Manchester Uni for medicine - don’t want her to take a gap year!

[Cluelessatthisstuff]

DD didn’t get into her first choice - Oxford. Insurance was Manchester which is a very good RG university and I believe has the biggest medical department in UK. Daughter wants to resit a subject in the hope of getting an A* but I’m really uneasy about this, namely because all of her friends are going away for uni so she’ll be at home, alone and working part time in Costa coffee. I just don’t think she’ll be happy.

Does anyone have any experience with Manchester uni? Doesn’t have to be medicine specifically but anything that could help my DD? Thanks

“Vanity retake” is a very apt phrase.

I think it's too big of a risk. If she really wants to be a doctor she should take the place at Manchester.
Yes, she could resit and get A* and Oxford might give her place - then again they might not if they don't accept resits and even if they do, the second time round she might not get a place if there are other better candidates at interview.
Then you'd have the problem of her applying to other med schools in addition to Oxford. How is she going to explain why she has taken a year out to resit?
I don't know whether the universities would have the information that she had applied before and been offered a place and made the offer.
It doesn't look good either way - she's obviously disappointed if she had Oxford in her head but I'm sure once she got started at Manchester she would quickly forget about it.

There are only 4.6 percentage points between the top ranked uk Medical School and the bottom ranked one so it would be ridiculous to worry about rankings. Also because the courses are 5 years long a lower ranking might turn into a higher ranking well before you finish your course.

I get the lure of Oxford. I’d have loved to go their but you would think the desire to do medicine would outweigh any desire to go to Oxford.
I hope your daughter gets over her disappointment of not getting into Oxford and can start to look forward to going to Manchester. I think Manchester would be an amazing city to be a student in.
I know it’s a bit of a twee thing to say but Id be amazed if you daughter doesnt end up being glad that she didn’t make it into Oxford and thinking that Manchester is the best place ever.

OP I went to Manchester (not as a medic) 5 years ago.

Hand on hearts it's an amazing uni and was also my insurance so I was a bit unsure to begin with but I'm so glad for the way things worked out.

PP is right - there's a reason Manchester has true highest rate of student retainment. Everyone falls in love with the place and the campus is fantastic.

*there not their. (Sorry about other mistakes too)

Have Oxford actually agreed to take her if she resits and gets an A*?

If not, she would be taking a huge gamble with her current plan.

I haven't personal experience of Manchester Uni but have a couple of friends who studied there and enjoyed it (not medics).

As other medics have said, no one cares what Uni you went to once you have a degree. You are judged on your ability to do the job and how hardworking you are. There are many attributes needed to be a doctor and being academic is only one of them.
If she was aiming for a job in the city of corporate law then I suspect it would be worth resetting but having an Oxbridge degree won't make a difference in the NHS.

I’m a huge oxbridge fan - but in her shoes I would go to Manchester.

My son went to Manchester University (Neurosciences) for his first degree and loved it there. He has since completed his MA at Birmingham and is now 2nd year PhD at Edinburgh. (Sorry - boasting parent but I am so proud of him!)
Anyway - Manchester good!
Perhaps she could do postgrad at Oxford if she wants the Oxbridge experience?
A bird in the hand etc...

I did my MA at Manchester university and still live in the city five years later. Honestly, probably the best city in the country to be a student in. Very different student experience to Oxford I’m sure, but for me it’s definitely the better one.

Tell her to grab the place.
I am a doctor and when I applied (8 years ago) I applied to Manchester as my backup and loved the medical school. Ended up going elsewhere just because I liked the other Russell group uni better. During my foundation years I met loads of people who went to Manchester university for medicine, all loved it. I also graduated with merit from university (which helped in my specialty applications), if I’d gone to oxbridge I would never have graduated with merit!
Throughout high school my teachers kept trying to convince me to go to oxbridge but it didn’t suit my laid back personality (doesn’t sound like your daughter), and I loved excelling at the university I went to and I got my top choice specialty when I saw lots of oxbridge graduates not come close!

Also cautionary tale (from 8 years ago), girl from my high school in similar situation (except Cardiff instead of Manchester). Took a gap year and worked in a clinic abroad to gain experience as she wanted oxford (didn’t get interview previously) and rejected again from oxford and the other 3 universities (London), and Cardiff hadn’t let her defer. She did a further gap year before ending up at Liverpool (great university but not what she wanted).

In her position, I'd take the place at Manchester (not at all biased seeing as I'm Mancunian, but studying over border at Salford). If she takes a year out to redo A-levels in the hope of getting A* there's not guarantee of getting into Oxford. There's also no guarantee of a place at Manchester. There are certain courses at universities that there are more applicants than places. Medicine is always one. She's going to be up against the exact same number of people to get into the course next year. She's got in somewhere and, (being totally biased for a moment) it's a very good university with access to learning at some very good hospitals for placements.
As much as I joke about it, we're not a frozen, backwards wilderness up here (the rain aside).
Oxford are going to be picky. It could very well be the case that, she does resits, gets the A and loses out on the Oxford place to someone who got A first time round. Is she going to put Manchester as a fall back next time, or just rely on getting the grades for Oxford?

What @StillMedusa said

Once you are at medical school no-one care what your A levels are 2 minutes after arrival. Once you are qualified no-one cares where you went to Medical School.

This with massive shiny bells on!

And anyway Manchester is a fantastic university regardless.

