pushing her to do more practice just for those two weeks, knowing she will never have to do it again, and hope something clicks and the potential her teachers see suddenly shines through, or to say, sod it, it’s not worth the anxiety, the tears, the sleepless nights.

I have toyed with applying for an EHCP to see if it can help secure her a place based on the layout and not the distance, she hasn’t had one up till now because her school have just adapted to help her thrive without one. But it’s now up to a 2 year process because of a backlog.
And we didn’t push during Yr 5 because we didn’t think we would need to consider the huge local schools.
For anyone who doesn’t have to decide whether to put your child through this torture or not, I envy you,

It’s a shit thing to do. It’s no longer compulsory but obviously, you give your kid the best chance and her teachers think she’s would be better at grammar school, you have to give it a shot.

Any advice please?

Best thing you can do at this point is take the pressure off. All this extra classes and practice papers and stuff is telling her how much of a big deal this is - she's probably super stressed. Have a chat with her, find out if she wants to do the test or not. If not, pull her out. If she does, let her take it but make sure she knows it's not a big deal if she doesn't pass.

Not in your area, but we were having similar thoughts last year when DS did badly in his 2 mocks over the summer. We said to DS he didn't need to go through with 11+ but he wanted to do it. In the end, he did really well and got into his first choice school. If the teachers think she is capable then go for it, you have nothing no lose.

I would go for middle ground and ease off on the prep. Just do some reading together, do some puzzles and let her take the exam.

@RealMermaid she wants to do it, but I think mostly because her best friends are all doing it and likely to pass (all top sets etc) so the idea of not doing it and going to a different school to them is stressing her out as well.
It’s SUCH a crap thing to put a 10-year-old through. This end of the holidays should be about chilling out, not panicking about her future.

We had this last year. She passed but not by enough in the end. So got told she had qualified for her first choice school then never got in. Still on the waiting list. Starting at a massive comp next week. March was hideous as she was devastated. Appealed and lost.

But she's ok now. I hate the whole system. They are so young. I agree, just ease off the pressure.

@namechange3007 JESUS, that stress would kill me! Although, thinking WAY back, a friend of mine had similar when I was at school. She passed but not by enough, got given a high school, appeal failed. At the end of Term 1, her parents got asked why they had sent her to a school she was clearly not suited for, but it took the rest of that year to get her transferred to grammar, and that was only because someone left.
She went on to Oxford, though, so she was clearly massively bright. It shouldn’t ever, ever come down to how a child is feeling on one day to judge the school they go onto.

Happy to chat by PM if you want xx

She is excited and happy about her school now. I hope it will be ok.

I would also stop the pressure, let her do the tests if she wants to.
But also apply for an EHCP. And look around if there are other schools that might be more suitable.
Are you anywhere near the Surrey border? Would you consider boarding?

Personally I am so glad we didn't live in a Grammar county. God luck!

Having been in your position I would say still go for the exam. I don't think she will feel less of a 'failure' for pulling out and you will always wonder what if...

In my experience the mocks these tutors do are horrifically hard - by design.

I had one dd who failed (but was later diagnosed with dyscalculia which meant she missed out two sections of the verbal reasoning exam).

I actually wish I had put her in for the 12 plus because I think she would have passed but I was afraid of letting her fail again.

My younger DD was always one of the top (but not very top) of her small village primary school. I had similar doubts because of mocks, she was just failing them or barely scraping passes and I was quite worried. She did really well in the actual exam which she found much easier than the mocks, and now going into year 9 she is doing fantastically well at grammar.

@MollyButton we’re not near enough any border to make it viable, I’ve looked into it, the transport won’t make it possible in under an hour each way and I’m not putting an 11-year-old through a 10 hour day. An EHCP might open up possibilities we hadn’t considered I guess.

Thanks, @Namechange3007, I’ll drop you a message.

@Whistle73 when you say hard by deign, do you mean harder than the actual test?
They’ve been using old test papers, mostly.

Tried to message you @Namechange3007but it says you don’t exist! Sorry!

Well an EHCP takes a while, so it's worth starting, and it does open doors. And as she gets older (or if things go disastrously) you might consider longer journeys/boarding - and some of the possibilities do need a EHCP to access.
The EHCP might also provide resource that could enable your DD to cope with a normal school. And one boy I know managed to get into the very oversubscribed Catholic school in the next town, when I know his parents are C of E - it could only have been because of the EHCP.

And your DD might cope better than you fear.

But I had plans B and C at least roughly formulated for my DD with ASD, and kept modifying them, just in case we ever needed them.

@Torple yes, the papers the 11 plus board released for practice were much much harder than the actual exam.

