Michael Buerk - Wtf is he thinking?

[Sparklfairy]

He never struck me as the type to come out with antagonistic Katie Hopkins-esque crap...

news.sky.com/story/michael-buerk-let-obese-people-die-early-to-save-nhs-money-11778620

There is a difference between causation and correlation.
One of the factors for example of why a fat person may have a higher mortality rate in cancer is because they are too intimidated to seek help because of poor treatment by healthcare professionals. There have been several studies to show this.

But that doesn't have anything to do with developing cancer in the first place, that is to do with late diagnosis.

@themmatricc how do you interpret it then? It literally says it in the abstract.

the point is there is only so much tax payers money the nhs can get so decisions have to be made by the nhs and is it fair that healthy tax paying people pay the nhs to fund people that abuse their body or would it be more fairer to have an insurance system that takes into account peoples lifestyle and the amount they need to pay for healthcare insurance

I read it the same way as @AngelasAshes and that he is saying to stop going on about obese people costing the NHS more. Headline was misleading clickbait.

The point is, Tory governments have deliberately under funded the NHS, to engineer this crisis, to sell it off to themselves and their pals. A well funded NHS wpuld function much better, and everyone would get the care they need. I pay my taxes, fat people pay their taxes, smokers, drinkers, vegans, disabled people... We all pay our taxes. That's what the NHS is for. Free at the point of delivery.

My obesity was caused by sleep apnea. youre obesity was caused by having a calorific surplus not losing weight was due to not burning more calories than you consumed. many people with sleep apnea are not obese all obese people are obese because to put it simply they ate to much and exercised to little

The overwhelming drive for energy was caused by my sleep apnea. The lack of energy to exercise was caused by my sleep apnea.

themmatricc - ''would it be more fairer to have an insurance system that takes into account peoples lifestyle and the amount they need to pay for healthcare insurance''.

Sounds good on paper - but what happens when poorer people can't pay their insurance? Do we really want a society where people can be ill and dying and we'll just shrug and say ''shoulda payed your insurance''? Surely the advancement of society includes striving to keep a decent social welfare organisation, not sliding back to the past where the rich are cared for and the poor just die?

It would be good if people discussed this issue with an open mind instead of getting offended. It is a serious health issue, and causes do need to be explored. Obesity doesn’t happen overnight.

In my wider friendship group, there is a person who is about 200kg, mid-fifties and can only walk a few steps at a time. She has gradually increased her weight over the years.

What concerns me is that her teenage daughters are on the same path. It’s a car crash waiting to happen. Just stop with the sugar and junk food. There is an element of choice/laziness in this particular scenario.

The NHS isn’t for healthy people.

How is that difficult for people to comprehend?

It’s not about who deserves treatment based on your judgement on their perceived lifestyle.

@Laiste I think the insurance system is the way it will go. Basic insurance\provision for everyone and then topped up as you want to. Premiums adjusted according to lifestyle as life insurance is. Dangerous sports, smoking, etc

I've worked in some third world countries and it is a 2 tier system. No matter how ill you are on presentation at the "nice\better outcome" hospital unless you have an insurance authorisation number for your current admission you are not getting in and can take your chances at the general hospital. General hospital not the best.

In my case (about 15 years ago) I was very ill with malaria and was only able to give the accountants name at the company. I was too ill to preauthorise. Had my ID with me. The company scheme was in their system and once admissions had spoken to the accountant at the company and got an authorisation code I was welcomed. But no way was getting in without it.

As an aside, for those who say everyone pays their taxes, not so.

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7326881/How-nearly-HALF-British-adults-pay-NO-income-tax-data-reveals-23-million-adults-exempt-PAYE.html

Personally, I think that we should keep government/NHS as a direct influence.

I am old enough to remember drink-driving being totally acceptable socially, but now it is totally unacceptable.

We need to, as communities, help people to eat less and exercise more, and set high expectations. Stop the treats at work, for example, and have fruit instead.

Of course, the NHS can pick up those who struggle with weight due to medical issues.

