AIBU to feel that the ‘Labour against Private Schools’ campaign is a scapegoat for a lack of vision for educational reform?

[BusyMum1978]

2500 UK independent schools with 615K children attending which is 7% of the population of children in FT education up to the age of 16. A number of articles published this week have highlighted the campaign supported by Labour MP’s, who are calling for a number of measures impacting Independent Schools including their complete abolishment, and for these schools to become part of the state school system. A real hatred seems to be forming, and it feels to me like an easy smoke screen to put up rather than the Labour Party providing very specific policies to show how state funded education will be reformed.

I completely understand the feeling behind the imminent appointment of our 20th Etonian PM - there is urgent reform required in politics to have equal representation which I wholeheartedly agree with. I also understand the recently published stats showing accelerated social mobility for those attending top independent schools. I am not saying that there aren’t areas for improvement- but is the objective to bring more children up, or to bring the independently educated 7% down to make it ‘fair’?

My children both attend a prep school, and they are the first generation in both mine and my husband’s family to do so. We aren’t rich, neither of us have a degree, we own one property. We have -and continue to- work hard and made a choice to invest in our children’s education. We know we are privileged to be able to do so. To hear that MP’s want to wage a ‘class war’ with a family like mine feels inflammatory and yet more decisiveness in an already fractured country.

My children started their education in a state primary school but quite honestly it wasn’t good enough, and our heads were turned by what the private sector had to offer.

It equally broke my heart and inspired me to read The Times article on The Willow in Broadwater Farm school. Schools like this desperately need funding and further support, as do a range of children’s services which were cut during austerity. However will abolishing independent schools help a school like this? Parents who have money will still gravitate to the best areas / schools, and get tutors etc. There are a large number of selective state secondary schools that require heavy tutoring to access.

We need to nurture brilliant young minds in this country, to plug the UK skills gap, and compete in a global market. The independent sector has a valuable role to play.

Progress and globalisation is happening at such a rate that it’s becoming a bit uncomfortable. Many jobs our children will do haven’t even been invented yet.

The independent schools could work more closely with the state sector, but it concerns me that this campaign is chasing an ideal, and if successful would just shift the problem elsewhere.

Who are Conservative, and prominently privately educate their children. See the point?

And you think abolishing private schools would alter that? Private tutors would simply take the place.

Naive.

sionnachbeag

Actually - just coming back to my earlier question (again apologies if you’ve answered but the thread is moving fast) did you get your first choice school for your children?

I have an acquaintance who was vociferously anti-private school whilst refusing to acknowledge her privilege of getting her first choice of outstanding primary in a leafy village.

6 years later, the school is in special measures and guess where her second child now goes...?

You didn't ask that question, you asked what the school was like and I responded.

"And you think abolishing private schools would alter that? Private tutors would simply take the place. "

I think you are naive if you think that most parents who could afford private schools could afford full time private tuition individually for their children.

But don't you actually get this. Tax cuts, trident, HS2 are all priorities because they want them to be ( and they get votes), education gets real terms cuts because it isn't a priority for them.

You didn't ask that question, you asked what the school was like and I responded

I asked in a subsequent post....

We didn't get first choice primary, but secondary we did.

Again, you are extrapolating your own, extremely rare experience, in order to justify your points.

My post of 9.14 - just done a quick search.

We didn't get first choice primary, but secondary we did

Again, you are extrapolating your own, extremely rare experience, in order to justify your points

No. I’m saying it’s terribly easy to want overhauls to the education system from a position of privilege. One that no-one is willing to acknowledge.

And you think abolishing private schools would alter that? Private tutors would simply take the place

There are disadvantages with home tutoring esp on the social skills front.

The point on your friend proves that we need to invest heavily into education but as long as the rich and powerful can hide behind Milfield etc the plebs will continue to get sub std schooling....

Do you think private schools sold off their sports fields for housing? Or a top private school is built on a former waste dump (as in scotland and making people ill)

To vbe fair you really would need to bus children around from the best house price areas to sink estates for their state secondary schooling and abolish all state grammars and religious schools too otherwise you don't really make much difference.

"I’m saying it’s terribly easy to want overhauls to the education system from a position of privilege. One that no-one is willing to acknowledge."

