Aibu to tell her that she needs to do a full shift.

[DawnFawn]

Hi,

Posting here for traffic to see I'd any managers/HR gurus knocking about.

I am a fairly new manager, I have been managing a department for about 2 months and all is running pretty well, however, I have an issue with a member off staff that I cant get my head around.

Let's call her Linda, she started under a previous manager who was a friend of hers. She doesn't drive and lives about 15 miles away with not great/not horrendous public transport links.

For about 18 months she got a lift to and from work with manager friend. But since manager friend left she was able to finish work earlier than the rest of the team, to get a lift home with another member of staff who finishes earlier. The stand in manager allowed this for an easy ride.

So......(thankyou if you are still reading)
In I come as a department manager, there is a festering resentment with team members that colleague is going home early, and it shouldn't be allowed. I totally agree but how do I stop this? She doesn't have any children, and doesn't require flexible working as such.

Would I be a bitch to say that she needs to be making her own way home? I'll allow a degree of flexibilty in the mornings, she can start 15 minutes later as this is when her lift arrives at the office, but she needs to finish with the rest of the team? Does she have any rights to say that she has been doing this for a while and should be allowed to continue?

Her working hours do fall under custom and practice due to the length of time they have been in place. Also, she is paid less than your other workers. Do they know this? Flexible working hours are good for companies as well as employees. If she has specific goals for each shift I'd give her the opportunity to increase output. Being rigid is not a good look if the situation allows for flexibility.

I do think the flipside is that of sustainable transport. I've worked in places with limited parking where they constantly bang on about alternatives to driving to work yet management won't consider any flexibility to allow someone to ride share or get public transport.

You should at least consider if there are alternatives to just putting your foot down regarding the hours

I agree with PP - I can't see what this worker is doing wrong.

She is only paid for the actual hours she works. This current way of working has been agreed between her and her employer. If the other team members don't like it then that's tough really. They sound petty. If they come moaning to you again I would suggest they put in a flexible working request if they wish to change their hours. The shifts/hours other staff do is none of their business.

You need to be assertive here OP as a new manager, but you are looking at it from the wrong angle and I suspect your HR advisor will agree.

I saw this as 'a full shit'!! 😂🤣😂

I know there's already been a tonne of responses to this thread, but I cannot believe what I'm reading from most posters about it being fine that she does this!

I also work in the retail sector (currently off work on maternity), and I completely understand your frustration @DawnFawn

The reality of the situation is you have three people on set contracts. These contracts are set at the optimum level of hours where the business is willing to pay and the daily duties will get completed to a high standard. If someone consistently leaves early across the week, while in terms of a wage budget it isn't going to affect you, in terms of store performance and morale, it most definitely will.

No matter what way you look at it, 5 hours of work still needs filled across the morning shifts. Due to the nature of when she arrives and leaves work, it's a 5 hour occupancy that is impossible to fill. You cannot employ someone else to work for one hour a day. It is also incredibly unfair that two other members of staff, disregarding how senior they may be, have to pick up her slack and work harder on their shifts while not earning extra money to compensate for this.

I'm struggling to see how some users aren't getting how annoying and demoralising this is. Imagine you go into work and on your team of 3, you have to work on 9 projects a day. Your shift time allows you to properly focus and work on 3 projects each and complete them to a high standard, without being stressed out. Now, imagine one of your team members starts leaving work early and comes in late. Suddenly, due to this, you and your other team member have 4 projects each to work on a day. You're stressed under the extra workload and you aren't getting any monetary benefit to doing this. All you see is your co-worker stroll in, do less work than you, and exit, leaving you to pick up the slack. It doesn't matter that she's being paid less than you, what matters is she is supposed to be an equal member and she's leaving you in the shit every day. Her behaviour also means it is nigh on impossible for you to ever leave work early because then only one person is working the shift.

@DawnFawn I'm aware that you're going to contact HR and get their take on things which is great, but if at all possible I'd be working to make sure she works her contracted hours or if she does want to work less hours, make sure she's bunching them up and then hire someone else on a PT basis one day a week (annoying but at least you'd have another valuable member of staff in training to act as a replacement if necessary because she doesn't seem reliable- a student or similar would be great for this).

And to those who are sympathising with her travel predicament, seriously? She is an adult, it is up to her to make her own way to work. Many people don't drive, they either learn to drive or take public transport. If the public transport links aren't good in the area, people take Ubers/taxis, or lift share so they get to work before their shift starts. She should not have accepted a job in an area if she could not make her own way to work on time. It's sheer laziness and I'm mortified other managers let her away with it for so long, especially leaving work early! I'd forgive 15 minutes if she stayed an extra 15 minutes, but honestly what is it to me if it takes her longer to get home? That's her problem, not mine- plenty of people commute for hours, it's fairly normal in England so I really don't get why she gets special treatment.

I get your point choc but don't forget, The Employer has agreed this so the employee is doing nothing wrong.

I am not sure there is a lot you can do unless you push her to leave and it would be a compromise agreement.

She is working less hours and gets paid less accordingly. This is a contracted change, someone has agreed it and adjusted her pay accordingly.

Just because she has this deal does not it is available for anyone else, for the reasons given - the business can not support it.

