To think there should be a ban or limitation on puppy breeding?

[ADropInTheOcean]

Maybe a complete ban would be a step too far, but honestly, with 10s of thousands of dogs in rescue centres, should people not really try their hardest to rehome one if they really want a dog? All breeds, ages, temperaments - all looking for a home and yet there are hundreds of back door breeders and puppy farms making thousands of pounds from inhumanly breeding fashionable dogs that quite often have health problems.

Some people are either too ignorant or stupid to do their research before buying a puppy. Maybe some people just want to bury their head in the sand because puppies are so cute right? They are also extremely hard work and will quite often find themselves in a rescue centre because someone didn't appreciate how much time they needed, or how much vet bills cost, or it snarled at their toddler so must be aggressive and has to be put to sleep.

Rescue centres are absolutely over run, while dogs are being held In horrible conditions and aggressively bred time and time again - and while people seem to be happy paying up to £1000 or more per puppy there will always be those going to exploit it.

Of course it's not just the dogs I mentioned above, any breed of dog worth a bob will be exploited.

If you really want a dog, do some research on different rescues and what they have to offer. Explore a breed or dare I say mongrel that you may have previously dismissed.

Having a dog in your life is one of the best things ever - but not at the detriment to other dogs so that humans can make some serious money.

You have to be registered now to sell puppies. Facebook have clamped down etc.

The problem is a lot of those in rescues have issues or are certain breed types. Then let’s also not forget the fact we are importing other countries strays.

No point in saying pick a different breed or mongrel as a responsible owner will of dine research into what breed will be best suited. Just grabbing any puppy or dog is what leads to dogs being dumped into rescues.

I agree. I think there should be limits on numbers of litters per year for breeders. Also to stop hoarding, in some US states pet owners are only allowed 4 cats or 4dogs. Not sure how it works if they want to keep 4 of each as hoarders usually do one or the other from what I can see. (either 20+ cats or dogs).

You can’t have ever tried to get a rescue dog for a home with children. It’s very difficult to get one - there is not the abundance you seem to think there is.

I wanted a wolfhound. I went to a breeder. It’s not that easy to rescue. If you have kids and cats and no dog already etc. I didn’t want certain breeds or mixes.
Puppy farmers should be stopped. BYB shouldn’t happen. But there will always be those who see these animals as a way to make a quick buck. Not sure what the answer is. But banning all breeding isn’t it.
And no. I won’t breed my dog. I haven’t the expertise, experience, support or facilities to do a really good job. So no pups here.

I have never had a dog from a register breeder but I have had pedigree cats and felt it was very well handled and professional.

I have taken cats from unintentional breeders ie people whose cats got pregnant accidentally and I have a rehomed dog from a relative. The dog is not pedigree but he was a specific mixed breed that does not shed hair (he doesn’t) but he is desirable looking and was expensive and I would never leave him tied up outside a shop I think he would be stolen

But agree with PP it is not always easy to get a pet from a shelter they have lots of rules. And sometimes people want something quite specific ie a small dog that doesn’t shed or a large dog for security or a working dog, and you cannot always get those at a shelter hence I think responsible breeding has its place. But puppy farms do not

DM also tried and failed to get a rescue dog. Despite being a retired but active homeowner with a reasonable disposable income and decades of experience of dog ownership, she failed all the local rescues eligibility criteria for reasons I don't understand.

But there are limits on breeding now. You have to be registed unless you are very small scale (something like one litter a year or sales of £1k pa).

I don't know if the rules have changed for cats too, because I foster rescue cats and we've seen an increase in amateur breeders giving up their cats for rescue or dumping them over the last few months.

They either can't sell the kittens they breed, or no longer want the breeding parents. We've had a few stud tom cats, a big group of othe pure bred but unpapered cats, and there was an even bigger colony of either orientals or british shorthairs rescued by Cats Protection in the London area.

I got from a registered breeder as I knew what dog I wanted and the rescue centre if they had one wouldn't re home to me as I have two small children. I have 2 rescue dogs from before I had my children as well.

We had to have a certain breed due to allergies. These dogs are very very rarely up for reigning. Most small dogs up for resining are jrt which would set my allergies off and not overly keen any way.Very hard to rehome a dog with child under 8.

Why don’t you say stop people having kids there’s loads in care. It makes the same amount of sense.

It’s facebook that’s hampered kitten sales. Since Facebook now remove all pet for sale posts people cannot regime or sell them easily. Pets for homes locally anyway is mainly cats at over £200 each and same on pleloved. Gumtree now charge for pet adds so sales there have dropped too from those who have accidents. Kittens are now being dumped and abandoned in huge numbers locally all our rescues have closed their doors and the kittens are not shifting so the rescues are now getting onto not so cute 10week old kittens but much older ones

Rehoming not reigning. They’re happy to reign wherever they go

It's personal choice. Quite simply, I didn't want a rescue dog. I don't feel that I need to justify my decision any more than that, in all honesty. I'm a very responsible dog owner and did plenty of research. I chose a very responsible breeder who I'm still in touch with now.

By your logic, anyone who has a child is stupid and selfish as there's tens of thousands of children in the care system.

Sure..

You would reduce the numbers of responsibly bred dogs..