Except it isn't really a position of privilege is it. The privilege is sending your kids to the private school. Pretending that your position is common is a fallacy.

AS repeatedly said in my posts, I don't think this would work, nor is it policy. I have also said that the privileges that get private school students into top jobs would still exist, lots of the posts agree with me.

Except it isn't really a position of privilege is it

Really? Having your children educated in a good school when there are poor state schools isn’t a privilege? I think it is. We’re currently doing it - I am very aware that we are privileged

The privilege is sending your kids to the private school

I agreed. One doesn’t preclude the other

Pretending that your position is common is a fallacy

Please point out where I’ve done that?

I was once a fundraiser. It doesn't matter if paid people or volunteers do the actual donkey work - it takes significant amounts of time for a paid person to set it up and manage it. Without senior management on board it doesn't work. It relies on a few noble individuals usually. I know some state schools raise tens of thousands. I used to work for one (they had a fundraiser to co-ordinate). They are using that money to replace what the state no longer supplies. You cannot usually with volunteer effort raise the millions required to transform what is on offer or even to purchase the buildings currently in private and church ownership. Hence why govts of various stripes have held their noses and not tried to end religious and house price selection.

Ironically given this discussion my relative, a vicar, has essentially been able to purchase good quality education FOC for his DC by taking over relevant schools. Of course he's put lots of time and effort in but now anyone who wants to access good state education in that local area now has to use an evangelical Christian school.

The system is messed up!

"Having your children educated in a good school when there are poor state schools isn’t a privilege? "

A state school that I have worked with as a volunteer, raised funds for, sat as a parent governor for? I've contributed to the success of the school.

"Please point out where I’ve done that?"

You repeat your own situation all the time like its common, it isn't common. If anything else, most parents of private school children live in the catchment areas of good schools

A state school that I have worked with as a volunteer, raised funds for, sat as a parent governor for? I've contributed to the success of the school

So you don’t think getting your children into a good school is a privilege?

I mean I’m not surprised it’s the same old, same old on these threads.

You repeat your own situation all the time like its common, it isn't common

No. I’m giving MY reality. At least twice in response to questions directly asked of me. I never said it was common. It’s (even more to be fair) difficult to have any sort of sensible discussion if you don’t read the posts properly.

Why would it have to be full time private tuition?

"So you don’t think getting your children into a good school is a privilege?"

Yes, but in reality, the school is a lot better now than when DS1 first went their, when it was in the old ofsted parlance, "adequate".

You can harp on about "your reality" and yes, you have been let down by a system, if what you say is true. But this is not common, it isn't really a justification for the entire private system.

Also, I do know private educating parents who describe outstanding comps ( twice rated) as sink schools, so some people's perspective of what is a bad school isn't always accurate.

However, I want to reiterate, I do not back the abolition of private schools, and I certainly don't think it will stop those from well to do backgrounds from dominating many professions.

you really would need to bus children around from the best house price areas to sink estates for their state secondary schooling and abolish all state grammars and religious schools too

As I've said upthread, there have been successful experiments in France with mixing up catchment areas between rich and poor neighbourhoods in Paris, which have increased social mobility. Of course religion is banned in state schools anyway and grammars don't exist.

oh, and fwiw very few parents put their kids into the private sector as a result.

There are no guarantees, kids need love and support as well as A 's*

Jasjas your family gatherings must be tense occasions since you disapprove of private education and boarding and your brother’s children do both.
Re a privately educated person dying of a drug overdose, addiction affects people from all walks of life. There are drug addicts and alcoholics from state schools as well.

Parents that are interested and keen will campaign for greater funding, especially those who are in positions of influence

I think the assumptions that underlie this statement are breathtakingly patronising, little fox.

I agree. What can private school parents do that those with children at state school aren’t already doing? Why are private school parents so superior that they can turn around failing schools?

"What can private school parents do that those with children at state school aren’t already doing? Why are private school parents so superior that they can turn around failing schools?"

You don't think that there would be significant political pressure to improve state schools ( not that they are as bad as they are made out to be here anyway)?

You don't think that if the people who vote for and fund politicians have something as an interest it won't be addressed?

What can private school parents do that those with children at state school aren’t already doing?

Vote in legislation?

What can private school parents do that those with children at state school aren’t already doing?

Vote in legislation?

So every single politician who has children educates them privately?