29.5k earnings who are you and how?!

[AtSea1979]

BBC reports today say the average salary in the UK is £29,500.

I earn 12k but i’m part time (otherwise 18k). I live in the north. I can only dream about earning nearly 30k. I’ve thought about retraining but I wouldn’t know where to start as the job market seems so difficult.

AIBU to think the majority of people earn much less and it’s just the minority fat cats pulled that figure up?

AtSea1979

You’re back!

You’ve had pages and pages of responses and advice. What are you going to do with it?

£29.5k+ Salary does not equal middle class!

No. Not middle class. Although in Cornwall two adults both earning this could have a very nice lifestyle.

The statistics for mean and median are readily available and have been quoted several times on the thread for full time workers the mean is 29.5 k the median is 28.4k
Only 5 % earn more than 70k
Only14% pay higher rate tax which with your personal allowance is about 50k

One of the main uses of these threads is that low paid women can see what opportunities are available to their daughters (and sons) and they can think from when teh child is fairly small how they can give them the chances to earn these kind of sums (if the family decide that is desirable at all - not everyone has that aim and money is not everything in life).

@transformandriseup it really depends... I live in Cornwall and with almost £90k we lived exactly the same type of lifestyle that we did when living in the home counties, I wouldn't say it improved.

Now it's close to £55k and we barely scrape by as rents are hideously expensive and so are properties to buy. Not to mention commuting costs and eating out/entertainment. We just came back from Norfolk and life is substantially cheaper over there with the added bonus of higher salaries.

I'm a teacher in London with significant pastoral responsibility. I earn £70k, which is about average for my friendship group. DH earns around £60k but will no doubt catch me up after we have children. I'd say we're comfortable but not rich, given our outgoings; however, it's our choice to live where we do so it's not something I'd complain about!

AtSea1979 There are plenty of graduates who can’t get job There is work available but you have to be prepared to adapt in short term for long term gain.
The RN are advertising. Starting salary about £29k and increases rapidly. Lots of options from nurses to logistics. Army likewise. Good prospects and family friendly policies.
Most people with a PGCE can find a teaching job. Work hard and you can be a head by early 30s.
Train drivers don’t even need a degree and are recruiting nationally. I know a chap who gave up a deputy headship to be a train driver for less stress and more money.
College of Policing site shows many police forces are recruiting.

You have to widen what you are prepared to do. Our cleaners are both professionally qualified in other fields but set up their business for more control and higher income. They employ about eight others and do most houses around here. They targeted a high income area to reduce costs and travel time.

@AtSea1979 "Have you any idea how many people are out there who have a degree and can’t get a job or a job relevant to their degree?" I'm going to get flamed for this but here goes, the people I know who have not gotten a related or good job with their degree haven't tried very hard, were the sort to think having a degree would equal walking straight into a job and that was it. They wanted to live in a specific area and won't move, or one won't learn to drive which limits her possibilities, another took a graduate job but basically has made no effort to diversify skills or step up somewhere else, just sitting still in one place that takes advantage and has no incentive to promote her. Others have had kids and said they look at their careers later. Most didn't think very hard about their career choice and did VERY little in way of experience/volunteering/career research while studying.

It's been 10 years since I graduated, I've had 5 jobs, each a step up from the last. 3 had commutes longer than an hour, I've had to study a post grad part time and I did a lot of volunteer work at university. I've lived in 3 different areas, and I've had a family. As cherry says there's always something out there, the military is a very good example, but you have to be willing to dig in.

And no it's not easy for everyone, it wasnt for me I had 2 kids by the time I was 26, but you can either get annoyed at the world around you, or get a piece of the action,

I actually agree with you 100% namby. I’ve been there myself leaving undergrad and going into a crappy unrelated NMW role. It was because I didn’t bother to think about what I could do with that degree beforehand, or spend any time researching roles and careers during the degree, and when I finished didn’t even consider moving cities. To be fair I had a very poorly mother I didn’t want to be too far from and she died soon after graduation. So of course I ended up basically back where I was pre degree. Meanwhile the friends who ended up with good careers actually put effort into finding what they could do, chose a degree based on a career path, applied for lots of roles and were willing to leave their comfort zones and move cities!

A degree is so commonplace now it’s not a key to a career handed to you on a plate. It can open doors but it’s up to you to knock on them, persuade others why you should be let in, and walk through them. It’s a lot of hard work and what you say is spot on.

namby. I’m with you. All of my sons friends who mainly graduated last have good jobs. Some have had to move from home town, some have jobs not directly related to their degrees and some have taken training posts.
Our daughter has a good job offer already for when she finishes her degree next summer - because she worked hard through her paid internship (which she sorted herself and isn’t via our networks).

