AIBU to be upset! GDPR and Childcare

[Silentnight2017]

Can someone clear something up for me.

I thought with permission of the parents of other children, or within 'legitimate' limits, your childcare setting can share photos/videos of your child which contain other children's faces from the same setting.

Since all this GDPR regulations, my childcare setting is very strict. Unless the faces of other children are obscured, they do not share pictures containing other children, which is fair if the other parents have not given permission.

They showed me an image during a meeting, which was really sweet as I had not seen my child be so animated about something. I asked them could they send it to me. Was fine at the time but a few days later said no, as it contained another child, facing the camera, albeit for a few seconds. I asked them could they ask the other child's parents permission to share it with me and said that I give permission for them to be shown my LO's image etc. Actually, I in fact do not mind if there share pictures when my LO is included in the photo etc - I personally think it is quite nice, as then you see the interaction etc. BUT of course, I understand that perhaps the other parent may have expressly said no.

A few days later, I asked whether they had asked the other parent about the video. They replied saying that they do not feel comfortable about sharing videos and so did not ask the other parent and has since deleted the videos and pictures from their phone and all the relevant and saved pictures are as uploaded on our shared portal.

I love the childcare setting and hey also looked after my older children. But am I being really unreasonable to feel quite upset about this??

I spoke to the GDPR last week and they said at the time that sharing should not be an issue as it was within 'legitimate' boundaries and it was within the right boundaries for me to ask for the child setting to ask the other parent for permission to share the file with me. And actually I had a right to the image and the child setting has a month to blur out the other child's face...if the other parents said no, we could blur out the face but to not even ask??

I am of course a bit confused by the whole thing as of course at school and clubs, we do sign something where we can say whether we give or do not give consent about pictures being share etc. Surely we can do the same here and of course, if the other parents do not consent, then faces etc can be blurred out?

You spoke to the ICO because your childcare setting has a policy not to share videos with other children in them and to delete them instead of spending their time blurring out footage for parents?

As plenty of people have pointed out, they can't always tell you why they can't/won't share images. Maybe there are looked after children in the setting. Maybe there are children who have had to move away from abusive family members. Maybe they don't want you going over to the other parent and questioning them about why you can't have the footage and why they said 'no'. The setting isn't going to tell you any of that, a 'we can't because of our DP policy' response is therefore much more appropriate. Video footage is generally more difficult to blur out that photos too so by simply deleting it they're avoiding creating a rod for their own backs. They are doing the correct thing under data retention rules in deleting the video rather than just keeping it on file and not doing anything with it.

If parents get difficult about not being given copies then they'll just stop taking pics/videos. That would be a lot easier for them.

It depends on the setting. For DD we had to fill out numerous forms with regards to her image sharing and also naming her (no name, only initials, first name only etc).

We had recently an event at school and the school prohibits parents from taking photos as the school does and they then carefully check for children who shouldn't be on one, crop them and then publish them on the webite/fb/instagram. But that school has office staff, it's not the teachers doing it so unless the nursery has a large support staff around I think there is only so much they can do.

Even 10 years ago when DD was a nursery we never got photos where another child was identifiable, maybe the back of one but never the face.

I think unless it was a video of your child climbing Kilimanjaro or juggling 5 balls at once you have to let this one go

This childcare setting has misinterpreted GDPR and is being overly cautious in their policy.

A blanket request to share photos is normally acceptable and any people who want their child to be blurred out can be accommodated easily - the reality is few are bothered.

But every organisation has a right to have an over cautious policy and there is little you can do about it.

I’m a childminder. When a child starts at my setting they sign (or don’t sign) to say they are ok with their child being on photos that are shared with the other children’s families. It is really lovely for parents to see these photos, some of them never see their dc with dc of a similar age, playing together. It also makes my life easier as I’m not worrying when taking photos that someone is in the background that shouldn’t be on the photo. (But would obviously respect parents wishes if their was an issue about this).

Were there any members of staff in the video? Or their voices?

I have a creepy, stalky ex. As a result, any videos that happen to catch me were always deleted and my name was removed from the publicly accessible parts of the website. I wouldn't want a random parent to be told 'well, we would, but Mitzi's ex has already tried to track her down and the last time her details were put on the website, we found him skulking around the carpark after dark asking if she worked here, so if you put this on FB or forward it to your mum, sister, sister's friend, etc, etc, there's no way of knowing whether he'll see it and be waiting for her at the end of a school show when it's dark and the cameras can't pick up anything'.

I'd far rather they just said 'sorry, no'.

Even if there's one or two looked after children in the setting who weren't in the original photo, I imagine it would be easier all round to have a blanket ban. Personally, I would prefer a reason like the above rather than 'GDPR', but then I guess some parents would keep pushing to know who the LAC were, for example (not you OP, just speculating).

