Biometrics for school lunches

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We received a letter last week from my DC's primary school saying the children will have to have their fingerprints / biometrics recorded as part of the school payments process. They already have a payment app where we make payments such as school lunches, music lessons, trips etc

I thought - I would not be consenting for my children's biometrics to be collected. Today, I rang the school for clarification and they said they will not be able to buy ANY school lunches or any trips without biometrics. Sounds like something from a dystopian fiction.

Am I being unreasonable to think this is a little OTT? Fingerprints are such a powerful means of identification that really shouldn't be in the hands of just anyone. I'm happy for biometrics to be scanned at airports and security agencies or to keep people safe. This, however, is some random company, collecting and storing their fingerprints.

It's not space camp; it's school lunches!

AIBU? Please share your thoughts and the consequences if you declined to give consent.

On a different subject, we've had biometric fingerprints taken when we've travelled to the USA on holiday. I think that's standard now.

It’s nothing Apple and Android enabled phones don’t already do.

It really doesn’t bother me, but then I think everyone should have a dna sample collected at birth in order to solve more criminal cases when they occur.

the school couldn't explain what would be done with the information satisfactorily.

That's against the GDPR legislation. Schools must comply with the law and will destroy the data once it's no longer required.

I wouldn’t be happy with it either, they would need to provide an alternative means for my child to pay because I wouldn’t be giving consent.

They don't "need" to at all. If you don't comply, then the child can't have school meals. Simples.

They don't "need" to at all. If you don't comply, then the child can't have school meals. Simples.

Exactly. They might decide to offer an alternative out of goodwill, but they certainly don’t ‘need’ to. Why spend the time and money running a parallel system for this function when the vast majority of parents will be fine with it?

The alternative would be supplying them with packed lunches.

It really doesn’t bother me, but then I think everyone should have a dna sample collected at birth in order to solve more criminal cases when they occur.

Same here.

It really doesn’t bother me, but then I think everyone should have a dna sample collected at birth in order to solve more criminal cases when they occur.

Yeah, same. I see why some people have concerns regarding that, as you don’t always know the government is going to be stable or trustworthy or not use the info for nefarious purposes. But personally I think the way things are atm it’s worth it to be able to solve more crimes for victims and their families. I tend to ascribe to the ‘if you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to fear’ mentality, including things like phone calls being listened into. If it helps to prevent terrorist attacks and crimes.

My DH works in IT security for a private security firm (basically goes out to customers to assess and advise on fixing cyber security issues if found).

I ran this past him and asked if we'd consent.

He just about pissed himself laughing and said "over his dead body'. Ended up in a rant about private corps storing personally identifiable information, how bad some of the educational industry clients he's been on projects with - basic years old security breaches and suchlike.

So, no, alternatives must be provided and I'd look into them Op.

If my DH wouldn't touch this with a bargepole, I'm not going to trust whatever the school says over his expertise!

I think in years to come we will be wondering why we so freely gave away our privacy, our biometrics and why we allowed our fingerprints to be turned into code.

We've already been doing it for years - secondary schools were doing this 15/16 years ago - it's not new.

What do you think anyone is going to do with a random set of letters/number connected to your child's name?

So, no, alternatives must be provided

Yep, the alternative is you provide lunch for your child.

I’m a deeply paranoid person, don’t like Facebook, wary of lots of stuff.

Wouldn’t have the slightest issue with this, it’s no more of a security concern than using the app you’ve referred to.

Out of interest how do you plan to travel in and out of developed countries without using your fingerprint data? Do you also refuse to use the eye scanning technology in most airports?

If they were actually storing the fingerprint, then I think it would be reasonable to be concerned.

But scanning a fingerprint and turning it into a long string of characters? And storing them?

You would need to take the character listing, somehow reverse engineer the algorithm (you'd have to hack the source code for that too), which will still only give you a few points on a fingerprint. You can't re-engineer the whole fingerprint. Then what?

It really doesn’t bother me, but then I think everyone should have a dna sample collected at birth in order to solve more criminal cases when they occur.
I find this an absolutely terrifying attitude, or to use the current cliche, chilling.

People are happy to let facebook / alexa / siri / apple have loads of information

Some people might but not everyone.

I don’t enter my name or anything about me on MN

Even have a separate email.

If I have to fill out a form on line then it would depend on what it was for before I would enter my true name and address etc.
I even have an Internet birthday.

I certainly wouldn’t let a school have access to anything but the bare minimum.

Whilst the law might say one thing at the moment who is to say what could happen in the future.

I don’t even go on ancestry websites because I don’t think they are a completely private web sites.

I sent ds in with a packed lunch when he started at his senior school because I didn’t want him having his fingerprint taken.

I wrote in to say that I was refusing permission.

They took his fingerprint anyway despite his protestations.

If they can go against my wishes they to me will do anything.
I don’t believe a word schools say.

I might be paranoid but paranoia has kept my family alive.

My kids' school uses this system.

It works really well. No lost money or cards and easy to top up online.

We had a really useful introductory leaflet explaining how it works and addressing concerns similar to those you have raised. Have you had a leaflet from your school yet?

I tend to ascribe to the ‘if you have nothing to hide then you have nothing to fear’ mentality,
That is a stupid saying.

EVERYONE has something to hide - and it's not necessarily bad.

YABU. I teach at 3 different schools and they all use this system. Also for the library. I pay for the meals online, kids don't have to take cash to school, the amount per day is capped, and I get to see online what they've ordered. It's a great system.

I meant to add, my DS's school also does this.

oliversmumsarmy My family are also alive. What did you mean by that? Are you under some kind of threat?

EVERYONE has something to hide - and it's not necessarily bad.

Well, I meant in regards to criminal activity that harms others. Not daft non-legal stuff like whether someone’s having an affair or has a fetish for rubber 😂

I might be paranoid but paranoia has kept my family alive.

My family are alive what are you on about oliversmummy do you live in north korea ?

I might be paranoid but paranoia has kept my family alive

What? 😅

Government already have my finger prints and dna etc can’t really see the harm in a school system using finger print for lunches. Some people need to take off their tin foil hats.

Yet another thread with so many people sleepwalking into a totalitarian dystopia!