To not let my daughter go?

[Gooseygoosey12345]

My DDs dad wants to take her to Spain in the summer holidays. Now I know that this is lovely, but I just don't trust him to look after her properly. He normally has her one night a week and she comes back and her hair isn't brushed, she's in the clothes she went in, I highly doubt she's brushing her teeth when she's there and they eat takeaway every time. He's also not the most responsible person with regards to keeping an eye on her. She's nearly 9. She should probably be responsible for brushing her own hair etc but I suspect dyspraxia so she struggles with things like this. Would I be unreasonable to say no? I don't want to take the opportunity away from her but I'm worried about letting her go. She absolutely adores her dad and he does try his best but he's more concerned with being fun than being responsible. She's also not a strong swimmer so I'd be worried about swimming pools/the sea.

@Gooseygoosey12345 maybe just let her know that it's ok to ask dad for help? I know it sounds silly but she might think that because he's a man he won't know how to do hair (and he may well have said as much previously). Just let her know that she can always ask him for help and let him know that she struggles. He probably hasn't even realised that she finds it difficult.

I know you shouldn't HAVE to tell him how to look after her but if he doesn't have help from anyone else he might just need it pointing out to him

Tricky one. I agree, it's about water safety and common sense. You know he won't be on high alert like you will be and DD does not sound like a strong swimmer with the dyspraxia.

How is she in general, near water? Has she struggled before at the beach or water park? Does she wear swimming aids for it?

The only options I can think is:
a) put some ground rules in for them both about water
or
b) Suggest somewhere in the UK (e.g a forest holiday) for now and focus on building up DD's skill and strength for next year.
or
c) you go with them. That only works if it's amicable and you have the cash to pay for yourself! Two of my friends do this for this their younger kids: they arrange to stay in the same holiday complex (with their respective partners) and share the care. The children stay with their mother overnight and go with their father in the daytime.

I would say no. If he isn’t responsible enough here, then on holiday he might be more relaxed, have had a glass of wine or two, and be less than vigilant around water etc. A friend’s child drowned in a pool on holiday so that colours my view.
Would they be part of a group or just the two of them ?

As others have said I think YABU as well.

Can I ask, has anything happened in the past to suggest that your ex would just sit there ignoring your DD if she were having trouble in a swimming pool or the sea?

There's a big difference between "not being a strong swimmer" and not being able to swim at all.

Everyone has different standards and styles of parenting and you do need to accept that your ex is not you but he is still DD's dad and is entitled to parent in the way that he wants (with the proviso, of course, that he doesn't neglect or abuse her).

You appear to have quite an amicable relationship with your ex, I wonder if you making this such a big issue might harm that relationship and make things more difficult as DD grows up.

You are being very unreasonable. She fell in a canal, so you've decided he's not bothered about water safety? Kids have accidents. It happens. Has she really never had a single accident with you? How would you feel about your ex dragging up one accident, and deciding that means you can't be trusted to take her on holiday? Would you feel that was a proportionate response?

Your daughter should be able to brush her own hair. If it's too long arrange to have it cut. Sign her up for swimming lessons. When she's a competent swimmers then allow her to go on holiday with her dad.

Mrsabc has a good couple of options.
I would have a chat with her dad and put some ground rules in place.
You say she adores him, and given that it would be a shame to stop her having the holiday. By not letting her go she will be the one you will be hurting most.

What’s DD like? Quite sensible or a bit of a dreamer?

Hair/food/clothes wouldn’t overly bother me, certainly not to the point of stopping her going

Safety - if I could trust her to be sensible ( not let your Dad out if your site at the beach/shops etc and to let a lifeguard know she’s swimming alone etc thennid ket her go, but if she’s a dreamer unable to look after herself then I’d be hesitant depending on where they’re going/what his plans are

She fell in a canal?!?!?!

I'd be booking her on an intensive Improve your Swimming course then let her go.

Is this correct? That a mother has the right of veto for a holiday organised by the child's father because she worries that he won't parent to her standards?
If there is no official record of the father not taking due care with his daughter, it seems wholly inappropriate for the mother to make the decision to say no. Do you really have the legal right to say no?

I would consider the main carers opinion over a parent who had a kid over night once a week the childs welfare must come first this isn't about mothers vetoing fathers.

I think yabvu. He is her dad and to be honest many men tend to be a bit riskier and don’t tend to wrap kids in cotton wool as much as mums do. Plus you can’t say for sure an accident couldn’t happen on your watch.