One of my friends is overweight....she also runs marathons and could give gobby Michael a run for his money

I'm sick of this stuff being trotted out in a bid to try and prove fat doesn't equal unfit. There are countless fat and obese people who can jog around a marathon course, slowly. But the truth of the matter is, they'd be much faster and fitter if they lost weight.
Go to any Parkrun in any park at 9am on a Saturday. There are people of all shapes and sizes and ages running, which is absolutely brilliant. But it's not by sheer blooming coincidence that the first finishers are slim and fit, and the fat people are finishing last, is it.

Correction: keep away from the government ...

As an aside, for those who say everyone pays their taxes, not so. income tax is 1 of many taxes we pay including vat which every single person in this country pays

coconut in response to your comment on my post of COURSE I realise obesity is an issue. BUT I know plenty of people who are fit and healthy as well as being overweight.

I can’t stand lazy thinking and “fat and lazy” is the epitome of poor thinking and gives stupid people the idea that they have a god given right to insult others.

What I am saying is you cannot tar everyone with the same brush which is EXACTLY what Burkface was doing with his comment.

Yeah, but not much compared to income tax. A non-smoking poor person will have most of their expenditure zero-rated or low-rated for VAT (eg food, Children’s clothes).

And who fucking cares Runningonempty? What’s your actual point here?

Do you think these Parkrunners should perhaps stay home and not bother themselves in trying to get fitter and lose weight?

Still at least it allows you to look and judge eh?

I Parkrun....I am still overweight but I tell you I am faster than when I first started and slimmer too. But you’d still look and judge because I am not stick thin ...well fuck you and anyone else who is like that, I’ve made progress and I do t hav to justify that to anyone else.

I am old enough to remember drink-driving being totally acceptable socially, but now it is totally unacceptable

Yep Totally comparable Its well known that you are at risk of killing and/or maiming someone else when you get behind the wheel while under the influence of a Krispy Kreme.

I cant help noticing no one ever brings up the weed smokers on NHS threads Gosh could that be because there are so many on this site that support this activity.

Much more dangerous to get behind the wheel while high which would be a fairer comparison but instead of comparing drink with weed or other drugs you pick food. Very telling.

Hey how about the NHS refuse treatment to someone who has a psychotic break after overdoing the weed. Sound fair? Their choice right!

how about we also refuse treatment to anyone who has had a Botox or lip filler treatment go wrong. Their choice to have it done.

Michael Buerk has always had an issue with over consumption.

I can remember the disgust he displayed on "I'm a Cleb, get me out of here", when people complained about food.

But i always thought that was because he did cover the Ethiopia Fanine and others, as well as different crisises. Ypu get compassion fatigue for people in the Western World.

"So the consensus is that obesity is similar to alcoholism"

We've just had this debate on my slimming forum on FB (Exante, I'm obese).

Most of us agreed that it is. I see the rants on FB when people who are in constant joint pain, qre told it's either strong painkillers or lose weight. I could go into other scenarios.

I know someone whise been told that unless they stop smoking they can't have vein surgery. Theyll have to wait for the stroke that's going to happen.

I've had a relative die, young of kidney issues because of drug use. The Consultants wouldn't intervene because they would have been patching her up, to carry on killing herself and who should they knock off the list to do so?

The rationing of services is already happening.

The point, Helena, was that it was not the police who stopped drink-driving, but communities.

HelenaDove, i know a lot of people who've got out of MH Care because they are sick of the drug users getting such a large proportion of the resources.

Under the MH Act theres a clause about publuc protection, so for that reason MH Services aren't rationed in the same way as other sections.

But the care plan for an addict of any type, is different because of their addiction.

@themmatricc

A growing body of research is finding a link between sleep disorders and weight gain. And it can be a vicious cycle. Insufficient sleep can lead to weight gain, which can lead to a serious problem called sleep apnea, which produces more sleep deprivation and more packing on of the pounds.

There was a phone-in on the radio today. Vanessa was filling in for Jeremy Vine.

The vitriol for fat people was palpable.

I cannot understand the open hatred towards people who are fat.

I just cannot comprehend how someone could hate another person so much because of something that has absolutely zero impact on their own life.

"I cannot understand the open hatred towards people who are fat."

That's one of the things that i learned on here.

I've only been over weight/obese for three years and myself or none of my friends ever had an opinion on people who carried excess weight.

I find it baffling.