I understand if the other parent said no, but the child care setting stated that they didn't even ask and have now deleted the video.

Which is their prerogative since they own the Copyright. Seriously, just let it go.

It is ok - I have let it go...but am confused that's all about all of this. Some settings say it is fine, some not. Even in this thread. Like someone else said, it depends on the actual person running the setting I guess.

If the other person had given permission, then no blurring out necessary.

But I could be difficult, and say if the other parent not given permission, they have a month to blur out the face since I requested the video. This is the advice I got from the ICO. I called them up only to be clear on what the current laws are, as I am confused. I didn't call to complain or anything. Why does my older child's school share group photos, why do some care settings of my friend's settings share group photos, why do some not. I got a whole book of photos from my older children's days with the same setting, which has plenty of group shots especially around Christmas, Easter etc and just when they were playing. I totally respect and understand parents that say no! I say no to certain uploads of my children. It entirely depends on the setting, so I understand that completely.

Of course laws have changed.

I was not going to be difficult or complain. I love the setting. Yes I was abit upset as I thought it would be ok to get this particular file if the other parent consented. There are 3/4 parents in total. It wasn't just an image of my child playing, I was going to share it with my other half to discuss for developmental reasons, but of course, I will have to accept how it is.

Maybe they did ask the other parent who has very serious reasons for saying no but the childcare setting didn’t want to cause a problem. It’s actually not your business to know if that child’s parents consented or not.

You are really overreacting by calling the ICO over something so minor. Let it go. There’ll be other happy moments you have on video.

You have to get used to it I'm afraid.
Try having a gifted performer, the same rules apply, you end up missing so much, but it's the way of the word now.
Such a shame it has to be like that.

When (if) we leave the EU, will GDPR still apply in the UK? I don’t see what was so wrong with the system we had before personally.

@Schuyler, I didn't call to complain at all. I called just to see what the laws actually were.

I totally understand you didn’t phone to complain but even trying to find out is an overreaction. It’s a shame you don’t have a nice moment but that’s all it is. I’m sure there will be other nicer moments you will have. :)

At my childrens nursery we have a portal that is secure that we access.
They download pictures and written evidence of things they are doing/learnt and things that they need help with.
It's good communication between nursery and parent/carer esp if working and can not get the time to speak to the staff very often.
We get asked permission and they just keep the children that have not got permission out of pictures works very well.

@Dongdingdong Yes, it has been transposed into domestic law so will still apply. The law has actually changed very little, but there has been such publicity about the GDPR that it has become a big issue.

Maybe they did ask the parents and they said no but they didn’t wish for their decision to be shared with you in case of possible issues arising.

When (if) we leave the EU, will GDPR still apply in the UK? I don’t see what was so wrong with the system we had before personally.

Yes, it will.
Nothing much has changed from 'the system' we had before for most of us. Organisations and businesses that collect personal data must be much more transparent about why they are collecting it and what they will do with it.

When (if) we leave the EU, will GDPR still apply in the UK? I don’t see what was so wrong with the system we had before personally. Yes! Just as the rest of the world already has to be compliant if we are to use their services, it will make no difference, nor should it as it isn't really all that different from what went before.

As Shush said, all it really did, despite what many people think, is force orgnanisations to justify retaining any information on you!

I have loads of pictures of other children on Tapestry.. they seem a bit over the top but likewise, I think they've got better things to be doing than asking other parents to share photos/videos.

I have a little girl who attends a preschool setting, she is new to the group and if they wanted to share a photo/video with her in it I would have to say no but wouldn't want you to know why. I can understand it is sad for the other parent/carer but my first responsibility is to her.

Of course it will still apply. It is UK law and, if we want to do any international trade we will have to have data protection law in place to get what is called "adequacy" - which means we can continue to trade with the EU and have EU customers etc. So we should mirror what data protection there is in the EU.
Fun fact- we had data protection law in this country before the EU did back in 1984.

What you don't know (and they cannot tell you) is if that child cannot be shown for safeguarding reasons. When my kids were at primary school it was permitted to film the plays but not now because there's children in care, adopted kids who have past safeguarding issues and one family who objects to photographs on religious grounds (not sure what religious they are but they are from india), my friend is miffed because (big age gap) she still has kids there

Some settings say it is fine, some not. Even in this thread. Like someone else said, it depends on the actual person running the setting I guess. Of course it will be different everywhere depending on whether a setting has a vulnerable child that year, have had such and have made changes to policies for ease of use or have never had such an issue and can happily put up all pictures without thought.

It isn't odd. It just reflects the different lives we all live.

@Daffodils07 - yes we have a similar type of online portal which saves time from catching up at the end of the day etc.