I think you should write each of them a “nagging list” of your concerns so that she is aware you expect her to be responsible for her personal hygiene ( she is nearly hitting puberty so this is not unreasonable) ...and to be wary of her own personal safety ( ie stay in shallow end unless he is at arms length ) .

Plus a list for him of all your worries.. then it’s over to him to parent as is his right and responsibility.

You know one of the best things we can do for our children is to allow them a little independence from us.

Let her go.

I wouldn't be happy about it either but not sure you can stop him?
I feel very anxious about this type of thing too. Could you suggest she's a bit young and say 3 - 5 days closer to home and if all good agree to it next year?
Does your dd want to go?

But hopefully it wouldn't come to 'You can't stop me'

I would send a nice message saying that's an amazing idea but for DD's sake what you'd suggest is a week in the uk together first, even just a week at his, so that you and he can see how she is being away for a whole week (as she hasn't done so before). That way if she gets homesick or has had enough after four days or so you'll both know that it's probably best to give it another year until you spend £££ on a foreign holiday.

It's a sensible idea regardless of any concerns op might have. If she's not spent a whole week with her dad yet, they both should get experience of doing so pre-hols.

Oops! That's a lot of replies. I'll try to respond as best I can

I think his girlfriend would probably be going which is a good thing. She's generally more responsible than him and DD likes her.
DD can tread water but not for ages and would panic if she went under.
I'd love to go but DH won't get the time off now.
Someone asked would he ignore her if she were struggling. Obviously he wouldn't, but I'd be concerned if he'd notice.
I have no problem with him parenting differently to me or how he wants to (I don't like certain things but I don't say anything as it's all minor), like you say he's her parent too but that doesn't mean that I have to trust him to keep her safe.
@SlightlyMisplacedSingleDad don't be ridiculous, it's not the only accident that could have been avoided but I'm not going to list them. He didn’t even inform me, my DD did. I have never let her fall in a canal or not supervised her appropriately. He’d be hard pressed to bring up anything where you could say I wasn’t watching or paying attention to the point it put her safety at risk.
DD is a bit of a dreamer, I think I’d feel better if she was a bit older and could look out for herself a bit better.
She did have swimming lessons previously but didn’t make any improvements so lost interest.
@mrsmuddlepies this has nothing to do with the “legalities”. We have not been to court for anything so it’s a mutual agreement with regards to our daughter. I ONLY care about her safety, not whether I’m being nice.
I don’t wrap my DD in cotton wool, as much as it might sound like it. And I get that dads are generally happier to take risks. And I’m really not saying an accident wouldn’t happen on my watch, of course it could, but my issue is that I’d be aware of said accident. I’m not convinced he would.
It wouldn’t come to “you can’t stop me”. We don’t have that kind of relationship. I think if I said I’d rather she didn’t this time he’d probably agree that I know what’s best but obviously be very disappointed.

I'm really not trying to be an arsehole. I don't want to take any opportunities away from DD but not at the cost of her safety. I would never forgive myself or him if anything happened. And of course it's worse abroad, I can't just jump in my car and go to her if she's out of the country. It's like I wouldn't put it past him letting her walk back to the room by herself which I would 100% not be ok with.

I appreciate all of the comments and I think I'll speak to DDs dad and suggest that they holiday in the UK first. I'll also suggest a week of intensive swimming lessons and attempt to get DD to manage her hair.

@IdblowJonSnow yes I think she does want to go but she doesn't seem overly excited so I'm wondering if she's a bit worried about going for that long, I don't think she'd say though as she wouldn't want to hurt his feelings

I appreciate all of the comments and I think I'll speak to DDs dad and suggest that they holiday in the UK first. I'll also suggest a week of intensive swimming lessons and attempt to get DD to manage her hair.

I think that's a good idea, sometimes you have to listen to your gut on these things

Thank you @AryaStarkWolf trying to keep everyone happy and myself sane is a nightmare! I think that's reasonable enough? Unless he does those things then wants to take her to Spain this year as well, I'll probably be ok knowing she can swim, manage her hair and that I can have a good chat with her about being responsible for herself too about not going anywhere that she can't see her dad/he can't see her

Could she go for a shorter time somewhere closer to home ? I think if he is careless about safety though, I would be talking to him about that, and not letting her stay away with him until he can be more vigilant.

@SirVixofVixHall oh we've definitely had words about his "laid back" parenting style, I think it would be best to do exactly as you've said and go for a shorter time closer to home