17 year old girl legally euthanised [trigger warning] ***MNHQ note that the details of this story are disputed***

[Notabedofroses]

I am quite shocked reading that a depressed young girl called Noa Pothoven of just seventeen has just been legally euthanised by doctors in the Netherlands.

She was not terminally ill, nor was she brain dead or in a coma for twenty five year.

She was in fact depressed and anorexic.

She was raped as a child, and became depressed and had PTSD.

I can not help but feel she has been massively failed in every single way, how can it be that the doctors gave up on her? She was seventeen, and could have eventually found her way out of the darkness that is teen depression with the right help and support.

What message does it give to other teens? That the easiest way out is to die?

Many many of us are survivors of tragedies, many of us have had serious eating disorders, depression and suicidal thoughts/attempts. Those very same people have gone on to have wonderful, successful and fulfilling lives, but now she will never ever get the chance to turn this around for herself.

I can not stress how much I disagree with euthanising a child of seventeen for depression and anorexia.

Thoughts anyone?

This is quite shocking. I am generally pro euthanasia and never bought into the slippery slope argument but this makes me reconsider my position.

Me too, I supported euthanasia until the moment I read about this, not now. Not after this.

Playing devil's advocate for a second, isn't it possible that some mental health conditions are 'terminal' (or at least chronic in the sense that the damage cannot always be healed and the person might never live a happy life again).

This is a wider musing and I think 17 years old is probably too soon to have made that judgement, but there does always seem to be this belief that whatever mental health condition someone has, it can be healed and I'm not sure that's always true. Just as some physical conditions are incurable and lead to poor quality of life, I think some mental health conditions probably are too.

I agree to a point celebelly that some mental health conditions are for life, but at seventeen who has the right to decide that it is 'terminal' in her case? Seventeen?!

It is possible to live with most mental health problems, even the very worst ones. Surely it was not the right of any doctor to remove that chance at her darkest hour?

No; this is horrific. I am pro euthanasia, or so I thought. This has blurred some lines.

Why couldn't anyone help her?

And if you are killing seventeen year old girls for being depressed where it the cut off? Is that going to be the cure all for every problem our teens are having?

I actually think it is outrageous, and can't believe they allowed it to happen.

I was just amazed about that.

Appalling at that age - What a shame there was no-one to help her through that. What a terrible life the poor girl must have had.

I don't think choosing to end your own life is wrong necessarily, but personally, I think there should be a minimum age, and it wouldn't be 17.

Indeed, the flood gates have been opened. This is the beginning of hell.

I’m shocked they allow it from the age of 12 years old, it’s absolutely shocking to think a young child can chose to end their life

Surely there HAS to be some legal protection for children and teenagers? Why was the case not taken to court, it only required two doctors to decide nothing more could be done for her?!

How the fuck can nothing more be done for her at seventeen??

She didn't have terminal cancer or some other god forsaken illness, she was suffering from something very common, depression and an eating disorder.

I completely agree with you OP. This has really disturbed me.

There was another case last year I think, where a woman in her early 20s did this. I couldn’t get my head around that, but this, at 17 years old is even worse.

I shudder at the thought of my own daughters learning that this is an acceptable way to deal with depression.

OP, I completely agree with you. I am pro euthanasia but am totally shocked by this story, this is not what euthanasia should be for.

How very sad, that poor girl. What a fucking waste.

It is possible to keep force people with even the most severe mental health issues to stay alive, but I'm not sure its the right course of action, unless there is hope of relief.

I'm not talking directly about this case because I don't have the facts but mental anguish is a very real thing. If someone told you you'd be in agonising physical pain for the rest of your life, is that a life that you'd want? What about if they'd tell you you'd be agonising pain for 10 years but then it would get better? Would you choose that?

At 17, of course there is hope of relief. Maybe not a guarantee, but surely hope?

I NC as might be quite outing to anyone who knows the story as I tell it quite often. I live in the Netherlands and work with Dutch people. There's a mental asylum not far from where I live and two years ago there were lots of suicides involving trains on a nearby commuter line. I asked the question and was explained that 'it is your right to want to die' and other people should not intervene. Therefore, depression is generally not medicated and I lost a friend to a PND (she, too, walked in front of a train) as it is not really a recognized condition. I think it is a cultural thing and they are firm believers in nature running its course and doing what nature does (which is to kill human race).

