in thinking my friend is being incredibly naive?

[ImNotYourGranny]

My friend is very excited as she's getting her 2 new Westie pups this weekend. She's invited me over on Sunday to meet them. I love Westies and have 2 of my own.

She's just mentioned that they're coming from Spain. They were rescued after being dumped in bin. She has to pick them up from the airport on Saturday, having paid £300 for each of them. I looked like this when she told me.

It's a scam isn't it. How the fuck is someone flying 2 puppies in for £600. When I emigrated here (not UK) it cost over £3000 to have mine flown over and that was 10 years ago, and doesn't include the cost of vaccinations, pet passport, vet inspection etc. Plus who dumps valuable pedigree puppies in a bin?

She's either going to get poorly, smuggled puppies or they'll be held up at customs and she'll have to pay more to get them through, only to then find out they don't exist.

She thinks I'm being ridiculous.

I’ve said this on another thread but IMO rescuing from abroad is akin to puppy farming and should be banned. We have enough dogs in rescue over here, we don’t need to be taking on any more at the price of the rescue dogs in kennels here.

Added to which though, years ago there used to be programmes on puppy farming which showed people who would agree to meet the owner and pick up their puppy at the m4 services, agreeing to pick up a previously unseen puppy from an airport after you’ve handed over the cash is exactly the same, and no responsible dog owner would agree to take on any dog under those circumstances.

If rescues over here were agreeing to meet prospective owners at the local station/services/

I got a dog from Spain. The adoption fee including neutering and vaccinations was 270 euros. He was flown here on a budget airline, with a volunteer “companion” passenger who stated he was her dog (rather than send his as unaccompanied cargo) which makes things cheaper. 250-300 is the norm around here. people really do dump dogs in dustbins, alas.

There is a lot of funding from local charities where I live to send animals to UK for rehoming, in fact a friend of mine does this a lot. It's not a scam.

We have enough dogs in rescue over here, we don’t need to be taking on any more at the price of the rescue dogs in kennels here

I agree but the issue seems to.be the uk removing centres themselves and their restrictions on who they remove to.

If you have children, you cannot adopt a UK dog, if you work, you cannot adopt a uk dog. So it is either buying from a breeder or adopting from abroad.

My friends mother abroad ended up with five pedigrees, she was known as a soft touch. Not everyone is as daft about dogs as we are.

Added to which though, years ago there used to be programmes on puppy farming which showed people who would agree to meet the owner and pick up their puppy at the m4 services, agreeing to pick up a previously unseen puppy from an airport after you’ve handed over the cash is exactly the same, and no responsible dog owner would agree to take on any dog under those circumstances

I used to work in Bristol and sadly this wasn't uncommon. The really helpful "breeders" would bring the dog over from mid Wales, and even meet them at the services on this side to save them the bridge toll, how helpful! Most of them came to us with parvo

@Oliversmumsarmy then perhaps questions need to be asked as to whether the rescues over here are so strict. Is it because A, their criteria are far too tight and they need to look at those again in order to rehome as many dogs as possible?

Or is it B, the majority of dogs in rescue are not in fact suitable for rehoming and perhaps a different approach needs to be taken.

Because if B, rescues who then import similarly problematic dogs from abroad and use basically no criteria to rehome them to anyone and everyone are being just as irresponsible. In that instance it is IMO preferable to go to a breeder.

Sound about right to me. That's an average rehoming cost for a foreign rescue puppy.

With my friends charity the dogs lived in Cyprus first with experienced foster families and their behaviour and suitability to live in certain environments/with children etc assessed. There's a bit of a wait while they get up to date with their vaccination programme so it's a good length of time to get to know the dog.

Uk rescues do perhaps need to relax their rules.. however the lives and outcomes for strays and abandoned dogs in the uk is hugely nicer for uk animals than those in many items countries so people probably feel they are saving a do with a far worse prognosis than any animal here

We have enough dogs in rescue over here, we don’t need to be taking on any more at the price of the rescue dogs in kennels here

actually i think it is a misconception that there are plentiful, well adjusted dogs suitable for family life languishing in shelters (which is indeed in itself a good thing)

we searched for 18 months for a rescue dog. experienced dog owners, work from home, open to pretty much any size or kind of dog, willing to travel whatever distance needed. but we do have two children under 10 but over 6 and a cat.

Dogs in UK rescues are often poorly socialised, damaged from their early experiences and subsequently suffer from behavioral issues as well as being badly bred and susceptible to health issues . Sad as it is the great majority of them will require extensive intervention and training with qualified behaviorists. we were willing to put in the hours but still couldn't find a suitable dog, despite being flexible and accommodating. After 18 months we went via a breed specific rescue who rehabilitate dogs from overseas. these dogs are taken from genuinely awful circumstances and through the extensive social media network of current rescuers, fosterers and families who have rehomed these dogs it is clear that they go on to make fantastic pets.

With plan B whether the dogs are or are not suitable doesn't come into it.Families are being told no before any dog is picked out.

I met a lady with her children whilst in the waiting room at our vets. They had a very successful Romanian rescue because they.had been rejected by rescues in this country because of their children.

