Michaela School and behaviour - AIBU

[herculepoirot2]

AIBU to think that you might read this behaviour policy and think it is authoritarian and unnecessary, but to also think that, with results four times better than the national average, these people might have a point about the benefits to young people of being expected to work hard and behave well?

mcsbrent.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Behaviour-Policy-11.02.19.pdf

AravisTarkheena

I don’t think you can expect a school not to put in place policies that work for the students who apply there, and tell parents that, if they want to send their child there, they have to support those policies. I think the results show that this is working wonders for those children whose parents are willing.

Well it would wouldn’t it - I have no doubt that the school will be a good learning environment for the kids who go there. My point is that this raises the question of where this kind of selective/self selective process fits within a comprehensive education system.

But as I said, I would like to see how they accommodate their students with SN.

My point is that this raises the question of where this kind of selective/self selective process fits within a comprehensive education system.

We don’t fully have one anyway. We have grammar schools, maintained faith schools, schools ostensibly “comprehensive” but actually only patronised by the children of the millionaires who can afford houses in the catchment. Nobody moans about any of that as much as they moan about these deprived kids being given a chance to learn in peace.

And I got the stat wrong before: apparently 54% of exams were awarded top grades, nearly three times the national average. Stunning.

I think it’s very likely that the effect will dilute over time - I could be wrong obv but I’d imagine there’s currently a combination of factors that are helping to achieve the results. It’s a relatively small yr 11 cohort (115) that will have been the only students in year 7 and there won’t have been a full school’s worth of kids to contend with until this year. There will have been a huge amount of ‘buy in’ from staff and parents, encouraged by the media coverage. There will have been intense oversight to make sure these results were pulled off. I’m presuming quite a lot of cash involved too. Whether or not this is sustainable remains to be seen - presumably there will school expansion, the school is emulated and become less notable etc etc. I think the fact alone that’s it’s a new school probably helps loads. The new schools local to me are very hyped, they have the advantage of being able to mould their first cohorts vert effectively.

Also - I’m not moaning about Micheala school. It’s a flashpoint for the unfairness in the system you have pointed out. I can assure you I mean about grammar schools.

AravisTarkheena

All good points. But I think the overall strength of the ethos of the school will help, and they will be inundated with applications from children whose parents are 100% on board.

@JacquesHammer are you sure it didn’t say 77% got 5 good passes - which means 9-4? Over 70% getting 5 A/A* equivalents seem statistically unlikely. Nationally, only 20.8% of grades were 7+.

I don't "like" it,mainly because even as an adult I would struggle with many of these things. I assume staff have to lead by example,so I doubt I would even get through the doors. So if it wouldn't be suitable for me, I wouldn't make my child go there either. She's anxious enough about breaking the rules at her (fairly relaxed compared to this) Catholic School.

I wonder how good they are with pastoral care.

The push to get ever increasing higher grades is damaging the mental health of teenagers.

I wonder how good they are with pastoral care.

Have a look at their website. It looks thorough.

Outwood Grange Academies (Yorkshire and the north east mainly) have a very similar ethos.

It is the reason I avoided the school. However they do get very good results and are heavily featured in the top schools in the area.

There is something though that doesn't sit right with me and it really wouldn't suit either of my eldest children.

I wonder how good they are with pastoral care.

Have a look at their website. It looks thorough.

What is written in a policy and what actually happens in reality is not always the same.

The “eat what you’re given” I would hate and on that basis alone wouldn’t send my child there. But the silent corridors and zero distraction in the classroom would be great for my SEN child. He really struggles with the all the noisy and distracting crap other kids do when they’re supposed to be working and it usually results in him falling apart. Telling him “just concentrate on your own work” really doesn’t cut it i’m afraid Miss. A classroom where he knew the teacher would keep everyone on track would be bliss for him.

What is written in a policy and what actually happens in reality is not always the same.

It seems a bit unreasonable to believe all of their policies are implemented except one, though.

