to think this is sexism, when no-one asked women, yet women are negatively affected?

[TruthOnTrial]

I am trying to understand how rules in schools, gyms, public toilets and sports have been rewritten, negatively affecting women, without reference to women?

Does it even matter what women think? Does society not care?

Or am I just being incredibly naïve to expect to be asked about things that impact my life and possible risk for me and my DC?

Can you expand Dawg?

Can anyone confirm the second consultation and know how one can have their voices heard?

Thanks Dawg.

Your point is interesting OP because whilst women were consulted in theory, I would say barely anyone I know IRL had heard of the consultation. In most cases I think unless you frequented the FWR board here at the time or subscribed to newsletters from a women's organisation such as Fair Play for Women the consultation would have passed you by as it wasn't particularly well publicised.

I hadn't heard anything about decisions over every womans' spaces being so affected by the few.

Or about the inequality this might enforce on our competing sportswomen community.

Or all the other ramifications, like, and certainly not least, our vuknert communities of young children of both sexes and their DMs in many settings, like care, hospital, prisons and the rapes that have occurred as a direct result of the relaxing of the rule on women only.

*vulnerable

This is a key rule that only exists to protect women, and according to the equality act it's illegal?!

It is well documented that the government did not consult with women's groups before merrily deciding that the EA was something that other people needed to take note of. Now that they are, everything has slowed down. But plenty of organizations are acting as though the reforms yo the GRA have been passed, and are failing to do equality impact or risk assessments before getting rid of single sex spaces.

@MadameGazelleIsMyHomegirl I also don’t want her to compete in races against someone who is biologically male and therefore has all the physical and strength advantages that entails.

Thats unture actually - I cant link into Twitter on a work PC, its a blocked site, that guff has all beeen scientifically debunked.

Since 2004, 2008, 2012, 2016 so the last 4 summer olympics have had approx 910 medals issued

At the 2016 Rio Olympic Games there were 28 sports with 41 disciplines, and a total of 306 events. Therefore you would expect that there were 306 medal sets (gold/silver/bronze) to be awarded, a total of 918 medals

And approx 300 are given out each winter olympics - 2006, 2010, 2014, 2018.

Lets call that 4,000 medals for rough addition.

Do you know how many medal winners, since 2004 when trans genders have been allowed to compete, have won a medal?

None

www.bbc.co.uk/sport/46453958

Could you not join or even just read one of the 800 million others saying exactly the same thing? Or did you just fancy a wee bit of attention?

The OP asked a legitimate question? Why so immediately hostile, rude and confrontational?

Everywhere has gone gender neutral with zero consultation with women. So far urban outfitters changing room and my local swimming pool. Just seems a big shift to bring in without any notice or consultation with your customers / service users.

Of course it's sexism.

Apologies MyOpinion if I have read your post wrong but are you actually saying that a man does not have biological advantages over a woman in sport?!

I don't think someone who is biologically a male should be able to compete in women's sports or win awards intended for women.

But, other than that I don't care about the trans hysteria I hear about on here. My local pool has communal changing rooms with cubicles and it's fine. So I'm certainly not going to fret if I'm in a shop changing room with a 'man' in the next cubicle. I'm also of the view that very few sexual predators are going to go to the trouble of dressing up as a woman just so they can enter a 'woman only space' to attack a woman. Not when there are so many other opportunities to do that. I feel more at risk of that walking back late or night or sat on an empty train carriage etc.

I think for the vast majority of trans people, it must be a very difficult life to live and a choice to be made. Let's be honest, you can normally spot them from a mile off. No amount of make up and Laura Ashley really turns Arthur into Martha. It's a vulnerable potion to be in and I honestly don't think he majority who follow that lifestyle do so easily. I think ally couldn't give much of a damn about it and I think alot of the rantings on MN are designed to whip up hysteria over nothing. In reality it's a tiny % of the population.

Lets not conflate disorders of sex development (such as Caster’s case) with unambiguously male people competing in women’s sport, using women’s changing rooms, hospital wards etc.

Mumsnet HQ- can you not just have a "gender critical" board and banish all these threads to there please, while you're rearranging everything? I can't click on any feminist threads any more and now all this anti-trans stuff is leaking into every other topic.

In relation to the sport aspect..here's some shots from an article on women's sports by the BBC

It's not all about Olympic medals, it's about the glaringly obvious too.

Jesus, concern for changes to law which will impact women and children is not anti trans hysteria. If concerns are leaking beyond FWR boards (damn pesky women get everywhere) it means more sunlight is being cast on the issues.

The following prospects may not worry you -

Women and girls losing out on shortlist places to squeeze up for men,
Girls being pushed out of grass roots sports and losing scholarships to boys,
Women and girls being unable to object to personal care or intimate medical procedures being carried out by a man who thinks he's a woman
Figures for violent crimes by women suddenly rising due to the inclusion of those carried out by transwomen
Children and young adults being made to feel they have been born into the wrong sex body and encouraged and steered down a route of medical transition.

but they are many who are rightly worried about these. It's so so much more than changing rooms/loos (still valid concerns too). Whilst I support the right of transgender people to live a happy and peaceful life this should not be at the expense of women and girls.

Whilst I support the right of transgender people to live a happy and peaceful life this should not be at the expense of women and girls.

Yes. One should not be at high cost , risk and discrimination against the other.

If someone is indistinguishable from a person of their preferred gender, you won't know or care that they're in another cubicle in the changing room, and you will be in no more danger from them than you would be from anyone else using the facilities.

Are you really suggesting judging trans women for the quality of their appearance as a female? Do you actually think that when a more unsuccessfully female transed person access a female only space, some magical imposition of "authority" will come down from on high to prevent their use of these facilities?

Utter drivel, all of it.

If these threads bother you then don't reply to them. Just hit the back button and move on with your life.

The OP is whether it's reasonable for decisions to be made on women without their consultation.

Have any laws just appeared without it being long known that they were in the pipe-line? People have the opportunity to answer any consultations, write to their MPs, debate them on various platforms etc.

You might argue that there should have been more advertising but that is not the same as just overnight imposing a law 'without reference' to the people it affects.