My ILs got a dog from a Greek rescue because their friend is a UK liaison for it and told them 'we have the perfect dog for you'. We think the dog was born a stray so no cruelty/neglect issues to get over and indeed the dog has been the perfect pet for an elderly couple - just wants to be with someone all the time.

They'd have used a UK rescue otherwise. I don't know about dog rescues, give there are legitimate concerns about unsocialised dogs in homes with children etc, but some cat rescues seem to have turned into cat hoarders - cant have a cat if it will be allowed outside unless you net over your garden, for example. SIL couldn't get a cat from a rescue despite having had cats all her life. Local vets were very happy to give her a cat with kittens and said they try to avoid rescues where they can.

Hmm. A friend adopted 2 separately from Spain, they’re very keen on dumping dogs out there, so I wouldn’t be amazed if she does get the right breed. I’ve seen lots of pointers advertised and over here, that’s a few quid. She should ask for vaccination records at the minimum.

I hope the puppies will be ok,if things go to plan.. It's sad really,when you think about all these dogs/puppies, being transported all over the place,in planes and vans etc. But the saving grace I suppose, is that they are being rescued, and maybe can have a good life after if they are lucky.

Its easy to dwell on the bad and nasty stories you hear about, there must be more of the success stories though.

There are lots of breed specific U.K. based rescues bringing dogs in from Spain
Most Spanish people won’t take on a rescue. Unwanted , yes well bred , dogs are taken to kill stations
Vet checks to bring in dogs to U.K. are rigorous. They have to be blood tested , vet checked , passported , vaccinated.
There is no quarantine needed for dogs coming here from within EU.
Dogs can be flown into animal reception centres in Manchester , Gatwick , Heathrow.
Don’t assume this lady has been scammed. If she has been dealing with a reputable rescue it should be fine.
Costs are subsidised by the rehoming charities, but extra donations towards costs always welcomed

I know a few people who have adopted dogs from Spain. It has been fine and they and their dogs are very happy together. It may work out well for your friend.

I have friends who have adopted cats from Spain.
There is a lady here in the UK who is in contact with someone in Spain. The woman in Spain rescues the cats and sends them to the lady in the UK who spends time socialising them etc before they are adopted.

I have 2 rescues from Greece. They were rescued from a shelter and the money I paid paid for passports jabs etc and was totally legit. If your friend is rescuing then it's probably a similar set up. I know a number of people who have rescued dogs this way totally legitimately

My next door neighbour rescued a pup from Italy, all above board, they went through a charity and they paid in excess of £700.

Lots of abandoned puppies/dogs here in Portugal are exported, it's common for charities to ask people flying to accompany a rescue dog to it's new home. My mum fell in love with a stray here and took her home to Switzerland. Hope everything works out.

Might not be a scam. The mother of someone I work with recently adopted from abroad and has had no issues.

But it’s not about whether a dog will make a good pet or not. Some puppy farmed dogs do come without issues as well hence why people continue to buy them.

But it’s about popping down to the airport to pick up an animal which you have never laid eyes on, know absolutely nothing about, and have paid 300 quid for the privilege of being able to take it home.

I do agree that many rescues have far too stringent rehoming criteria but also that many dogs in the UK are not suitable for rehoming. Equally however many dogs from abroad are not suitable either, and it would be interesting to see how many of these rescues end up in rescue centres over here once the rescue goes wrong, only to become one of those dogs which is not suitable for rehoming in a UK rescue.

Equally, people say that people are constantly being turned down to rescue in this country. That may well be the case, however many breeders won’t sell to some people either, but if a person says that they couldn’t find a breeder who would sell to them you wouldn’t suggest they go on to gumtree would you?

It’s no different but people accommodate the idea of bringing in a rescue from abroad because it’s been abandoned/mistreated/possibly even sold to the rescue by a puppy farmer who couldn’t find it a home in their country of origin.

The rescues from abroad play on people’s sympathies to take on these dogs. Poor puppies abandoned and look, you could pick them up at the airport on Sunday.

Whereas the backyard breeder or puppy farmer doesn’t have that kind of clout because they’ve bred the puppies deliberately. The principle is still the same though.

My friend got a rescue from Cyprus and it didn't cost that much so I wouldn't say she has been scammed just yet

Hmm. I've seen on You Tube a Greek guy & a Spanish women who run small rescue charities who regularly post re dogs they've rescued then rehomed to Holland, the US & the UK but tbh they're all older dogs, never seen puppies. Same for the small US charities that have done it & post regularly on You Tube.

As long as they're a reputable charity I'd be OK. Has she told you who they are?

The danger with these foreign rescues is they don't really check thoroughly where the animals are going.

For example, I give you an idiot acquaintance, 4 children ranging from months to 6. No partner, no job, small council property and on benefits.
Uk rescues would not give her a dog, and rightly so as he circumstances meant any animal she had would be straight on to the PDSA funding.

No worries though, a place in Greece happily handed over a neurotic, untrained stray they had rescued pulled off the streets for £300 (crowdfunded by fools).
Not sure where it is now. She hasn't got the dog. It came as no surprise to anyone that she couldn't afford, nor cope with the animal.