(NTW no bias - I didn't study there!)

Give her a big well done for fantastic grades and a great offer, of course ultimately it's her choice but it would be such a shame for her to make a decision that could impact her opportunities longer term and risk her losing two places.

I don't think Oxford accepts grades for medicine, although it sounds harsh they are so oversubscribed that they don't need to.

Making a definite and irreversible decision on a hypothetical and unlikely outcome is so risky, hopefully she will feel differently ASAP when her initial disappointment re Oxford fades.

FWIW every single person I know who went to Oxford found the pressure crippling and it had a real impact on their overall wellbeing. I know this absolutely isn't the case for some people of course.

Good luck to her OP and well done for some fantastic grades and a great offer!

OP as the parent of young adults myself and been thoug hthe whole gap year/univerity thing I would say you need to step back.

Any student starting University needs to be motivated- more so for a gruelling course like medicine. Being pushed into a course she doesn't want to do and then dropping out would be a worse scenario than a gap year.

You need to let her talk the lead- be supporting and encourage her- whatever she chooses to do.

These are her decisions to make- not yours.

Science teacher helping kids I to medicine..... take the place at Manchester. It is an excellent universe and the student I know there are very happy. I would honestly not recommend Oxbridge to any of my students because I know how different it is to their own real lives. We have had students apply, visit for open days and quickly change their minds; it really isn't for everyone. Equally, from my own peers that did Oxbridge, 2 left early with mental health problems directly dye to the pressure. Also, I seriously doubt that a resit will be taken into consideration at Oxford as it rarely is anywhere for medicine.

Sorry that was meant to say:

I don't think Oxford accepts resit grades for medicine, although it sounds harsh they are so oversubscribed that they don't need to.

There is some fantastic advice on this thread - MN at its best - in your shoes I would let your DD read everything on here.

I'm a hospital consultant. I have absolutely no idea which medical school the majority of my colleagues graduated from. I have even less idea what they got in their A levels. It's definitely worth considering how much she wants to do medicine vs if she thinks Manchester is right for her, but really don't worry about grades or medical school reputation - genuinely no one cares.

Oxford are very acedemic, Manchester offer PBL (problem based learning). These are two very different styles of learning, even though you graduate with a degree. In Manchester, you're offered clinical placements from day 1, Oxford I believe is third or fourth year.

She needs to decide what style of learning would suit her best. Medicine is hard!

Also, a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush? Medicine is a long course, 5 years. Does she want to be 24 when she graduates? 23 is bad enough.

A side note, I went to Manchester Uni and loved it (not for medicine).

Isnt it better for when you go on placement to not be at Oxford? I remember my cousin and a friend telling me that you get ranked out of all the medical students in the country when you apply for your first jobs and if you’re at the bottom of Oxford you’re at the bottom of the ranking? Where’s if your middle to top at Manchester you end up middle to top in the ranking? Hopefully someone who actually knows what this is will come in to explain it.

As it is all the people I know who did medicine have been able to do what they want with it regardless of where they trained. Also, this is 10 years out of date but I was dissuaded from applying for medicine at Oxford as it was more ‘classroom based’ as it were. Just to show that ‘Oxford’ doesn’t always equal ‘best fit’.

Also I know a fair number of people who went to Oxbridge to do a variety of subjects and at least two of them had a significant breakdown from which one poor guy hasn’t recovered from in his late twenties. I can vouch for the pastoral care at Manchester which might be a good thing on a course like medicine. It’s hard enough as it is.

Reluctant to say this but I have noticed a lot of bad advice to try again for Oxford if she is heading for academia. DH is one of the UK's leading, highly cited medical academics and is a Manchester graduate. Nobody cares in Medicine.

Manchester was my insurance place and if I hadn’t got my first choice of medical school I would of happily gone there. Personally I had no interest in Oxford / Cambridge - but really wanted to be a doctor so would have gone anywhere.

I went to Manchester. It’s a fantastic university with world class facilities. The city is bursting with things to do to suit everyone, and people are down to earth, friendly and welcoming. Absolutely everyone loved it.

I think the first thing she needs to do is phone Oxford and discuss with them whether they would take a resit. I would assume it’s fairly unlikely they would but I would be interested to know so hope you come back to update OP!

I agree with the point upthread about the very different teaching styles at Oxford vs a PBL based course like Manchester. I believe research shows that PBL produces better doctors (not sure though criteria they measured). I know lots of medics who trained at Manchester and it’s a great university experience and a great city to work in too.

Only 40% of all applicants for medicine get in anywhere at all. It's massively over-subscribed so she's bound to be with an intelligent committed cohort wherever she goes. Oxford is very theoretical for medicine. I presume Manchester is more practical which could be better in the long run.

But if she is set on reapplying, she could.

It must be disappointing for your DD not to have got into Oxford, presumably she had a conditional offer so went through the rigmarole of the interview, etc? I’d urge you to sympathise with her on this, she must feel like her second choice is a bit of a let down in comparison. However it is a huge gamble to turn down a confirmed place in the hope of maybe getting into Oxford next year (do they accept resits? They may not. Do check this.)

A close friend of mine is a doctor who graduated from Oxford med school, she found it extremely hard and very high pressure. She had to retake a year, this is someone who is extremely academic and always got straight A’s/A*s throughout school. I agree with pp who said it makes no difference what med school you qualify from. She will not struggle to find a job!