I took this test many years ago. I did a few test papers with my mum over the summer but nothing else. Instead my parents spent a lot of time "bigging up" the comprehensive back up choice and kept me from knowing that the school expected me to pass (my mum was one of the teachers in the school and it would have stressed me out no end to know the school was pinning their hopes on my passing). Your DD needs to know that, should she not go to grammar, it is far from the end of the world and she'll be happy whatever the outcome. For example, will any of her friends not be taking the test and therefore definitely going to your back up choice? Are there any subjects she lives now that are really well served by the comprehensive, such as a school farm or amazing sports or technology facilities? Anything that will make not passing seem less daunting, and therefore lessen the pressure.

If she wants to do it, I'd let her sit it, she may feel a bit resentful for not having the opportunity otherwise. Just keep reassuring her how capable she is whatever the outcome might be. If her school says that she is a good candidate, you'd always have the option of appealing if the test didn't go well.

We've never been comfortable with the idea of tutoring for the 11+ but did put our daughter in for a 'mock' before hers. About 150 children sat it and we were told that she came 3rd in NVR but in the bottom 10 for both maths and English. They recommend significant amounts of extra tutoring (we didn't, husband convinced that all tutoring companies have a vested interest to sell more services so will always say they need it).
When it came to it, she qualified for grammar with a huge margin.

Ok - issue 1 is what to do about the exam.
I'm in a different grammar area with a different system but equally bastarding shit unfair and stressful. My kids both did 11+ even though I loathe the system.

I would suggest doing the test but take away all expectations if you can/as much as you can. Do it for the experience, for queuing up with friends, go for ice cream afterwards, praise her for trying her best, buy her a present if that's what your family does. All on the weekend of the test.

Then downplay the results. One of mine was borderline/not quite there. The other was a v high scorer. But we gave them the same praise. And kept away from all other parents and kids over the results weekend so it was as old news as possible by the time we saw people again.

It is shit and a hard situation to parent. But taking her out because of fear of failure doesn't show her how tough she is. She is so tough she can sit Any Exam and whatever comes next she will deal with. Everyone has good and bad days. It helps to work hard like she has, and it also comes down to luck.

Issue 2 is what schools to apply for. Leave that for another day, honestly.

Issue 3 I'd say apply for EHCP but others will have better advice than me.

Good luck. I do feel your pain.

Some kids don't do well on tests. My dd was assessed as Highly Gifted and finished high school several years early and has already taken many Community College classes while still in high school, and has an excellent grade point average (note all usa terms as we are in Los Angeles), but did abysmally on the standardized tests (SAT) that we have here. DD has severe anxiety and dyslexia, which seem to intermingle with each other, so anytime she's expected to give a standard answer in a hurry, so does extraordinarily poorly (failed her 1 times tables). I decided not to put the pressure on her and she is now really enjoying classes and life as I watch her peers struggling emotionally (and academically) to meet standards that aren't appropriate for them.

I think this type of educational style is marginalizing the creatives (whether that be the arts or the sciences) of society.

I pulled my son out, best thing I did, they have grammar streams in the high schools and half the children that go to grammar have been tutored within an inch of their life so they are not the most gifted and bright. In this bit of Kent year 7 is a endless round of parents with children at Grammar school trying to save face by talking about the school not being the "right fit" or bullying, or they realised their child was missing out on the interaction of a more diverse school population, when their child has been asked to leave as they are not keeping up and then the really fucking awful and cruel culls in year 9/10/11 when the pick off the children they worry will pull them down the league table, which can mean a child can't finish a course as it is not done at the new school they end up in or a different board so they are playing catch up.

If you can't decide you can go to the wire I pulled my son out the morning of as I fretted I was doing the wrong thing but that morning confirmed it was a bloody stupid thing to put him through.

Ps lol missed this bit about EHCP start applying now as secondary School whole new ball game, and children really struggle in year 7. As I say best thing I did was pulling him out, as I then applied for an EHCP he is now at a much smaller specialist school where he took his first exams this year (year 9) he is so happy and is able to be relaxed and the specialist education is worth its weight. My friends some is also asd like my son and at grammar he gets no lessons on social interaction and the like and he is really struggling now.

Just from another side, I went to a grammar school in Kent, I passed by several marks but hated the pressure of my grammar school, I was lower set for most things and struggled with feelings of failure. In terms of the Faith school I take it is Christian, it might be worth writing to the headteacher and explaining the situation, you may find them sympathetic and able to advise on entry requirements, I don't know but it might be worth a shot! Good luck OP!

I feel your pain, my daughter is doing this test in 2 weeks time and has suddenly started getting scores like 37% when she was in the 80’s until now. I think she’s just over it tbh and needs to just do it. I can’t wait for it to be over. I wouldn’t pull your daughter out but have a bit of a break from it 💐

These replies are making me glad my daughter isn't going to grammar!

Give her a break from tests but let her sit the paper. My son started getting poor marks a month or so before taking the 11+ so I just left it alone til he did the actual paper. He did well in the end. I haver never heard of these 'culls' of less able students though - not at any of the schools in Kent where I live!