I've never had a well paid job despite having a degree. I knew what I wanted to do but couldn't get a foot in the door at all. And I was never expecting to walk into a well paid job, but I did hope that I would work somewhere that offered training etc. Moving to a different area would almost undoubtedly have changed my life but my husband didn't want to move as his father was very seriously ill and he needed to take him to hospital appointments etc. His father's ill health has been ongoing for almost 20 years and in the meantime I have nursed my own father through illness until he died and now I'm doing the same for my mother. I'm likely to be well into my 50s before I actually have the freedom to up sticks and move. Lazy I am not.

If I had been the same person, born to younger healthier parents, married to a man with younger healthier parents we'd probably be living elsewhere looking down our noses at all those lazy people who couldn't be arsed moving as well.

Nothing is ever as black and white as it seems.

I think some of it stems from this generation too, the one Labour started to really push into university, were still quite often the first of their family to go to university. So our parents didn't really have the advice as to how to best utilise and as university was a bigger deal to that generation probably weren't expecting us to have the difficulties we had to get jobs, then the recession came.

Just hopping onto the thread with some info about the averages being used throughout.

£29.6k was the median average in 2017, for full time workers.

The latest full data set is the ASHE tables from 2017 which can be found here:

www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwork/earningsandworkinghours/datasets/annualsurveyofhoursandearningsasheguidetotables

Well, that's the guide and then you can download the full dataset to review in excel. They have information on average salaries for full and part time workers, male and female, different age groups and different occupations as well as different areas of the country.

I attach a snip of the full time gross annual wages dataset - showing the median (for full time) at 29.6k in 2017.

The mean (for full time) is much higher. Part time workers bring this down a chunk, but given we can't assess from the data set whether part time workers are part time through choice or through being unable to obtain more work and because the part time workers aren't presented annual using a pro rata wage, it's not terribly usable for comparison.

You can see here that 50% of full time workers earn more than £29.6k and 50% earn less.

The interquartile range is 21.2-41.7k, so half of people earn between those two sums. 25% of full time workers earn less than 21.2k, and 25% earn more than 41.7k. When you consider how variable average wages are across the UK it's quite plausible that some people will either know very few people earning more than the average or very few people earning less. It doesn't, however, change the median (for full time wages).

I think one could probably do something interesting with the hourly wage data from that dataset but I haven't had enough time recently to play with it to do any calculations - this will be especially key when you consider that anything >30 hours per week is considered full time. I don't believe the information above includes overtime payments though.

I am a specialist in a clinical role with 20 yrs experience. My role is in a very competitive field (even for entry level). When I am asked by peers what I do I am invariably told how they would love to do the same. I was fortunate to be able to take some measured risks as I progressed. I could do this because I live in an area with a low cost of living and I have a partner who has a 60k salary. This meant that I could afford additional certifications and courses that led to some interesting and challenging work. As a result I can solve problems that not many in my competitive field can. This is what makes me sought after. Measured risks, the means to take those measured risks and a judgement about what would be sought after in the near future. It is not an easy path. My role aside, a degree is never going to be enough if 50% of the population now have one. A graduate will need to acquire additional skills and or have personal qualities that make them attractive. It took me 6yrs + training, two postgraduate degrees and moving posts to improve my experience every 2-3yrs (not typical in my field) for 20yrs. I am currently on £56k. I don't think this reflects the expertise I have, nor the fact that I am at the brink of slowly developing an international profile. However it's fine for now. These things can take time to evolve and to asses the direction of a field and the opportunities. I tell my children that if they want a good income, they need to consider what problems need solving, and how many people are available to solve them. Choosing the problems that not many people can solve tends to make those people more employable. I was first generation with any qualifications. I was not taught how to navigate the world of work but I took some risks before having children. We were also fortunate not to have taken on lots of debt. This meant I could take risks that others may have found harder/impossible (eg working part time while re-training). It's not a matter if thinking 'what I need' or 'what I want'. Rather 'I am ready to take on something new, accept there will be discomfort and anxieties with any transition into the unknown. I will benefit from the growth I will gain and the sights I will have.' I am truly grateful for all the opportunities I have been given. I am open to new ones and I stay hopeful and curious about what's out there that I may have never considered. I have had some massive kicks in the face that have knocked me sideways and slowed me down. But such is life. Spend time with people who are spoitive about you and keep you hopeful.

Im 43, a senior nurse and on £37,000.

I was earning around £27k in 2002 as a lecturer (main scale).

I now earn £21k in the charity sector (I've taken some years out). Full time.

There are many, many people earning less than me.

I think we underestimate just how many people are on very low earnings with wages being propped up by Tax Credits.

I don't think people on this thread are underestimating how low some peoples earnings are buggerthebotox, there are a huge number of threads on MN from posters struggling on low income and the dreaded UC but the OP asked who was earning £29.5k and how, clearly with some disbelief, and a lot of people have responded saying what they do to earn that and more.

