I earn more, he has more disposable income, how to split bills fairly?

[questionzzz]

I am a single mom of two active, hungry teens, dad buggered off to a different country, no support there. I pay for everything, mortgage, taxes, house and car repairs, food and clothes, summer camps and clubs, the whole nine yards.

Boyfriend of 8 months and counting does not even have a house plant to care for (story for another thread, as it is becoming a source of frustration for me as we are becoming more "serious"). As far as I can tell, once he pays his (minimal compared to mine) bills, including savings, the rest goes on fun stuff.

I am pretty sure I outearn him (not sure by how much though)- if only because I work steadily 50+ hours a week (I have to!), a full time job and smaller contract / casual work which has been luckily pretty regular. He works 32.50 hours a week which as mentioned is more than enough for his bills,savings and fun. He has a fairly minimalist lifestyle anyway (eg, he only eats cheese and pickle sandwiches at home, or picks up food from cafes etc). He deliberately keeps his work hours low because that's the way he likes it.

So the question for this thread: What is a fair way to split bills when we are out and about? At the beginning, I would make a point of paying my own, but I've become a bit more relaxed about it, especially as we see more of each other and becoming closer, and it does feel a bit weird to bark "separate bills" at the server every time when we are clearly a couple. We might go out once every fortnight or so, but these things add up, right?
We've been away on overnight trips a few times, and he insists he pays because I told him I can't afford it, well I can, it's just that it doesn't feel right for me to spend money on this stuff when my kids and household are my priority.
But then I would calculate in my head what my share (accomodation +meals) would be and send him the cash anyway.
The last couple of times we went out (once at his insistence, once with my colleagues) he picked up the bill but then made some comment about how expensive it was. I offered to pay my share but he refused, but maybe I should insist more? (it wasn't hugely expensive Michelin by the way, like the other thread! just like normal food).

This is by no means my biggest problem of the day, but maybe if the collective wisdom of Mumsnet can help me think through this clearly, I'll sort out the bigger stuff too :)

If you can't afford something, or you wouldn't normally do it without him, and he wants you to do it, he pays.

Anything you might normally do anyway, split 50/50.

It seems too early to do anything but 50:50

Been together only 8 months. 50:50 is the only fair way.

Yeah that's kinda my inclination too, although it's a kind of guesstimate at this point, becaue unless you specify "split bills", servers just tend to bring him the bill (funny how that is still the default), and sometimes I almost feel judged for saying that (ah, yes, we have a feminazi here, stubbornly refusing to be paid for by her man like normal women)
(this is not my paranoid critical imagination by the way, a friend actually "jokingly" told us off one evening for not letting him pay the bill and paying my own (that is so un-romantic blah blah blah)

You are dating. Whoever does the inviting should choose events/venues they're willing to pay for entirely.

8 months in and not living together then 50/50

I would pay sometimes and him others. If it was even I'd alternate but it's not. This will be a problem if you live together but let him pay if he wants to and you can't. Cook him the odd dinner is worth a bit

50:50 at this point. Although if one person can't afford something and the other one wants to treat then I would say that's fine too.

I'd say 50:50 too at this point.

@pettycontractor I think we're past the "inviting" stage, more like "ugh I'm starving let's get a bite to eat/ drinks on Friday etc" stage.

When he insisted on a slightly fancier, pre-planned night out for a mildly special occasion, and chose the venue, I let him pay for all of it, didn't even offer.

Why do you need separate bills in a restaurant when it's just the two of you? Either one of you would just transfer over your share of the meal surely? That's weird.

As other posters have said I think you have it right for 8 months in.

Turn about for meals cinema etc. 50/50 for nights away

In the early days, my DH and I just took turns. He’d buy drinks then we’d go to a restaurant and I’d pay for dinner. Next week, I’d be the one closing the bar tab etc. At the cinema, one would buy the tickets while the other would get the food.

Actually, come to think of it, while we do have joint accounts now we tend to pay for dinners etc out of our personal spends.

Swings and roundabouts. Some times you’re paying for sandwiches, then other times it’s a three course meal. Works out roughly 50/50.

For regular, non special meals out I'd just take it in turns paying rather than pay half each there and then.

@Missingstreetlife "This wil be a problem if you live together..." I know :( That's why I'm a bit cautious about the whole thing. He says he's committed, in it for the long-term blah blah, but I feel our whole lifestyles, including our approaches to work and money, are too dissimilar.

@MyCatHates How is asking for separate bills weird in a general social context? That's what we normally do when out with friends, surely? When out with regular friends is "split bills please" all the way. It only becomes weird when you're clearly with a romantic partner.

Well yes, because they're your romantic partner.

Around the 8 month mark I guess you're wondering if this has long term potential, and perhaps the date bill issue is a tangible way of grappling with what could be a big problem if you get serious about this man: You have really really difficult attitudes to money and to work. You have a family which takes priority, he is used to pleasing himself and prioritising fun. The fact that he hasn't twigged 'hey OP must have much less disposable income and spare time than me, perhaps it would be nice to treat her more often' would make me wonder if he was as kind, generous and thoughtful as I would want a man I'm in a long term relationship to be.

Have you talked much about the future?

Turn about for meals cinema etc. 50/50 for nights away
This ^^.
We've been away on overnight trips a few times, and he insists he pays because I told him I can't afford it, well I can, it's just that it doesn't feel right for me to spend money on this stuff when my kids and household are my priority.
Surely at this point you decline - you're lying to him so he pays. It may not feel right to spend money on a trip instead of your kids but it's far worse surely to lie to someone?

My me and my OH still pay 50:50 pretty much but have never asked for split bills, that's just weird to me. One will pay and the other will give their half to the person who has paid. Split bills when in groups with mates yes but not if there are just two of you.

Even if going out and staying overnight somewhere, it's usually 'well I have paid for the hotel and train so you owe me X amount' and he will transfer it to my account.

@WishingILivedOnAnIsland Thank you for the thoughtful response and yes I think you have described where I am perfectly.

He does offer to pay, I am the one insists (well, more at the beginning) to pay my share, or to send him cash later to cover my share.

We talk about the future somewhat, he is all "yes you are the woman for me, this great, I don't want to be with anybody else, I'm in it for the long term" I'm more like, "well, let's think about this".

i haven't introduced him to my kids yet, and I don't really want to. I do see him as "fun", although I am starting to care for him. I mean, I'm not made of stone! When a nice guy is showing me affection and attention, I can't help but reciprocate. He is actually very sweet and kind. When I'm with him, it's all flowers and unicorns, but when I'm not, I'm like is this really a good idea?

I'm gonna send him some cash now to cover my bill for last night, ugh, another chore.

@FriarTuck oh I don't lie- I say to him exactly what I typed up there: yes, I do have the money, no, it doesn't mean I want to spend it on a romantic overnight. That is what i mean when i say I can't afford it.

@HilaryBriss yes, come to think of it, that's how we used to do it with my "real" ex- the father of my kids through 18 years of marriage. He would always pay upfront, because of masculinity and his penis might have dropped off otherwise, but then i would transfer some cash to him. For family trips and things, we would discuss like enlightened partners: I will pay for the flights, you will pay for whatver and it would work out roughly even.
It didn't end well, though not because of finances.

You split them 50/50 and you pay for your your own DS's on top of that.

If he wants more money after that then he can up his hours.

Why would you want to date a man that only eats cheese and pickle sandwiches at home and only wants to work 30hrs a week.

Not exactly the stuff retirement dreams are made of, is it?

I'd run for the hills and find someone much more appealing OP as you don't even seem to like him much beyond the fact that he's conviniently there.