'Band 3' NHS

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Genuine AIBU. Name changed.

I'm in an NHS post paid at a band 3, I work with band 4s, 5s and 6s.

I've been in the post 18 months and a couple of things are bothering me.

1- being referred to as a band 3. I mean my work title is support worker but many colleagues would say, 'a band 3 could do that' or band 3 this or band 3 that.

AIBU to expect people to just say support worker instead of referring to me as a pay grade?

Obviously no one should be introduced to patients by their role it’s meaningless jargon to a patient!

But to say ‘that’s a job for the band 6’ or ‘it needs authorising by a 7’ or having a ‘band 2 training day’ or a ‘band 3 support worker meeting’ or a band 5 rotation is surely not offensive?!

(Unless you have a massive chip on your shoulder regarding your band!)

Is it maybe to distinguish between a Band 2 and a Band 3 support worker? In my area they have the same title of Clinical Support Worker, but obviously a Band 3 has additional training and responsibilities.

It depends on the way things are said, I think. If its 'Can a band 3 do the ECG in bed 2?' I think that's ok. Its not referring to you personally but just can someone in your role do the task, as maybe a band 2 could not?

If its referring to you personally as 'the band 3', that's rude. 'Get the band 3 to do it' comes across as not remembering your name, or not thinking of you as a person.

It's a weird quirk in the NHS isn't it? Shorthand for "the person on £25,000 a year" when you think about. But I do agree with other posters that sometimes it's about responsibilities, so maybe not always meant in a negative way, but rather guiding people not to ask people to do above and beyond their job description.

We make up a team of 12 people, there is me and another colleague at 'band 3'.
We are all very pally with each other. We have a office, we all have meetings in the morning, we all know each other very well.

I agree in some respects it needs to be used but, they all know our names and what banding we all sit on. So instead of saying 'Lucy's in tomorrow', she can do that. It will be 'A band 3 is in tomorrow' they can do that.

Like I said before it never happened in my previous job, it's just this one. That's why I wasn't sure if it was the norm or not.

It's fair to say, some people agree, some people don't.

It’s just used in place of job titles, as it’s a quick shorthand for seniority and/or things you are or aren’t allowed to do. I think it’s happens a lot more often to distinguish between band 3 and band 5/6 posts because the latter are usually nursing posts and contribute toward ratios, with the former being support worker posts, so by saying band 3 it’s essentially a quick shorthand for non-nursing post.

I think a lot of you are missing the point the OP is making. Referring to different banding when asking someone to complete specific tasks relating to band/job role is fine. But to constantly refer to people as band 2's or band 3's with no context is rude and it is used in a derogatory way over and over again. And that is what I interpret from the OP's post. It's also something I myself experience everyday. 'They're only a band 2/3' is something I hear very regularly at work.** Its unnecessary.

There is a very biased hierarchy within the nhs and it has been that way since my mum was a nurse in the 70's. It won't ever change unfortunately.

I work for n the NHS and hear people being referred to as “the band 2” or “the band 3”. Now that is derogatory. That person has a name.

There is a very biased hierarchy within the nhs

What do you mean by this? To some extent it’s always necessary. The shift leaders, matrons etc are responsible for what is going on on their ward. They carry the can if something goes wrong and they are responsible for making decisions. So it’s appropriate that there’s a hierarchy, they are in charge and their decisions are respected. Their training and experience got them to their role, and a band 7 has more experience than a band 3. It doesn’t mean anyone’s work is less valid, but it does mean that some people are in charge.

I'm a 'Band 3' too.

And at my workplace people also refer to people via their bands. We are a small team who cover the whole of Wales (20 people). Only myself and one other colleague are Band 3's.

Sometimes I do feel like I'm slightly being taken the piss out of (in a sense of, we're better than her) but then on the other hand I'm kind of like, well they have been to uni etc for years and years and deserve their 8+ band roles so I guess they are better than me. Makes more business sense money wise to get the lesser banded employees to do to smaller things as it technically costs less (wage wise)

I was a b3 then a b4 and the treatment was immediately different. It is odd.

I’m a band 3 admin but I’m resigning already, only been in post a couple of weeks. Constantly talked down to and patronised. I’ve had completely different and well paid jobs before. But generally just looked down on in this job!

