Michaela School and behaviour - AIBU

[herculepoirot2]

AIBU to think that you might read this behaviour policy and think it is authoritarian and unnecessary, but to also think that, with results four times better than the national average, these people might have a point about the benefits to young people of being expected to work hard and behave well?

mcsbrent.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/02/Behaviour-Policy-11.02.19.pdf

If there are only .4% SEN pupils as opposed to 4.4% I would be interested to know how many of these .4% actually get to do GCSEs

And yes, the quiet atmosphere would suit him, but he can never be as perfect as they would want him to be.

I think its just a load of gimmicky rubbish

Tell that to the 54% of year 11s who left with grades 9-7....

They’re doing something right. Getting children the best grades they are capable of opens doors for them. Particularly children who experience disadvantage.

And frankly, I think the education system in this country has truly gone to shit when this school is seen as an amazing outlier because it expects secondary aged children to bring basic equipment (pens, pencils etc) and acts accordingly if not. There are scores of teachers on here who will regale you of tales of how pupils don’t bring stuff like this and don’t care enough to do so, and the teacher has to provide them out of their own pocket or waste 5 minutes arguing with the pupil about it.

@SmileEachDay I thought it was 37%?
Anyway, if they have 10% of the national average of EHCPs then they are doing something else with the rest of the children with SEN.

I worked in a similar school not a million miles from there, similar kids, poor prior data. The progress made was phenomenal and I absolutely credit the very strict behaviour policy/zero tolerance.

I thought it was 37%?

Figures in this article

Really interesting to read the positive reports of the school - lunch times sound fucking awful but I like the idea of doing away with glue sticks. I still think there’s some way to go before the school can be really applauded, they have to keep this up. On the other hand the comparisons with private school are interesting; it doesn’t sound to me like a private school, or not one that I’ve ever had an experience of.

Hmm. Ofsted report says they have an average proportion of students with SEN.

I can’t find any figures re numbers of EHCPs - is that in the public domain?

I also visited last year SmileEachDay but seem to have had a different experience to you. It very much felt like a ‘conveyer belt’ of visitors that day and some questions were welcomed and some where not. What did you think at lunch when pupils had to stand up and tell the whole canteen what they were thankful for that day? It felt rather surreal and although I couldn’t quite put my finger on why, I wouldn’t want to go back.

Private schools that I’ve come into contact with have never been super strict. I did a summer school once at Harrow - obv it wasn’t actually operating as Harrow school so don’t come for me for claiming to have worked at Harrow- but there were loads of just finished Harrovians working there and they had lots of rules but they didn’t do this whole silent classroom ‘monkish’ work. It does make me feel a bit queasy that working class kids have to be given these very strict behaviour standards to adhere to to be able to succeed but if you go to a fancy school you get to express yourself and get the results. Anyway 🤷🏻‍♀️ That’s a whole other issue.

Interesting thread though - certainly made me think.

I think the education system in this country has truly gone to shit when this school is seen as an amazing outlier because it expects secondary aged children to bring basic equipment

I do agree with this. Threads on MN often horrify me when I read about the conditions some children are being kept in (I would say educated in but for too many that isn’t the case) for 6/7 hours a day. I went to a very good girls grammar in NI and demerits for forgetting a pen or a book or having your tie too loose were (and still are in that school) standard. We had to walk to the left hand side of the corridor in single file, we stood to greet anyone entering our class, we only spoke when we had raised our hand and been given the go ahead by the teacher. And probably many other rules I’ve forgotten that would sound horrendous to anyone who never experienced it. But it was a school full of mutual respect. No-one would be shouting at anyone up a corridor. Not another pupil not a teacher shouting at a pupil. Class time was learning time no-one was in any doubt about that. As soon as teacher entered that was it. Shut up, eyes front, chat later. It was (still is) an excellent school and produces great results year after year. I feel very lucky to have been able to attend it. I feel really sad and angry for children I hear about on MN who are having to deal with 30 hours a week of chaos and very little actual schooling.

ChloeDecker

I think they do get rather deluged with visitors.

Lunchtime was weird! But kids seemed to very enthusiastically want to join in - the idea of thankfulness is a smart one re mental health. And I guess the sharing is about the solid sense of community. I very much liked the “family lunch” idea.

I’m really torn on this. Part of me (the hippy dippy home schooling part!) thinks it’s pretty repellent, but another part of me thinks that zero tolerance to bullying especially, and low level disruption which gets in the way of learning, is actually a good thing. There’s some things I really don’t agree with (eg confiscating phones for weeks - a drop off and collect at the end of the day would be better) but also some good ideas too. I guess the proof is in the pudding. And if it’s in an area where parents get a genuine choice in schools, then why not have it as an option?

eg confiscating phones for weeks - a drop off and collect at the end of the day would be better

But that’s no punishment or deterrent. Collecting at the end of the day is the same as if they just stuck to the rule of having their phone off in school. Take it off them for 6 weeks and they actually learn their lesson. It sucks to have no phone for 6 weeks. They won’t risk losing it again.

