To refuse to spend £25k on a bloody kitchen!!!

[smeerf]

I've finally totted up all the quotes for my tiny kitchen and hallway refurb in my little 2 up 2 down terrace. I think it's important to note that I'm not doing any building work other than removing an old door/door frame in the hall to make it open plan, so nothing structural.

Units: Howdens, 7 base units, 4 wall, 2 full height larder (yeah there's a few pull outs in there but only 3).

Worktop: Quartz from local stone cutter.

Appliances: Siemens, sourced myself, nothing fancy except £500 for a boiling water tap.

Floor and wall tiles: Online, not super expensive.

Fitting: includes a new ceiling in kitchen area, plastering, retiling walls and floors, supplying and fitting a new boiler and all the electrics and plumbing for the room (no appliances are changing position though and we ran a new ring in preparation last year).

£25k. How. How is this possible. AIBU to tell everyone to shove their quotes somewhere uncomfortable?

Too much.

By way of comparison: we are having new bathroom and creation of an en suite (by combining airing cupboard, closet and shower stall in existing bathroom).

Full removal of everything that's there, and moving hot water tank to the loft, installation of new piping and two new bathroom suites (salvaging one toilet), including plastering, tiling, painting, flooring, electrics, extractor fans etc, plus the knocking down of a porch wall made of UPVC, bricking up and new window, for just less than £20K.

Therefore a whole new room and structural change added.

Unless you have an enormous kitchen I cannot see why it would come in at that price.

Other than that I think it's the labour that seems high. Have you had a few fitting quotes?

Ikea aren’t crap - your builders just don’t get a mark up there! That’s why they want you to use Howdens.

It’s not just a kitchen though. That’s a lot of work.

Cross posted with the quote.

That's a lot of money for those units. We paid less than half that for 18 units, some full height, from Ikea. Your builders are wrong about the quality and durability, simply not true, at least as good as Howdens, if not better. My guess is that they're making a lot on selling you some very overpriced units.

The appliances don't look overly expensive, but intergrated microwaves are very expensive for what they are. I don't know if I'd bother with one and just get a free standing one.

Labour looks like a lot, are you in London?

But where do you live? South is going to be way more expensive than north - tradesman wise. 10k labour seems alot

Wickes did ours 3 years ago. They were brilliant. It was a complete remodel (think removing arch and redesigning from horseshoe to L shape), top of the range units, expensive surfaces, new flooring in kitchen and hallway, some plastering etc etc - so a big job. It was "only" £14k.

Get a few more quotes.....

We just had kitchen refurb, with a new boiler quartz worktops, Siemens alliances and some minor building work, your quote seems reasonable, we were getting silly prices from the big high street companies and went with our local independent in the end for quality and service. I would question the hot water tap at £500, is it a true boiling tap we were quoted one at that price which only got the temp to 98 degrees, if you want to make full use of one for a decent cuppa you need a true boiling one. Quooker and Hotspot are both great makes.

Also we did away with microwave in the kitchen (it’s in the garage) as what I used a micro for didn’t warrant the money to be spent, glad we didn’t have one as we have Siemens induction hob with a boost function which boils milk as quick if not quicker than microwave.

Massive dripfeed - I am in London!

The Howden's rep actually gave me the itemised quote, the pricing didn't come through the builder so no markup.

I have had three builder's quotes ranging from £8k to £13k but they're not identical - some builders wanted to tile over my existing tiles and skim the ceiling rather than replace (which would prevent me from having the tall wall cabinets as we'd lose too much height). I wasn't sure what I wanted really until I'd spoken to all of them as they all had different ideas about what we could do. However I don't think it's the ceiling replacement that's driving it up, as this guy itemised it for me and it's only £336, labour and materials.

I really appreciate all this by the way, thanks for your help. I feel vindicated!

@smeerf
I wouldn't spend 25k on that particular kitchen and definitely think you should look else where (not saying that particular kitchen in any way a judgement of your taste, I mean the quality of what you'd be getting from that company! Style looks lovely)

We spent around that amount for a handmade hand painted bespoke made kitchen, fit to the weird shape of our old house, it was the biggest chunk of our budget and we did most the other work ourselves in the renovation, and honestly we couldn't recommend the kitchen enough, it's holding up beautifully, the aftercare from the company was great. I'd keep looking around and say that from renovating many houses and flats (ex h does it for his business) you can get something very similar for a lot less!

We’ve just ordered our units and worktops from Howdens. They MASSIVELY inflate their prices and we managed to haggle them down from £6k to £3800 for more units (plus worktops) than you have ordered.

Press them for more money off.

Not sure about the price but I don't think those hot water taps are any good. People I know who had them just ended up using a kettle. They soon need new filters or servicing.

The quote from Howden's is their retail to the public price.