I agree that the example in the OP is horrific though.

The only acceptable way to deal with teen depression and eating disorder is counselling, therapy, medication, support and love, and not let them know you are never ever ever giving up on them.

As the mother of a young woman who did try to kill herself around this age and is now living a productive and happy life THANKS TO APPROPRIATE MEDICAL CARE I find this deeply disturbing.

And Celebelly's argument that her illness was not curable perhaps the most disturbing part of the lot.

Dd's MH issues are not curable. She will probably have to live with them for the rest of her life. Just like she will have to live with her chronic joint condition- that isn't curable either. But as long as she has access to the medication and the reasonable adaption she needs, they are bearable. .

I could very easily see how this argument could end up in an attempt to classify MH disorders into once-and-for-all-curable (we treat those) and not-curable (have you ever thought that maybe your life isn't worth living....)

When dd was standing on that ledge and was going to jump, she changed her mind. (It was too late and she fell- thankfully not fatally). Imagine how difficult it would be to change your mind after the whole medical circus is already up and running, you have made your farewells, the journalists are standing by to write about your brave decision etc etc.

This case is just horrendous- that poor girl and her loved ones
I am in support of legalised euthanasia but this case really disturbed me too. 17 really is no age. She should’ve been given more support and I think there should be a minimum age to make that kind of decision- certainly a lot older than 17. However, had she not had this dignified death, she may very well have resorted to more violent methods like slitting her wrists or hanging herself. Poor thing.

I disagree, I believe the age is too young to make that decision. I know many people struggling when teens with mental health issues and absolutely fine as adults. In the end it states she was starving herself.

Having experienced the agony of depression at 17, I'd say she's lucky to have the option to end her life peacefully. She doesn't have to suffer any longer, how wonderful. If I had been allowed to die peacefully as a teenager, I could have saved myself over 20 years of misery, pain and repeated suicide attempts.

@notabedofroses I think that its the whole point yes she could continue living with this condition, but she would be suffering the whole time, its sort of a life of suffering is more intolerable, I understand her anorexia was very extreme and she had given up all eating and drinking, so was kept alive with a tube.

I feel so sorry for her family.

I absolutely hate this decision but I can only assume she really did persuade the medical doctors ,it has to be two separate ones, that her life would be a life of suffering.

the Dutch laws are somewhat at odds with what we ( well what I ) view as ethical euthanasia, I have some third hand experience where a good friend and neighbour of a relative went this option, when only 62 as she had arthritis, sure she could live with the condition, and had many friends and a good social life, so I didn't understand her decision, nor did my relative as he said she was not infirm, but her argument was her world was reducing, shrinking becoming more house bound- she lived in an Amsterdam apartment no lift, that daily she was restricted which caused her mental anguish, and that the condition would spread and over time her suffering increase, that it was intolerable that she had to endure this life maybe for 20 years.

I think this is more to do with not understanding mental health conditions properly or attempting to treat them rather than a slippery slope.

I’m at the other end of that slope, I have a chance of developing a debilitating disease which will take up to 25 years to rob me of my sanity, dignity and end in paralysis, all costing thousands in care. I wish the option of euthanasia was open to me but it isn’t. So the “slippery slope” hasn’t even tipped.

Mental anguish is horrendous, but it is not a permanent state. There is always a chance, however small, of relief in some form in the future. And at seventeen it is far too early to make that kind of decision.

To me, this is state sponsored murder. It is nothing short of that. She was not in her right mind to make such a huge decision herself. How could she be?

I travel to the Netherlands regularly for work, and for a civilised western country they have some very outdated ideas of mental health care, and indeed just generally, how can they ever think this is okay?

Ok. Some people are just reading headlines. I am desperately sad by this but it's not true that she was euthanised. She Committed suicide.
She choose to stop eating or drinking and the decision was made not to force feed her.
That's not the same as killing her. It's just not.

Beach she had stopped eating and drinking prior to being euthanised I believe.