If my school got those results it would be worthy of comment, given that (as a state comprehensive school) we educate all catchment pupil up till 18 if they choose to stay on, and offer an appropriate course for whatever level they are at. I don't think it's worth making a song and dance about good exam results if you could pick who you let sit them.

I'm wondering how the pupil I have with Tourette's would fair at this school. He has no ability to stop the sounds he makes, and it would be a complete nonsense to suggest he shouldn't be in mainstream. Or the dyslexic students who can't learn much by rote due to their poor working memory.

This school will be inundated with pushy parents once they realise what the results are, and the kids who need the benefit the most will be pushed out.

I think the idea that children will behave as the default is generally a very privileged idea to have, mainly held by well off parents (either culturally or financially well off), and those who just have no experience whatsoever of education. So the idea that you have time and energy for understanding the motivation of the poor little snowflake who just told you to fuck off and then engage in some kind of Paul Dix nonsense is completely useless in the face of a class of 27, some of whom have additional needs.

It’s by no means clear that SEN children don’t benefit from this kind of environment (and it’s not like they are all a homogenous mass anyway) - even so, it clearly works for a great number of children. If it works, it can’t be thrown out because it doesn’t suit some others. And that’s all tied up with poor SEN provision in the UK as a whole, Michaela school or not.

I don’t think the Micheala approach should be ‘thrown out’ - I mean I’ve never been so I’m having to use my imagination as to what it’s actually like - but I don’t like the way some of the coverage is in a kind of ‘oh look they’ve cracked it, we were right all along kids just need a strong hand’ vein (looking at you the telegraph). Cos it definitely won’t work for all kids and the idea that kids ‘just need discipline’ to succeed is a reductive viewpoint. Tbf I suppose it’s not the schools fault they’ve been written about in such a way. It’s unfortunately a bit much to expect nuanced journalism on education.
As @Rainuntilseptember says there’s a big song and dance being made about what they’ve achieved despite the fact there is definitely an element of self selection. I suppose the progress 8 scores will be interesting to see.

Personally I am pretty strict and I like the idea that they don’t put up with low level disruption and rudeness. I get pissed off with the softly softly approach at my school. On the other hand I don’t like the idea of simply saying - oh sorry we can’t cater to you you’re acting out - byyyeeeeee. I don’t know if that’s a fair representation of their approach tho.

Another thought: the school will no doubt be carefully and extensively cultivating this reputation. Our staff spend so much time with arsehole parents shouting the odds demanding that their child should not have to follow the rules, I think it’s fair game for a school to let it be known that they have no time for that whatsoever.

Our staff spend so much time with arsehole parents shouting the odds demanding that their child should not have to follow the rules, I think it’s fair game for a school to let it be known that they have no time for that whatsoever.

Agreed. Fair play to them.

I was thinking that too re parents - Reading about how any child who is 1 min late gets detention I thought, well they obviously don’t have to deal with the parents who don’t give a shit about their kids getting detention cos they just don’t go. It obviously works for the school and there are times when I wish we just said to parents - alright off you go we don’t have to teach your kid. But I guess it rankles with my sense of the sort of ‘civic duty’ aspect of education: someone has to teach those kids and although it’s good for the school if you can palm them off the problem just gets shunted elsewhere.

My school gets very good gcse results - not as spectacular as Micheala, but in a pretty disadvantaged area and despite the fact the behaviour policy is pretty soft.

My point is that, for the demographic served by Michaela, this approach seems to work better

But that is because in practice it's a demographic where they ease out the inconvenient kids - but they are just as entitled to an uninterrupted educational experience as everyone else.

But I guess it rankles with my sense of the sort of ‘civic duty’ aspect of education: someone has to teach those kids and although it’s good for the school if you can palm them off the problem just gets shunted elsewhere.

I totally understand this. But it also conflicts with my belief that the people paying the price are the other kids: the kids who work hard and respect each other and their teachers. They are entitled to more than an indifferent education.

But that is because in practice it's a demographic where they ease out the inconvenient kids - but they are just as entitled to an uninterrupted educational experience as everyone else.

I have seen no evidence of this.