Like I said upthread most of the jobs mentioned here are fairly ordinary so while a person might not be able to just walk into a role paying that salary right out of school, they're not the preserve of some elite group of people.

I think namby hit the spot there. I think you need to be very good at selling yourself on the phone to get to interview stage and beyond. Be very flexible on where you get sent to for work... easier to do that when you are young with no commitments and think laterally. If you think your degree or qualifications only qualifies you to do x and nothing else, well then you've failed at first base. My degree in Chemistry has nothing to do with my any of my jobs in past 25 years. And applying for jobs is also a skill. Its not enough to send an email application and wait for a response. You need to be far more proactive now by calling the recruiter, making sure you are top of their minds and inbox, working your network for vacancies. You need to think and act laterally outside your little box, home, town.

That’s where I struggle. Selling myself. I’ve taken a wrong move in my job now. It’s given me lots of extra skilled but in a direction I don’t want to go and it’s hard working out where to go from here. I’m getting too old to keep dithering about not knowing which way to go.

Regardless of qualifications or experience. You do need to sell yourself and dont sell yourself short.

I am starting witha company who met me a year ago, but felt I was far too senior for that position, the package wasn't great.

They offered me a job again earlier this year. Again the package, wasnt good enough. I said no. I wanted to work for them. But wouldnt take a role or package that was beneath my worth.

This time they had another more senior role. Gave me a big uplift in wage, company car and let me work from home.

All because I sold myself so well at an interview over a year ago.

If I am honest I never had direction. I have worked. Always kept an eye out on jobs external and internal. If something sounded good, I Looked at skill sets then found a way to apply my skills to it. Then applied.

We have all made mistakes in jobs. That's life.

Do you want to use your degree your teaching qualifications? What interests you?

You can't plan too much. My current job as a job didn't even exist 5 years ago. I go into schools and tell them job titles of today did not even exist when I was at school so how are they supposed to know what they are going to be when they leave? That's not how it works. My dh gave 2 bits of advice which no person ever did. And sometimes, yes you need someone who has done it and been successfully to pass on great tips. First advice is ask for a big salary. If they laugh you know it's too much. You can always work down. Second is to apply for jobs beyond your comfort zone which usually has a bigger pay cheque attached to it. my dh has applied for jobs only 30% he knows he has qualified for but still got the job. This can't apply to all knowledge professions like law or medicine but many other areas outside, it could apply. My biggest jump in salary was from £60k to £130k at age 39 jumping from one company having only been there for 18months to another and thinking fuck it, let's try. And if I'm in the job..I can always leave or they let me go.

How did the £130k job work out?

How does earning that much affect your lifestyle?

Well I'm still in the job but there isn't a day that goes by that I think I want to quit. I moved from a technical role into sales hence the big salary jump. But the real dosh is in the sales commissions which I get on top. This kind of job is life changing which I have now realised as I'm on target to pay off my mortgages within my 40s.

Sales is hard. I make it sound easy but I needed to get through 7 interviews (yes I know it's normal now but the process is still hard isn't it?) as well as study extra for 6 weeks and sit an exam to be certified (in my own time and my own money). It was the certification which got me 'in'.

It affects my lifestyle as I am in a different EU country at least once every 2 weeks. I have no hesitation in commuting 4+ hours a day to various customer sites. I don't read Hello or OK magazine in my spare time, I read the FT. (I love Hello magazine is just that if I have spare time, I need to use it to equip me for my job as there isn't any other time to read). My role is full time 'work from home' but if I'm not out and about then I'm not doing my job as it is customer facing. It consumes me in that there isn't a 9 to 5,30pm as I work around my kids, home and I can be working till midday to get the job done. Then I'm out 6am to head to the airport. Hubby has an equally stressful job but we work it out between us, just and we make full use of wrap around care. My kids can be in school between 08:00 to 18:00.

My company pays for everything to make my job life as comfortable as possible i.e. nice restaurants, top hotels, coffees at Starbucks all paid for, all my commute fees paid etc etc.

HOWEVER the scrutiny, accountability in performance and standards for productivity is very high. There is no hiding and being average won't cut it. Everyone is an expert and very knowledgeable in their field. You need to aim above and beyond and to do this, I study. I study all the time to keep my game up. It's not for the faint hearted, the personalities I deal with can be aggressive and alpha-male. Our revenue QBRs is something off like Dragon's Den, like an interrogation. Is it worth it? I think so, like I keep telling myself, I can always leave. A no shit/fuck it attitude helps hugely.

I own a training provider and pay a decent tutor/assessor between £30k & £35k depending on experience and what quals they deliver.

My partner is on £31k a year whilst I work for the same company and on £23k a year.. neither of us have qualifications above a levels. We've both worked our way up through the company (insurance) since leaving colleague 5/6 years ago and we would of started on around £16k each