The builder can get it for far less and choose to pass that price onto you if they wish. It is worth asking them.

I would advise you getting quotes from 3 places like B&q, Ikea and magnet and asking Howden to match it. They did for me with some swaps taking a £11,000 kitchen to £5000 . My kitchen is 3x size of yours ( not boasting, just giving you an idea of what to expect) but I did but appliances separately during sales. Bear in mind Howden also only sell to.trade and how much discount the trader will pass on us up to them if the quote is too high tell your tradesman. I said B and Q were better value and I was ordering through them. Suddenly the price dropped. It's a 6 wait wait for b and q kitchen, Howden - next day delivery. My builder did not want 6 week wait.

The bit that is costing you is the Labour and other bits. Can you get quotes from kitchen fitters?

We have a 13 year old Howdens kitchen and much of it is knackered. The doors and handles are nice, if a bit battered, but the units are cheap chipboard like anything else and have disintegrated or warped in places.

Kitchen: £5,800. This is expensive. I have just ordered a new kitchen from Wren Kitchens for about £7.5k. Probably not a nice as yours as it is a laminate worktop but that includes integrated washer/dryer, full size dishwasher, double over, extractor, gas hob which are all Bosch.

Worktop: £1,450

Tiles (14m2 floor and 2m2 wall): £550 - don’t know if this is expensive as my husbands doing this.
Fridge/freezer, single oven, induction hob, integrated microwave, slim dishwasher: £2,100 - seems pricey

Tap and sink: £800 (I am aware this is a luxury and we probably have to forgo it!)
Boiler: £1,554 - I’ve just had a new Worcester boiler but in for this which is reasonable but I have a 4 bed house so I’ve probably got a bigger boiler
Boiler install: £1,776 - reasonable

Kitchen/hall labour: £10,775. Sounds pricey. What is included in this. Surely if all the appliances are going in the same place there isn’t a massive amount of plumbing or electrical work?Im paying £4K to every single room in my 4 bed replastered or skimmed and I need two new ceilings!

Kitchen/hall materials: £1,356 - what is the for?

So they've probably quoted you the list prices for the units. In case you're not aware, Howdens have crazy high list prices and then the builders/kitchen fitters buy them at a discount and then will either pass the discount on, or charge you a mark up. I would expect those units to cost under £2k at Ikea.

I understand your reasoning for the microwave and the tap (would be OK if you're coffee drinkers, but maybe not for tea, although some people mention true boiling water taps).

But if most of the money is the labour, the boiler and the units, I can't see much scope for cutting down, except the units, but then you might find that the builders either refuse to install Ikea units or charge more.

But you could look at other suppliers like DIY kitchens, Wickes, or ask the builders how much they'd charge for the Howdens units you've chosen. You might find that one of your builders gets a good discount from them and passes it on to the customer.

Howdens are expensive, seriously have a look at Ikea. I have an Ikea kitchen that still looks brand new after 6 years. I also have a boiling water tap. I love it. No waiting. Work ones probably haven't got a filter or have a filter that hasn't been replaced.

I certainly didn't pay anywhere near what you have been quoted and it is well known that lots of kitchens have the Ikea base units and then bespoke doors for a high end look.

My builder gave me his day rate for my extension, I paid for everything direct with the supplier including the builder's merchant for bricks, cement etc. Builder invoiced me every week for his labour costs. I sourced the kitchen, paid an independent fitter.

I would definitely shop around.

Another vote for DIY Kitchens - my kitchen is more than twice the size of yours and units were £2k.

Consider wood or a solid surface like Maia instead of stone.

I’m in London - my fitter was much less than that. If you’re SW PM me and I’ll give you the company details.

I paid around £22-23K for ours when we bought our current house. The whole house was really dated and had to be completely updated. We had ours put in with a local firm that does bespoke kitchens and bathrooms. I had oak cupboards,granite worktop/splashback,neff appliances,Karndean flooring,corner cupboards that swing out.It did include some plastering,plumbing and electrics as well. It's amazing how much things cost.

Prolly about right for London, not that good for say Rothgerham can you say where you are OP?.

25k and they want to tile over tiles?!?! Horrendous. Shop around
Wickes are really good and cheap. IKEA stuff is properly shit so builders wont use it - it also has no service gaps which builders hate.

Howdens quote through a builder can be 'renegotiated'. We simply refused the first costings, builder 'renegotiated' with Howdens and we got what we wanted at a cost that suited.

I used the DIY kitchens quote as a comparison, though for sheer practicality I'm glad we didn't use them. Howdens was local. Our builder used them regularly and so was familiar with the product. It was very simple for him to return stuff, or add additional items for instance when we realised we wanted more extras (draw liners, a different coloured sink) DIY kitchens would have been a 2 hour round trip.