This is a really engrained thing in the NHS. I was a 5 and people would do it to me all the time and we talk about people in groups of bands

I’ve left the NHS and this doesn’t happen where I am now

It's how the nhs works.

I was a band 2 and doing extra bank work as a hca during my medical degree. It felt amazing to walk back on to certain wards as the doctor on call. Jaw dropping after belittling me before.

Ignore the use of bands, and find a ward or department that appreciates you for you.

I think there’s a clear divide between clinical and admin NHS staff- to a certain degree it is warranted as obviously the clinical staff have a higher standard of education (etc), however admin staff shouldn’t be put down or have to face derogatory comments at work!

I’m a Band 2! Very happy to be called as such.

Cheby - banding has nothing to do with experience. You could be a band 3 for 20 years and have infinitely more experience than a band 7 who's been in the role for 6 months! Training and qualifications don't amount to experience. You've taken one word out of my post and ignored the rest. I said biased hierarchy. A lot (not all) higher banded workers treat the lower bands very badly. It's quite obvious that's what I was referring to. Not that the higher bands have more responsibility! The hierarchy you referred to is necessary. What the OP, I and other PP refer to isn't!

I’m a band 3 support worker too and really don’t have an issue with this. To suggest saying a support worker could do this instead of a band 3 could do this could well cause confusion with the band 2&3 support workers. My job role is very different to that of someone of band 2 level.
My colleagues would always refer to me using my name though they’d never shout band 3 can you do this

Totally agree with you @PolkaDotHoneyPot!

Just for reference I do not work on a hospital ward either.

Just to clarify one more time, it's fine to use in some instances but when my colleagues know my name, know me personally very well etc say things like OH THE BAND 3 CAN DO THAT, instead of saying Lucy can do that. I find it derogatory.

On my team we all know our jobs very well, we all know who is in what band, we don't need reminding.

When the rota is done- The manager will say 'Lucy can you cover next Friday there isn't a band 3 in'- THIS IS FINE!! I know band 3 needs to be used in wording like this. I'm not arguing that.

Someone at work asked me if I’d always been a med sec and looked at me askance when I cheerfully explained what I used to do. Obviously I didn’t say I used to earn twice as much. They were shocked too when I said I had a degree and was thinking about doing a PGCE.

There is nothing wrong with being a band 2 or 3 or whatever. But they are often looked down on and belittled. It’s not the right environment for me. I realise that millions of people have degrees and that I’m not special in that regard but I am well educated and reasonably intelligent and a little tired in being talked down to.

I was in a multidisciplinary team meeting recently and one of the consultants had asked me to attend to tell them about a patient. They completely ignored me when I tried to make my point and talked over me!

YANBU.

I work alongside NHS trusts (a partner for our activities). I went to a meeting with the person who manages all of our contracts and lost count of the number of times she mentioned her grade to me (8d) and gleefully pointed out her team members by grade (5,6 etc). I found it very odd and an odd organisational ethic.

It's pretty normal in the NHS and not meant in a derogatory way, many people have explained why however to introduce anyone as the Band 2 is outrageously rude. I work in corporate services and have never heard anyone introduced that way, maybe different in clinical services though

I'm new in NHS but would also say it's normal for NHS.
My old employer had scientists & admin people.
The admin people would talk about admin bands but never did the scientists talk about selves as bands.
I find it weird but not insulting.
It has to do with level of responsibility too, knowing where the buck stops and what is unreasonable to ask people to do (if unfair b/c above their pay grade)..

Listening to someone talk about their "demand and capacity" tool recently, I can see why OP gets the "we need a band 3!" comments.

-From a Band 7 who regularly loads & empties the office dishwasher.

It's an NHS thing. To me it seems like you are being over sensitive. It's not as if they are calling you band 3, rather than your name.

Good point @RoomOfRequirement in places l have worked then for support workers the phrase band 3's are used. To differentiate from band 2's, as band 3's are deemed to be more experienced and do the more high risk / responsible tasks

Yeah this @Cheby someone has to take charge and when / if it all goes wrong then the buck stops with them. People often forget this though!

It's not as if they are calling you band 3, rather than your name.

The OP has explained several times that is exactly what is happening