Dors the shift have to be 07:00-14:00? If it's tied in to cafe opening times or something, then yes, it probably does, but in my role, while I'm contracted 09:00-17:30, that's rarely the actual hours I work, and as long as I do 40h a week and am there for meetings, no one cares that much about the actual start and finish times, but of course, not all roles are like that. But there may be options for more flexible ways of working, and if it turns out she is covered by a previous flexible working agreement or custom & practice, you may need to think more creatively around these options to make things work.

If she's considered junior, I assume her hourly rate is lower than the other two? So that could also justify why she isn't there to do end of shift tasks, alongside only being paid for the hours she works.

But also, if you have to wait 45 minutes for the next bus, well, so do lots of people. Use the time to read a book, or learn a language or something.

Can you not just ask around and ask if someone wants to do an extra five hours assuming it's retail or service i think the young students would be biting your hand off? Plus it's good to have cross training \cover etc - little teams can get very bitchy and set in their ways.

Otherwise it just looks a bit petty - so what if she's got a partner who is on a good income and can afford part time ? If team resents this they should manage their own finances better or apply for shift changes themselves .

I think it's relevant that she doesn't need this job for the money. She's doing it because she enjoys it and that's important. She took the job under circumstances where she did not need to use public transport. That has now changed. Having to use public transport would probably increase her travel time to a point where she doesn't want to work this job. Frankly, it possibly doesn't pay enough. That's her prerogative.

OP, part of this decision should be based on how good she is at what she does. Fits she bring any skills the others don't, and which may be hard to replace?

I say this as where I work currently I have pretty much dictated my hours based on being over qualified and bringing skills which other staff don't have (they have many skills I don't have too). I'm not paid enough for them to mess me about with my hours, so if it was inconvenient I'd leave. That would be a loss to me and my workplace, but there are other things I would not want to sacrifice and this works for me currently.

Are you any closer to coming up with a plan OP?

It depends too if she's working through her lunch to compensate. Check her contract and have an informal meeting initially to explore options

Sounds like a tough situation, OP. As you've concluded, though, you can't afford to lose Janet and George which is a distinct possibility if the resentment is allowed to fester.

Does she have a formal flexible working arrangement? If not, I would tell her that you've noticed that she doesn't work the hours that the rest of the team does and that you expect her to do so until a formal arrangement is agreed; she must apply for this. If there is one in place, you (the company) are well within your rights to review it. So review it. It is Linda's responsibility to make sure that she gets to and from work, the same way it is for any employee anywhere else. It's unfortunate that previous managers have allowed this to continue and that really is down to poor line management. If Linda is unable/unwilling to make her own travel arrangements (an hour each way is half of my travel time every day!) then she will need to make that decision.

Linda may decide to leave if her FWA is not agreed; that's a risk that any line manager takes. However, 6 weeks or so pain for long term stability in the team and increased productivity may be a price worth paying!

Also any employee can give notice or go off sick at any time, so it's sensible to come up with as robust a plan as possible for that eventuality.

Are you saying she is only paid for the time she actually works.? If so and as this seems to be an arrangement she has had for some time I don't see how you can now say she can not do this.
If she is working the hours she is paid for and is part time the moans from the other staff members are not her fault, but it looks as though you might need more staff.

Just to add: if the problem is specifically that she gets to avoid some unpopular tasks, could you arrange that some of these be done earlier in the day? I do think you need to discuss this with HR, as we on Mumsnet don't even know what kind of a job it is, let alone what the contract was or what the general rules are. One point, however: I do think that, whatever the rights or wrongs of the matter, you have to avoid making decisions just on the basis of whether some other employees are moaning, or (a) people will just come to the conclusion that the louder they moan, the more likely they are to get their own way; and (b) it could very easily lead to a form of workplace bullying, where other employees gang up on unpopular colleagues, while popular ones get away with anything. It occurs to me that the real problem here may be that employees who have to work at this job for a living may resent someone who is supported by a partner and is doing the job out of choice. In some ways such resentment may be only natural, but it should not be the basis for decisions about her (or anyone's) work conditions. I'm not saying that this employee's current work conditions are fair or justifiable - and we don't have enough information on Mumsnet to know one way or the other; just that decisions should not be based mainly on other employees' resentments and complaints.

Tbh when I first saw this post ...I read it as "expect her to do a full shit"

I wasn't wearing my glasses- honestly 🙄

Yanbu

I am a retail manager and I would say absolutely not, if she is working less hours she earns less money, simple as that. Sometimes you do have to give and take a little for example she could start early and finish early providing the needs of the business are still being met but really how she gets to and from work is not your problem it's hers.

ddl1
Excellent points.

I wish everyone would read the thread.

She has an agreement in place now to work the shorter hours paid accordingly. It was agreed with previous manager. it's been running 18 months, if I understand correctly.

If the business can't manage with this, OP needs to recruit someone, or ask the person to go back full time, which she could say no to.

OP needs to manage Janet & George so it's not seen as all Linda's fault - it's not.

Janet and George have a grievance with OP as they have to do crap stuff at the end of each shift. If they aren't having to stay late, and they can get it done in the time, then it is a management question. Can they be given something extra, a bonus, vouchers, extra day off?