Sorry.. I meant it as more of a preventative thing.. all phones dropped off at the start of the day and picked up at the end. Maybe detention if it’s found on you at other times? The whole long term confiscation thing just crosses a line to me. (But equally they’re upfront about it so you can decide if you’re ok with it or not.)

Ah right ok. Probably be far too much faff to do that. The form teacher would have to make sure everyone took the right phone back at the end of the day and who would be responsible if one went missing or got damaged? Anyway, leaving them to have their phones with them, but switched off leave the choice with them on how to behave with them. They can decide to break the rules or not. I think that’s good.

@AravisTarkheena - might be partly to do with smaller staff to pupil ratio? I’m pretty sure if the expensive schools had to have the same ratio, learning wouldn’t be so effective.

I’m a teacher with 15 years experience - 7 years in the UK. I have taught in some very rough schools and do think consistent rules an high expectations are the answer to a lot of the discipline problems.
However this school sounds rather draconian and a little bit too rigid. I always think this sort of organisation and schooling is fine if you are preparing student for life in a factory or to follow rules and conform. But I don’t think it prepares students for modern life.
Consistently the best education system are found to be those in Scandinavian countries. With less rigid rules and a more equal society. If I had a choice I would want that for my own kids. As it is I have been lucky enough to send them to a private school which offers them the best opportunities in the country we live in.

@Namenic I was wondering if the staff to pupil ratio has been high at Michaela for the last few years, that could explain a lot. The thing is people will pick up on the discipline as the primary factor in its success, but it could be they’ve had classes of 15 for 5 years. Unless you are literally there conducting a study it’s going to be difficult to say if the ‘key’ factor is the behaviour policy. I know what you mean about private schools though, there are a lot of differences.

Also - I guess the flip side to this is how many schools have similar behaviour policies and how many are getting such outstanding results. This is one strict school, you’d have to put a lot more effort into finding schools with comparable policies, seeing how they implement them etc before drawing the conclusion that a behaviour policy is the driving force behind such good results.

Joxer - Another NI girl here, who also went to an all girls grammar. Schooling is the only thing that would make me consider moving back! The rules are there for a reason and acting the maggot just wasn’t an option.

And why do people assume that following rules somehow doesn’t prepare children for life in the real world or removes their ability to be critical thinkers? If anything the opposite is true - many school leavers seem to be incapable of coping with the rules and expected behaviour of the workplace and unable to face consequences of their actions. How would the Highway Code work if we all decided that we couldn’t be arsed to follow it? Would I still get paid if I took to doing no work and messing about on my phone all day? I also can’t see the evidence that overly permissive schooling turns out amazing critical thinking skills anyway.

Expensive private schools don’t necessarily need to impose such rules as you can bet your bottom dollar that parents paying £40k per year for their child’s education won’t let them mess about, and the home culture these students are coming from places a decent weight on education and conforming to being one of the accepted set.

I also don’t think (happy to be corrected if wrong) that any other European country would have any truck with not eating the school food. Don’t like it? Tough. You’re not going out at lunch, so eat it or go hungry. Some countries will still send you home at lunchtime - good luck making that work if you have a job. What have we done to our children if so many of them are so fussy?

The cult of the individual is a big problem in this country, and education is only one facet of it.

To clear up the confusion upthread about the results (which I did write earlier) 37% was my mistake. It is indeed 54% 9-7.

After reflecting on this this morning, here is where I come out: some parents (like many in this thread) aren’t comfortable with these rules, for many reasons. And I respect that. They don’t want their children being “conformist”. Okay. But I think the parents who do want their children to go to a school where almost all of the available time is spent learning, where kindness and respect for learning are put before everything else, I think that’s to be respected as well. These children have as much right to thrive as anyone else.

I think they are doing a great thing, albeit they’re a bit “extra”, as my students might have put it.

But I really think about 80% of the students I have taught would have loved this.

I don't agree that private schools including Harrow don't achieve a classrom without too much disruption - they do. (We have a relative that teaches there and my children were at private schools so we know a lot of them - it is part of what I paid for - single sex (which tends to mean less messing around), reasonably quiet class rooms, standing up when the teacher enters the room, strict uniform rules - hair to be a certain length etc etc. It works and free thought is of course still possible. This time of enivornment where you lean and pass your exams does not stop you thinking and being capable of leading and inventing - in fact it aids it.

They will still be doing the same exams as children in other schools with the same requirements for more than just adding up 10 + 20 and instead needing you to think in the ways the various exams require.

I prefer academic selection too and single sex so I would add those into the mix as well but certainly this school seems to be doing well and I am glad all the tax I pay is at least going on this.

This is one strict school, you’d have to put a lot more effort into finding schools with comparable policies

I think there is a lot more to Michaela than “strict”. Their relentless high expectations, focus on kindness and absolute focus on learning being an amazing thing are as much a part of the exam success as the strictness, IMO.