Reduce the gene pool of certain pedigree dogs to a dangerous level..

To work you would need serious punishment for those breaking the law and breeding during a ban or breeding without the required permissions... only really heavy fines or confiscation of the dogs would actually be a deterrant.

We do not have the infrastructure required for licencing breeding in this way, nor for policing it - the cost would be enormous adn it would only work if it was run by central government. Local government already have responsibility for licencing commercial breeders ... they do a DIRE job of this, hence the number of puppy farms.

The result would be that within a very short time we would..

Lose many pedgree breeds entirely.
Seriously damage the ones we don't lose.

More of the available dogs would be produced by illegal or disreputable breeders than they are now (and as it stands, they are the majority right now).

Temperament and health would be reduced even further than it is now, we would see a rise in dog attacks, heavy legislation on what dogs can do, a further knock on effect on behaviour as dogs are not permitted to be off lead, socialise, etc...

It is a horribly bad idea, all round.

Reputable, responsible breeders are NOT adding to the problem, the dogs they produce rarely end up in general rescue and when they do, many breeders try very hard to get them out (and many are thwarted by general rescues who refuse to interact with breed rescues!).

Good breeders ask that owners relinquish dogs back to them at any point if the new owner cannot keep them - for this reason you will rarely see breeds like deerhounds, GBGV, PBGV, Afghans, Borzois etc, in general rescue... yes those are rare breeds but they have healthy numbers... the breeders and breed clubs are like the fecking MAFIA... and they deal with their own 'mess' as it were.

Two things need to happen:

People need to stop buying on a whim - it is that demand that drives supply.

People need to see the value in a well bred, well raised puppy produced by a dedicated and ethical breeder.

It’s facebook that’s hampered kitten sales.

I can't believe I'm defending Facebook but I don't think they're in the wrong or to blame here. People shouldn't be letting their cats breed, full-stop. If more platforms refused to advertise them, perhaps the message would get through - have your cat spayed/castrated!

I understand that some cats need to beed to keep the cat population going, but we are a long, long way from there being a shortage of cats at the moment.

Some people will want to go to a responsible breeder and get a dog bred not to have common health problems. If you’re spending a lot of money on a dog over it’s 10-20 year lifespan, then I can see why you want to get the breed you want and a healthy dog.

Bring back the dog license.

Require that licenses only be issued on rescues, dogs from registered breeders or under a small breeder exemption.

Make it a criminal offence to have an unlicensed dog.

Also, to address dog bite injuries, require licenses to be supported by insurance policies and make dog bites a strict liabilty offence.

I think that more people should be encouraged to neuter/spay their animals to be honest. Not sure the best way to do it.

I got my pedigree dog from a fantastic breeder, waited months for him. I don’t want a rescue dog at this time . Why should I feel bad because other people are so stupid that they buy from unscrupulous breeders?

Its the puppy farms and imported strays that should be stopped imo.

If you get a dog of an established breed you have a lot more certainty about their temperament. I chose a purebred dog with the traits I desired and she hasn’t disappointed me. A pit bull/bull arab/cattledog/staffy mix from a rescue wasn’t going to suit us.
The majority of dogs in shelters where I live are accidental litters or adult dogs with behavioural issues I am not equipped to deal with.

Some people will want to go to a responsible breeder and get a dog bred not to have common health problems. If you’re spending a lot of money on a dog over it’s 10-20 year lifespan, then I can see why you want to get the breed you want and a healthy dog.
This.
People need to make the right choices for their family situation and not be guilt tripped by people telling them they are mortally awful if they don't have a rescue dog / those who have resucue dogs need to stop being so smug and evangelical about the whole thing.

I'd happily have more checks and balances on registered breeders and serious penalties for backyard puppy farmers, but spare me the moralizing about how people should have their pet choices dictated to them by what other people have chosen to put into rescue.

In the 2 years I actively searched and researched for a dog, not one matching my fairly broad criteria came up at dogs trust. I bought a dog from a reputable breeders and I'm a responsible dog owner. That's all there is to it.

Oh I wasn’t saying it’s a bad thing just that Facebook has helped cut it down but the sad side is this year that it’s one into force has filled our rescues with dumped pregnant queens and dumped cats with young kits as well as kittens once can’t be sold being set free into the streets.

My sister has been trying to find a rescue dog for 6 months now. It’s not that bloody easy as rescue homes invent more and more hurdles to jump through. She’s given up and is investigating Kennel Club-registered spaniel puppies.

But the spay/neuter message is everywhere. At the vets, a policy of all rescues, not spaying or neutering is akin to claiming to not know that smoking is dangerous. You'd have to be blind and quite stupid to not know that was best practice.

People probably let their cats breed because, ickle fluffy kittens, or because they thought they could make money out of it, but I agree that it appears that what seems like decades of 'get your pet neutered' advice has not got through, because if it had, cats would be virtually extinct by now and that is obviously far from the case

Woman at work knowingly bought a puppy from a puppy farm, around £1000.
To be fair when I asked advice on here relating to her as a tricky colleague I was shot down for being a snob.
I agree OP, but many won’t.

I agree with you OP.
Really angers me when people try to justify exploiting their dog by claiming they 'need to have at least 1 litter'.